Menopause - Jezebel

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Breamworthy
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
Am I the only woman in the world who doesn't experience hormonal mood swings? Sometimes it feels like it. I get cramps, but I've been menstruating since I was 10 years old, and I have never once felt any kind of cycle-related emotion.

A lot of guys don't even believe that it's possible. Those assholes who say things like "Oh, you must be on your period" because you disagree with them - if you tell them that you don't have PMS mood swings, they just laugh and tell you that they feel ever more sorry for your husband because you're obviously in denial about your moods.

What gives? Am I such a freak? Internet, please tell me that I'm not alone!
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deitybox
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
I keep hearing people in the comments referring to "catcalling" as the seminal experience of womanhood. Does this mean that conventionally unattractive women who don't get catcalled are not truly experiencing what it is to "be a woman"? Or how about internal organs -- what of those of us who can't biologically have children, making abortion rights personally moot?

If we're going to get our panties in a twist, let's twist 'em all the way. "Being a woman": everyone is doing it wrong.

Which is to say: Dana Jennings is trying to get through a terrible illness, and found an unlikely way to empathize with his wife and menopausal women everywhere. He's not saying he knows what the sum total of being a woman is. Jeeeezus.
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greengrey
06/02/09

@deitybox: Isn't it sending a bad message to say you have to go though a terrible illness to find empathy for your wife? Shouldn't the empathy already be there?
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SarahMC
06/02/09

@deitybox: Nobody, actually, has refered to catcallnig as the seminal experience of womanhood (nor is catcalling dependent on one's level of attractiveness).
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deitybox
06/02/09

@greengrey: I think that of course he had empathy for his wife, but the actual experience of going through menopause-like symptoms made him really understand her mood swings and relate to what she was going through in menopause. @SarahMC: ball-cutting cybersuccubus: Actually, a few people commented along the lines of "don't you dare say you know what it means to be a woman until you've been catcalled while walking down the street." So if I haven't, I don't know what it means to be a woman?
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SarahMC
06/02/09

@deitybox: Oh heavens. I'll only speak to myself, but here's the deal: I listed a number of social experiences women face in order to drive the point home that our biology does not determine "who we are" as people. It was an effort to show that no ONE thing defines us as women, period. Certainly not our hormones.
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deitybox
06/02/09

@SarahMC: ball-cutting cybersuccubus: Yeah, I got it, and of course I agree. But I also think that some commenters were really overreacting to what was a harmless, empathetic column, and making generalizing statements about what "being a woman" really is.
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annexw
06/02/09

@deitybox:

I'm with you on this one deitybox and was crafting something along the same lines when I came to your post.

Actually, since my hormones are crazy low, I don't even 'get' to experience the stereotypical crazed emotions during PMS. No catcalls, make the same as everyone else, no baby-making ability.

I fail at many things I guess. ;)
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deitybox
06/02/09

@annexw: Really? I have polycystic-ovarian syndrome, so I'm also feeling rather "unwomanly" when it comes to hormones, menstruation and baby-making included.
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Gingerlime
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
An herbal mix-up back in 2005 made my testosterone levels spike. I was constantly horny and wanted to fight with EVERYONE, and I thought, "No wonder men are always starting wars and arguing over nothing." I'll take hot flashes over that insanity any day of the week.
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andBegorrah
06/02/09

@Gingerlime: That sounds awesome and horrifying all at the same time. Have you heard the "Testosterone" episode of This American Life? (Or has everyone who's ever heard this story already recommended it?)
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PilgrimSoul
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
Dudes. Please shut up about your ovary envy. Stop using gender essentialism to support your view of what "being a woman" is like. It ain't all in the hormones. Do you get catclled on the street? Are your internal organs subject to occupation by the state? No? Then shut the hell up.
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andBegorrah
06/02/09

