I don't know about you all, but I can't possibly see how the books/movies could be any more enjoyable than the snark it inspires. I have not seen either movie, and I've only read two paragraphs out of one book (on Amazon.com, and only out of curiosity, and nearly gave myself a coronary I laughed so hard), but I can read reviews and critiques of the franchise for hours. It just brings out the snark in so many, and some of the snark is so good as to be practically virtuoso. I would read the books and watch the movies, but I fear they'll never live up to my expectations at this point.
Well I recently discovered that the blonde male Vampire Council dude is a friend's brother, who has absolutely no acting experience, but is absurdly good looking. Someone walked up to him at a ski lodge, where he was busy being a ski bum, and said something to the effect of, 'You're absurdly good looking, would you like to be in New Moon'? The saddest part is he has no acting ambition, whereas his brother has spent years trying to break into acting.
So that's the quality of actor we're looking at here!
someones been sippin on some haterade. i dont care what these reviews say, i am dying to see this and was absolutely crushed when i couldnt find anyone willing to go with me to midnight showing last night. i never squeed all over anything like this when i was a teenage girl, so im going to do it now. and i get to test my skills as a psychoanalyst.
What I find ironic is the people that feel the need to defend the film by saying, "Of course it's going to be a bad movie, but that's what I expect." These people, and the director who put out this POS, are the ones who are actually insulting the intelligence of Twilight fans. They are assuming that fans will be so rabid that they can not recognize a bad film when they see it.
Were the books simple? Yes, but also strangely engrossing and compelling. The fans of the book DESERVE a good film. They DESERVE a film that does justice to the source material they love so much. They DESERVE good acting, and dialog and costuming and they deserve a director that actually cares about giving them a good movie going experience.
To dismiss the critiques of the film by saying, "Well what did you expect," is to imply that the books, and fans of the books, don't deserve a good film and wouldn't know one if they saw it.
@bess marvin, girl detective: Honestly, I love film so much. Good movies are such a joy to watch, whether they horror or comedy or drama or sci-fi, and they are extremely hard to find in this day and age.
It enrages me when a terrible film not only makes money but is actually championed by the masses. It's like rewarding idiocy.
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: I'd agree. And to be frank, even though I don't care for the content (I'd be harsher than say it's "simple" :}) they do deserve that.
Personally, having seen the first one, I think the actors did the best they could. All of them are quite capable in other movies, and at least in the first one, did what they could with the source material. They can't make bad writing good, but they did seem sincere. If it's worse this time around, I'm going with blaming the director.
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: The thing is, the book was pretty bad. Engrossing, yes, but Meyers writes in a really heady, internal way that's near-impossible to transfer to the screen. So much of what she writes is happening inside Bella's mind. And Bella's mind spends this entire book borderline suicidal.
To make a good movie, they'd have to majorly alter the storyline, or create lots of new content. A ten-page description of a depressed girl's view of a forest might be strangely compelling in written word, but once you've put the book down and thought about the storyline -- it sucked. A lot.
After the mess he made of The Golden Compass, I don't know why this guy was even given the chance to direct again. Oh wait. He's a guy. They have a better understanding of CGI-driven fantasy, right? I forgot.
@Diziet_Sma: After what he did to The Golden Compass, an excellent book, how could people possibly think he would make a good film from New Moon, which is just a descent book?
@Diziet_Sma: except the Golden Compass was huge overseas and made a ton of money. Of course Mirimax didn't see any of that money since they sold the overseas rights.
@Lincolnsbeard33: I'm not talking Box Office; I'm talking directing talent. I'm sure New Moon is going to make shitloads of money; but I'm also sure that if Catherine Hardwicke had directed it, it would be a better movie and still make shitloads of money - maybe more money.
And anyway, if the argument is, he was given the movie because The Golden Compass took $372 million, bear in mind the production budget was $180 million; Twilight cost less than a quarter of that ($37 million) and took more ($385 million) worldwide.
And yeah, Hardwicke is no Jane Campion, but she at least understands narrative structure, can talk to actors (Thirteen, Lords Of Dogtown) and knows decent CGI when she sees it; none of which can be said for Chris Weitz, according to these reviews and his work on The Golden Compass.
