When are people going to realize that if MILLIONS OF WOMEN AROUND THE GLOBE are willing to risk cultural shaming, severe bodily injury, and death itself because they do not want to give birth, NO ONE can stop them from taking those risks, no matter how many damn laws you pass. It's pure misogyny: We will force you to undergo bodily torture for nine months and risk death just to give birth. Oh, and then you're on your own. Fuckers.
@La Chica Lucy: I have a real problem with this kind of thinking. Pregnancy isn't "torture"; birth can be very safe when it's supervised by a qualified physician or midwife. I think there needs to a be a real effort to curb the need for abortions in the first place and make sure that a much higher percentage of pregnancies are wanted ones. That means making sure that men are taught from an early age that there is never a good reason to rape a woman, that rape is any sex that doesn't involve full consent. Contraceptives need to be made more available and more affordable, and more mainstream so women can choose their relationships based on what's comfortable, not on their financial situations . And, BC needs to be more effective, which can only be done if the money is put into it, and maybe more BC methods for men, too. There needs to be more support for women who do want to keep their pregnancies - more prenatal support, more midwives and OB/GYN's, more flexible career options.
Abortion should be safe, legal, and rare - rare because women should be able to access resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and shouldn't be at such high risk to be raped, not because pregnant women are forced to not have abortions. #antichrist
@Dancingfrog: I know pregnancy can be safe and not all pregnancies are torture. My point is these people do not care about women. At all. If they did, all of the things you describe above (which I agree with) would already be happening. #antichrist
@Trulymadlyme: It seems that it should be obvious, right?
I did my senior capstone for my BS last year in "Reducing stigmatization of mental illness among the African American population of Portland" (longest title ever), which really opened my eyes to the extent of the discrimination and lack of cultural competence amongst mental health professionals. There is a clinic in Portland through OHSU that offers culturally competent care specifically for African Americans and Africans as well as SE Asians. I enjoyed working with the providers at the clinic. #antichrist
But yes. A part of the mental health issues of pretty much every single brilliant African American I knew in college and law school is derived from the fall out of racism. You do deal. But it can sting. And depending on one's resilience, it can be utterly debilitating. It's fascinating work and I'd love to learn more about what you do. #antichrist
@Trulymadlyme: Oregon.
My professor for the capstone is an African American man who has mental health issues that went undiagnosed for decades in large part because of his race. Either he didn't fit "the mold" of someone with those disorders, or it wasn't suggested that he seek treatment because within his community there was a feeling of distrust of medical/mental health professionals (understandably!). I took every class from this professor I could as an undergrad and am now applying to do the MSW program at the same school to learn more from him. I am trying to find my place of where I will be able to best serve people of color within the mental health/human services field. It was heartbreaking and infuriating to learn and see how people of color in my community were being treated when they tried to seek help. #antichrist
'The imagery is "dream-like," which makes it somewhat removed from reality, and thus inoffensive'
This sounds like the logic that concludes something can't be offensive if it was intended as a joke. I mean, I'd support a poster with an entire ass hanging out. But the "logic" makes me giggle. #antichrist
I am so saddened and scared by the death of the three college students in North Dakota. The thought of being trapped and frightened and waiting for help that never comes is terrible. I hope that their families and the women that received the distress calls find peace. #antichrist
@WaltzingMatilda: That's because Real Americans know that everything (and I mean everything) tastes better with some ranch. And thus we always have it on hand!
Related: I am considering experimenting with a sweet ranch dressing that could be used as a sauce on desserts. #antichrist
@BeckyIva: I lived with an American for two years, and Ranch dressing was one of the best things I got out of that household arrangement. That and, you know, a lifelong friend. Who is my lifelong friend in part BECAUSE she introduced me to the glory that is ranch dressing. Mmm. Ranch. Great, now I want some. #antichrist
@itsonreserve: Oh my god. That website... surely it is the work of the gods? Thank you so much! MORE experiments to carry out on my current flatmates. #antichrist
So do I, Malia! I just wish I had more students like you--most of mine only want to know something if they think they are going to use it in the future, and amazingly, they all seem to have crystal balls that tell them exactly what they will and will not need to know in the future.