@PilgrimSoul: "Are your internal organs subject to occupation by the state?" To be fair, there is solid evidence that my ovaries are Weapons of Mass Destruction - any and all preventative intervention is really in the best interests of global safety.
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andBegorrah
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
I once found myself turning into a teenage girl from the early 1970s, but it wasn't hormones; I was just being chased by a crazed ax murderer while babysitting some demonically-possessed children in a house built on an old Indian burial ground. There was a lot of sweating and crying for me as well.
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virgikneecap
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
I read a lot about hormones because I have problems with mine, but I always hate to think that our personalities are the sum of our hormones...we are more than chemicals coursing through our bodies, right? A pill can't erase my sex drive, or my fiery temperament, or can it?
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Breamworthy
06/02/09

@virgikneecap: I don't know about fiery temperament, but there are a lot of women (myself included) who have found that birth control pills can completely erase an otherwise very healthy sex drive.
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SarahMC
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
Once you're cat-called on your 8 am walk to work four times a week, you'll "know what it's like" to be a woman.

Once you realize your paycheck is smaller than that of the dude-bro below you with five fewer years of experience, you'll "know what it's like" to be a woman.

Once society has determined that your life is worth less than that of a recently fertilized egg, you'll "know what it's like" to be a woman.

We are not the sum of our hormonal fluctuations you jackass.
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sybann
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
My uncle had hormone treatment for prostate cancer and it did make him much more emotional and "softer" (in his words) in his dealings with others.

Whether or not it's stereotypical (and it sure as hell doesn't take individuality into consideration), we all KNOW that our hormonal swings contribute to our emotions!
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greengrey
06/02/09

@sybann: My hormonal swings don't make me softer. They make me mean. But I don't think it helps me understand men.
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MarissaExplainsItAll
06/02/09

@sybann: Yeah, my daddy has prostate cancer and he is definitely less even keeled. I think the difference is what hormones do to you personally. Some people cry and others get angry.
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sybann
06/02/09

@greengrey: HA! Mine did too - I LOVE menopause.
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Rare Affinity
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
It needs to be reiterated that NOT all women going through the menopuase suffer adverse side effects. I for one, only realised I had been through it AFTER it was over. I am all for finding appropriate treatments for women who do suffer side effects. But it seems to me peri menopausal women, along with menstruating women and pregnant women are all too often portrayed as passive victims of their fluctuating hormones. Lord knows how such delicate creatures ever managed to hold down careers and or raise families.
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kithkin
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
This seems like a horrible dudely appropriation of womanhood. Oh, you understand because you had a hot flash while watching HGTV. That has absolutely nothing to do with the struggles women face in the world today and certainly doesn't make you a "woman." Women: they're so wacky!

Pardon me while I weep for you.
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Asmo
06/02/09

@kithkin: What would be a good dudely appreciation of womanhood? Is it even possible? Should men even bother trying to understand the struggles women go through? Should we stifle all attempts at empathy for women, because no matter what, it never seems to be good enough?
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kithkin
06/02/09

@Asmo: I welcome appreciation and empathy. Not, however, appropriation. And certainly not this kind of essentialist appropriation that suggests the key to understanding women lies in hormones. As other commenters have said, this guy can try again once his body is regarded as public property, once he makes seventy cents on a similarly situated coworker's dollar, and so on. I find it best to defer to the voices of the marginalized when dealing with issues relating to a marginalized group. This is the opposite.
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greengrey
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
Wouldn't testosterone make PMS worse? I thought that we got PMS because our estrogen levels drop. That's why the pill helps being it gives you more estrogen and less crazy?
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Megan
06/02/09

@greengrey: Nope, the highest dose pill I was ever on gave me anxiety attacks...
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save jinger
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
Men learn very important lessons when they live as women. Case in point:

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Ailanthus-altissima
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
All these things he uses to describe "womanhood" are stereotypical and, at least to me, not something that is or should be descriptive of womanhood. I don't want a man to call for empathy for "emotional" women.