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: Yeah, he ruined the Golden Compass, and that's one hell of a book. It broke my heart that it was so bad and bombed at the cinema!
@Her Grace: I did like Serafina. She looked pretty on-target. The ending made me scream with rage. Looks like someone thinks kids can't handle tragedy.
And I love Will transcendently, so I'm actually somewhat glad it didn't go on to a second film. Because if he'd been cast wrong, or cast right and then dropped in dreck, it would've broken my heart.
@limber: I agree, so much. Also, I don't think I could have handled the movie audience outrage over how TAS ends (especially the part with the 13 year old sexing).
@Her Grace: Oh, no, not the teenage, practically Biblical sexing! Then again, it might cause enough aneurisms that they'd forget about Gay Angels and what happens to that man in the chariot. And we'd all be better off.
God, I love those books. I love Mary Malone! I love Will, I love Lyra, and one day someone will figure out how to make a movie that adequately captures the awesome, but I'll be long dust by then, because it is that good. I guess I'll just have to make do with Will being unbelievably fierce in my head all the time. My affliction's very severe, I can't make an omelet without hearing Pullman's description.
(I cannot wait for the Book of Dust, by the way. Even though it's not remotely done yet.)
Ok, reviews aside, here is my question. The movie makers worked really hard to convince men to go see this movie ("Werewolves! Action!"), even showing ads during Monday night football, which just made my friend laugh. I don't think men bought any advance tickets for the movie, YET it broke the record for Star Wars. The first movie broke box office records, too.
SO. Why do they care about making men go to this movie? If women movie goers can break records on their own, isn't that good enough? Are women's dollars too pink? A dollar from a woman is still worth 100 pennies, just like from a man, even if woman only get paid 76cents compared to men. Why is an audience somehow more worthy if it is full of penii?
@mommy_dearest: I suppose because why have a dollar from a woman when you can have a dollar from a woman and a dollar from a man? They probably figure they've got the female dollar locked up, so it couldn't hurt to try to expand their audience (and thus their paying customer base).
It's the same as "holiday" ads that are aimed at people beyond those celebrating Christmas and Hanukkah. They don't actually care about including other religions and the non-religious - they just want to bring in as many customers as possible.
Why, I feel the same way about this movie as I did about Revenge of the Sith: The Geek in me Weeps. I saw Sith with serious Star Wars nerds, and my honest opinion was not so welcome at the end.
Thus I see that as a cosmic sign I should stay far, far away from the theaters on this one.
More seriously, I am sad that Chris Weitz could not save this; I adore "About a Boy", and believe he is a very talented director.
I hope that this post gets flooded by pink first timers' comments full of run on sentences praising the merits of "New Moon" and claming that we are all stupid haters. Please, please, please. I want it to rain trolls.
@Meangirl.is.for.the.Horde: I was talking to a dear friend the other day and we determined that "writing a book" is no longer a mark of intelligence. It's often a mark of exactly the opposite. Otherwise, how can you explain Dan Brown?
@morninggloria: I feel like the problem isn't the authors so much as the audience. Dan Brown is a perfectly serviceable mystery writer. Out of the context of the fans and the controversy, The Da Vinci Code is sort of a goofy, improbable historical mystery that never should have been taken seriously. It's beach reading. It's the literary equivalent of National Treasure - fun but forgettable and a perfect thing to watch wasted or hung over. The problem comes when the audience insists its something bigger and better than it really is.
To quote Mick la Salle of the San Francisco Chronicle:
"Let's just say it: It's great there's a movie that makes teenage girls scream. Half the movies Hollywood makes are designed to make teenage boys scream, and those boy movies are just as ridiculous and a lot nastier than 'New Moon.'"
I will cheerfully take Twilight and New Moon over Transformers any day of the week.
(Granted, he didn't say that it was actually any good.)
@la.donna.pietra: Plus, this directly flys in the face of the claim that women only want romcoms. It maybe be horror lite, but it's still horror. Or that we won't spend a SHIT TON on something we really love.
