Also, how much of a disaster is it for a declining population? A lowered GDP is bad, okay, but if the population is declining, doesn't that mean that the per capita domestic product is actually higher? #capcom
@braak: Yes but that higher GDP per capita is an artifact of the decline in population. The GDP itself has not grown(stagnation) and may actually be declining(deflation).
Also, declining population translates to increased burden on individuals (due to a decreasing tax base). #capcom
@Cynicalbard: But it also translates to a higher share of the GDP per individual. I mean, I'm not concerned why it's happening. Does it matter what the country's gross product is, or does it matter how much money there is per person? Yes, the tax burden increases, but if the relative share of the GDP increases, it doesn't necessarily matter because it's a proportional change.
@arginusae: That's a good point, and a problem that we're likely to run into here, too; I suppose there are valid reasons to be concerned about a declining population (and a higher proportion of older citizenry), I'm just suspicious of arguments that present a declining population--or even a drop in GDP, as implicitly bad. #capcom
Japan has...well, okay, I don't know really about Japan, this is just something I remember from English class, so don't take me too seriously...Japan also has a cultural "re-enchanment" issue going on. Unlike a lot of Western cultures, Japan's past and present are so sharply contrasted, and its samurai history so strongly fetishized, that there ends up being a strong cultural movement to re-capture that stuff. #capcom
Just so we're clear, the whole 'grass eating men' thing in Japan is basically media bullshit hype along the lines of the NYT trend pieces we've all grown to love. I've lived in Japan, I live in Asia currently, I've got plenty of contacts in Japan, and the uniform reaction is amusement that this fake trend (fauxnomenon?) is getting serious play in the West.
There are broader trends in Japanese society toward a more suitable work/life balance for men, but it's not some big trend-piece movement. #capcom
@CrapCommentFromADude: I didn't want to comment on this thread precisely because I'm always wary of these articles that claim to identify significant societal tendencies in a foreign country. I grew up in West Africa, I live in France, and I cringe every time I read these generally very reductive articles about, I don't know, aid in Africa, or immigration in France, or the hijab issue and its conflict with the way we see and live secularism here, because they show a stunning ignorance of the general context of the society they're speaking of. (It's sometimes deliberate, because the articles are generally fairly short and it would take too much time to explain the complexities inherent in the way such things play in France, or Senegal, or in this case, Japan.)
So when I read this, despite the fact that I've never been to Japan (and in large part because I've never been), I decided to take it with a huge spoonful of salt. #capcom
Since we're both in greyed-out comment land and hopefully it's not too much of a comment thread derail, could I trouble you for your quick two cents on the hijab issue?
My basic, only-quasi-informed take on the matter is that there's often a higher degree of support for a ban among immigrant women from the cultures that push the range of coverings than Western feminists would expect, because having the 'free choice' in practice too often means 'the choice of the brothers and fathers' who enforce a certain standard at the micro level.
Am I completely off base? I'd love to be filled in by someone with more perspective. #capcom
So all these women get are guys who don't care about fast cars or objectifying women and instead treat them like friends, friends they might like to shop with at boutiques before having a nice bit of cake? Oh the poor darlings! #capcom
@Pizza!Pizza!Pizza!: I wonder if there'll be any sort of marriage-of-convenience trend, where the herbivore men and their cake-eating galpals end up forming families? Because if anything can make the impossible seem probable, that thing is cake. #capcom
actually, it's funny that this article is posted.
i haven't played this game, but am intrigued by it.
one of the dramas of the season i am watching is called Samurai Highschool.
it stars a popular young actor who is a herbivore type, but transforms into an ancient samurai when in danger.
so, yes, i would say this is definitely a trend. (and i enjoy it)
interestingly enough, japanese female fashion is changing from a cuter pastel style to a more rock'n'roll aesthetic. #capcom
Re: "meat as a stand-in for manliness"
I read about these guys before in a CNN.com article. The Japanese woman (!) who coined the term said, "In Japan, sex is translated as 'relationship in flesh,' so I named those boys 'herbivorous boys' since they are not interested in flesh." #capcom
@MondayMorningGlow: Most people say "sexxu o suru" which is "to do sex". I have never heard of another term. I'm sure there is one, since "sex" is taken from English, but it seems that no one uses any other term.