I appreciate the place he is coming from on this, but I am unable to really embrace it in any way.
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PrarieMuffin
06/02/09

@Ailanthus-altissima: I agree. I'm always at a loss when people--both men and women--describe hormonal fluctuations of emotion as an integral part of the feminine experience. They're not something I, or many women I know, actually exhibit in any recognizable pattern. It is more likely to me that these "emotional" qualities are mostly used as a means of cutting us down. "Oh shit, Shirley's being disagreeable today. It must be that time of the month.
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kithkin
06/02/09

@Ailanthus-altissima: I agree. This reminds me of the thread about liberal dudes yesterday afternoon. I get wary anytime a man claims to speak for a woman, or about the experience of womanhood, and especially so when it's full of patronizing shit about hormones.
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formergr
06/02/09

@PrarieMuffin: On the other had, though, I *DO* get emotional when I have PMS. I get frustrated verrrry easily, and find myself tearing up and wondering why everyone is against me, and then remember I have PMS, and at least can get a handle on it. The rest of the month, I'm a pretty positive person.

I've also played around with being on and off the Pill, and it definitely had an effect on my mood and emotions. So for me, at least, hormones and emotions are tied together. That being said, there is more to me than just the hormones!
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vamusical
06/02/09

@Ailanthus-altissima: You just described how I feel. I know he means well, but he is missing the big picture.
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FourthWaveBaby
06/02/09

In reply to Writer's Life As A Woman Makes Me Ponder Mine As A Man
I didn't find this article amusing at ALL. In fact I posted it on Facebook as one of the dumbest things I've read all week. The idea that man-in-chemo = women-in-menopause is ludicrous, as is his conclusion: that women are "hormonal" and "mysterious." We're completely different creatures driven by raging hormones to binge-eat, cry at nothing, etc. This isn't any new insight - it's a tired old stereotype supposedly confirmed by this accidental "expirement." I can't decide if it's more offensive or more ridiculous, but it's definitely both.
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greengrey
06/02/09

@FourthWaveBaby: I hate when people say women are hormonal. Men aren't? Men lack hormones? No, it's just that women's hormones are THE OTHER. And therefore need to be described different.
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nessalicious
06/02/09

@greengrey: I think they just mean that men's hormones don't fluctuate quite like women's do.
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vamusical
06/02/09

@greengrey: I prefer my hormones that occasionally make me irrationally upset and crave certain foods to the alternative, hormones that cause everything to turn into a pissing contest. I'd also like to point out that testosterone has likely had a great deal to do with most of the major world wars and military conquests of history, which have slaughtered millions. I'll take the emo hormones over that, thank you very much.
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J.D.Regent
06/02/09

@greengrey: but isn't that all he is doing here? explaining how the lack of testosterone made him feel and commiserating with his wife in menopause, experiencing her own, different hormonal change? I don't think he was making the argument that men are LESS hormonal than women, quite the opposite he was recognizing the effects of testosterone on his life.
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J.D.Regent
06/02/09

@J.D.Regent: actually I take that back after reading the article.
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RedLineRage
06/02/09

@vamusical: Oh Jesus Christ. Really?
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vamusical
06/02/09

@RedLineRage: Yes really.
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RedLineRage
06/02/09

@vamusical: That's just as absurd as Mr. Jenning's stereotypical comments.
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vamusical
06/02/09

@RedLineRage: I think you need to go look up "tongue-in-cheek". And where was I stereotyping?
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RedLineRage
06/02/09

@vamusical: Men make war. Men bad.

Talk about tired stereotypes. "Tongue-in-cheek" indeed.
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vamusical
06/02/09

@RedLineRage: Sorry you don't like my jokes. I'll work very hard to please you next time I comment.
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mbot says Spock yeah!
05/18/09

In reply to Genes Determine When Aunt Flo Visits — And When She Goes Away
I don't remember much about my first period and can't pin down if I was 11, 12, or 13, BUT: I do remember that after I told my mom, she gave me a bag of Werther's Originals. How cute is that??!
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