Do I like that it's this? No. But, on the flip side, I'm not delusional enough to think quality has anything to do with popularity. And yeah..I HATED the TF movies (racist robots, wtf?) and though this predictable and deribative...it's an original work. Not a toy franchise.
@LexiD523: Not really. They marketed Jennifer's Body to men, knowing that something like 60% more women watch horror. But they'll still make something like Captivity, which didn't do well. "Accepting" and being aware of the numbers are not the same. They forget every time a movie like Resident Evil does well that that part of the reason is the strong female lead. Plus, as I said, this is horror lite.
I wouldn't hold your breath. The idea that girls don't like superheroes is really firmly entrenched. It's not true, but, they'll insist on it until they die.
@Mnemosyne: There is, you'll need to go search movie stats, though. It's an accepted bit of info, though, that marketers know, even if they don't actually listen to it all the time.
I think people want to believe it's not true because horror is all oogy and stuff. But it also has a lot of "Last girl standing" characters and stories where women get to be the hero in the end. I think that's enormously appealing for women.
@WaltzingMatilda: No. It's true though, the first movie was a guilty pleasure.
This next one, I'm a little nervous watching those underage abs. I mean, Edward doesn't do it for me, so what's left? Abs.
@Tiger_Eye: You need tennis. All the really beautiful men are over 18.
(IMO, all the really really beautiful men, like Roger, and Rafa, and the French team's senior membership, and Marat, whose retirement I'm mourning, are all over 21, but that's just me.)
This seems to get at the heart of it: "[the critics] clearly resented the fact that they'll flock to the film regardless of what the reviews say". Hehe.
Expect an eruption in the theater during the scene in which a thrill-seeking Bella wrecks the motorcycle Jacob rebuilt for her and he strips off his T-shirt to tend her bleeding head. From that point on, his torso remains so central a character it should be given its own credit line.
Expect an eruption? Is that an entendre? Should I be quivering with anticipation? Is the buildup tense?
11/21/09
11/20/09
So that's the quality of actor we're looking at here!
11/20/09
TEAM CEDWARD.
11/20/09
Were the books simple? Yes, but also strangely engrossing and compelling. The fans of the book DESERVE a good film. They DESERVE a film that does justice to the source material they love so much. They DESERVE good acting, and dialog and costuming and they deserve a director that actually cares about giving them a good movie going experience.
To dismiss the critiques of the film by saying, "Well what did you expect," is to imply that the books, and fans of the books, don't deserve a good film and wouldn't know one if they saw it.
11/20/09
11/20/09
It enrages me when a terrible film not only makes money but is actually championed by the masses. It's like rewarding idiocy.
11/20/09
Personally, having seen the first one, I think the actors did the best they could. All of them are quite capable in other movies, and at least in the first one, did what they could with the source material. They can't make bad writing good, but they did seem sincere. If it's worse this time around, I'm going with blaming the director.
11/20/09
To make a good movie, they'd have to majorly alter the storyline, or create lots of new content. A ten-page description of a depressed girl's view of a forest might be strangely compelling in written word, but once you've put the book down and thought about the storyline -- it sucked. A lot.
11/21/09
It's like rewarding idiocy.
Which we 21st century Americans have elevated to an art form.
11/20/09
11/20/09
And scene.
11/20/09
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11/20/09
And anyway, if the argument is, he was given the movie because The Golden Compass took $372 million, bear in mind the production budget was $180 million; Twilight cost less than a quarter of that ($37 million) and took more ($385 million) worldwide.
11/20/09
Oh god no the first director was horrible. She has no sense of pacing the acting was laughable at best, it was just awful.
11/20/09
And yeah, Hardwicke is no Jane Campion, but she at least understands narrative structure, can talk to actors (Thirteen, Lords Of Dogtown) and knows decent CGI when she sees it; none of which can be said for Chris Weitz, according to these reviews and his work on The Golden Compass.
11/20/09
11/20/09
wait are you a troll? Cause there is no way you could think that Catherine Hardwicke can do narrative.
11/20/09
11/20/09
11/20/09
And I love Will transcendently, so I'm actually somewhat glad it didn't go on to a second film. Because if he'd been cast wrong, or cast right and then dropped in dreck, it would've broken my heart.