@boxspelunker: She's referring to the term "nikutai kankei" which literally means "relationship in/of the flesh," which I'm assuming is a more literary/scholarly term than a colloquial loan-word expression. The term used to refer to the body in Japanese uses the same character and pronunciation as that of "meat." (and to nitpick, the romanization you're looking for is "sekkusu")
See also: nikutai literature, or "carnal literature"/"literature of the flesh" in the immediate postwar period, stories of very, erm, physical and sexual experiences after living under censors and sensory deprivation during the war years. #capcom
I remember asking my friends about it - as I said in my first comment, because "sekkusu" (duh, self) is obviously an English-based loanword, but none of them knew anything. They just shrugged and said, "It's always 'sekkusu'."
And narf, yes, you are totally right on the spelling. A+, self, for spelling with letters that don't exist! :D #capcom
*sigh*
With this, I also see Japanese culture succeeding near as spectacularly as Americans -- both South and North -- at that other widespread and transnational game, "Blame the Women".
@Rooo sez BISH PLZ: I think in this case it's a game of "Blame the Young". The young men have are being criticized for not being manly enough. They're being told the Japanese equivalent of "Sack Up".
11/24/09
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Also, declining population translates to increased burden on individuals (due to a decreasing tax base). #capcom
11/03/09
@arginusae: That's a good point, and a problem that we're likely to run into here, too; I suppose there are valid reasons to be concerned about a declining population (and a higher proportion of older citizenry), I'm just suspicious of arguments that present a declining population--or even a drop in GDP, as implicitly bad. #capcom
11/03/09
11/03/09
There are broader trends in Japanese society toward a more suitable work/life balance for men, but it's not some big trend-piece movement. #capcom
11/03/09
So when I read this, despite the fact that I've never been to Japan (and in large part because I've never been), I decided to take it with a huge spoonful of salt. #capcom
11/03/09
Since we're both in greyed-out comment land and hopefully it's not too much of a comment thread derail, could I trouble you for your quick two cents on the hijab issue?
My basic, only-quasi-informed take on the matter is that there's often a higher degree of support for a ban among immigrant women from the cultures that push the range of coverings than Western feminists would expect, because having the 'free choice' in practice too often means 'the choice of the brothers and fathers' who enforce a certain standard at the micro level.
Am I completely off base? I'd love to be filled in by someone with more perspective. #capcom
11/02/09
And I love me some quality yaoi.
11/02/09
11/02/09
11/02/09
i haven't played this game, but am intrigued by it.
one of the dramas of the season i am watching is called Samurai Highschool.
it stars a popular young actor who is a herbivore type, but transforms into an ancient samurai when in danger.
so, yes, i would say this is definitely a trend. (and i enjoy it)
interestingly enough, japanese female fashion is changing from a cuter pastel style to a more rock'n'roll aesthetic. #capcom
11/03/09
11/02/09
I read about these guys before in a CNN.com article. The Japanese woman (!) who coined the term said, "In Japan, sex is translated as 'relationship in flesh,' so I named those boys 'herbivorous boys' since they are not interested in flesh." #capcom
11/02/09
Did she happen to say what it was? #capcom
11/02/09
See also: nikutai literature, or "carnal literature"/"literature of the flesh" in the immediate postwar period, stories of very, erm, physical and sexual experiences after living under censors and sensory deprivation during the war years. #capcom
11/03/09
I remember asking my friends about it - as I said in my first comment, because "sekkusu" (duh, self) is obviously an English-based loanword, but none of them knew anything. They just shrugged and said, "It's always 'sekkusu'."
And narf, yes, you are totally right on the spelling. A+, self, for spelling with letters that don't exist! :D #capcom
11/02/09
With this, I also see Japanese culture succeeding near as spectacularly as Americans -- both South and North -- at that other widespread and transnational game, "Blame the Women".
11/02/09