11/20/09
11/21/09
God, I love those books. I love Mary Malone! I love Will, I love Lyra, and one day someone will figure out how to make a movie that adequately captures the awesome, but I'll be long dust by then, because it is that good. I guess I'll just have to make do with Will being unbelievably fierce in my head all the time. My affliction's very severe, I can't make an omelet without hearing Pullman's description.
(I cannot wait for the Book of Dust, by the way. Even though it's not remotely done yet.)
11/21/09
You know, I think this level of fangirling deserves a heart.
11/20/09
SO. Why do they care about making men go to this movie? If women movie goers can break records on their own, isn't that good enough? Are women's dollars too pink? A dollar from a woman is still worth 100 pennies, just like from a man, even if woman only get paid 76cents compared to men. Why is an audience somehow more worthy if it is full of penii?
11/20/09
11/20/09
It's the same as "holiday" ads that are aimed at people beyond those celebrating Christmas and Hanukkah. They don't actually care about including other religions and the non-religious - they just want to bring in as many customers as possible.
11/20/09
It's science.
11/20/09
However... one question. If you were a hundred years old vampire with supervampire powers, WHY WOULD YOU STAY IN HIGH SCHOOL!?!?!?
11/20/09
11/20/09
Thus I see that as a cosmic sign I should stay far, far away from the theaters on this one.
More seriously, I am sad that Chris Weitz could not save this; I adore "About a Boy", and believe he is a very talented director.
11/20/09
11/20/09
Won't someone please think of the English Majors?!
11/20/09
11/20/09
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11/20/09
Otherwise I would have to accept the fact that a movie that panders to 14 year old boys and their fathers is bad.
Even though I did see the second Transformers movie, and it did, in fact, suck.
11/20/09
The first Transformers movie sucked, too. It was a great Camaro commercial, though.
11/20/09
11/20/09
I mean, I didn't see GI Joe, because I had to wash my hair, even though I've liked Dennis Quaid since I discovered Remy McSwain on DVD, but ...
Yeah. the fact that "modern cinema" is basically full to the brim of testosteronal-audience-focused clunkers oh so rarely comes up.
11/20/09
"Let's just say it: It's great there's a movie that makes teenage girls scream. Half the movies Hollywood makes are designed to make teenage boys scream, and those boy movies are just as ridiculous and a lot nastier than 'New Moon.'"
I will cheerfully take Twilight and New Moon over Transformers any day of the week.
(Granted, he didn't say that it was actually any good.)
[www.sfgate.com]
11/20/09
Do I like that it's this? No. But, on the flip side, I'm not delusional enough to think quality has anything to do with popularity. And yeah..I HATED the TF movies (racist robots, wtf?) and though this predictable and deribative...it's an original work. Not a toy franchise.
11/20/09
What I'm looking for is a female superhero flick that's faithful to the comics and gets a high-end director like the male ones get :(
11/20/09
I wouldn't hold your breath. The idea that girls don't like superheroes is really firmly entrenched. It's not true, but, they'll insist on it until they die.
11/21/09
Is there any source for this statistic? My boyfriend absolutely refuses to believe this and I want to kick his ass with it
11/21/09
I think people want to believe it's not true because horror is all oogy and stuff. But it also has a lot of "Last girl standing" characters and stories where women get to be the hero in the end. I think that's enormously appealing for women.
11/20/09
When your reviews can't prevent moviegoers from seeing a film... what do you have left? WHAT DO YOU HAVE?
(but seriously, was anyone expecting Oscar-worthy anything?)
11/20/09
This next one, I'm a little nervous watching those underage abs. I mean, Edward doesn't do it for me, so what's left? Abs.
11/20/09
11/20/09
#tips
11/20/09
(IMO, all the really really beautiful men, like Roger, and Rafa, and the French team's senior membership, and Marat, whose retirement I'm mourning, are all over 21, but that's just me.)
11/20/09
11/20/09
Expect an eruption? Is that an entendre? Should I be quivering with anticipation? Is the buildup tense?
11/20/09