@cocobanal: Preach it. I feel like I say so many times, "Fix this! If you send out resumes and cover letters that look like this writing, not only will they not hire you, they will laugh about you to all of their friends!" Maybe I should hire my friend who works in HR to come in as a guest speaker.
I do believe some of them have a passive-voice relationship with their studies. There is no sense that they have an active role in their education. They just sit there with their mouths open, accepting whatever comes along, and each paper/test/graded unit is another kind of event that just happens. Failing happens. Grades happen. Improvement, if it happens, just happens. Having once been like that myself, it's incredibly frustrating not to be able to get them to see, as I once did, that if you just DO THE WORK, suddenly the world is a much better place. #antichrist
@TheFormerJuneBronson: I hear ya. One of the classes I teach includes cover letter and resume writing. It's scary to see what they consider a good letter, and writing a resume is one of the things the students swear they won't need in the future. RIGHT.
@cocobanal: My cousin just had a revelation: he excitedly told me that he had a big WWI test coming up, but he'd started reading the materials like they were a novel, and it had been really interesting! And he aced the test!
He really is astounded by the concept that learning history like a narrative rather than as a rote recitation of dates and names can be fun. It's like he invented fire, he's adorable about it. #antichrist
@TheFormerJuneBronson: Yo. yo. I've been kind of depressed lately about teaching -- mostly about my own role in it, but part of the problem is that I can't tell what's due to my incompetence and what's due to their lack of trying.
This is what comes from receiving a set of papers that are, on average, worse than the last one. Yay. #antichrist
I have a more lax view on this debate than most, but this is one shot that I can say with authority would have been much cooler with an actual black model. Unless it's the SAME model. In that case, it changes the discussion entirely. #blackface
Well they might try to call it art, but I don't see how they'd get away with calling it fashion. These women are naked. They're not even wearing accessories. Where's the fashion, again?
Whatever. Fuck you, thoughtless, lazy, played-out, uncreative photographers and whatever other "artistic geniuses" insist on keeping this trend going. Just because you pissed people off doesn't mean you're a Misunderstood Artiste. #enoughalready
I'm not going to give my two cents on the blackface debate because I don't feel like getting slammed per usual.
I have one question though: are the two women in the picture the same model? It looks like it to me. If so, I take this photoshoot as a commentary on the light/dark inside of every woman. Sort of like a yin and yang type of shoot. Can someone find out if this is the same model because that is how I interpret this photo. I'm open to being proven wrong, however. #blackface
@Armed with Vitriol: It's an honest mistake, considering how many of the models seem to come from the same (uninspiring, to me) mold these days. #blackface
Perhaps I am clueless but this whole black face trend that has come up in the media recently really doesn't bother me. I think it is a beautiful photo. #blackface
@muddgirl: Why would they want to be hired by a photoographer/magazine/company who doesn't want them? And what about us short mexicans? There isn't a screaming market for us either. #blackface
@FaceMonkey: Why would they want to be hired by a photoographer/magazine/company who doesn't want them?
Is that supposed to be a joke? Instead of taking the powerbrokers to task for racism, you think that the answer to widespread discrimination in an industry is to tell the people being discriminated against, "oh well, all the people handing out jobs are jerks, so you're probably better off"? This is ridiculous. #blackface
@yvanehtnioj: That is not what I am saying at all. I was just trying to point out that not everything is racist or discriminating. I am trying to understand how painting a model (black, brown, blue or whatever) points directly to racism. The choice to hire someone doesn't always depend on the color of their skin just like not hiring someone isn't always because the color of their skin either. If a company doesn't want to hire me (for whatever reason, and most often we never find out the real reason) then I just figure I can find more happiness somewhere else. I would NEVER dismiss OBVIOUS racism but I just don't think there is obvious racism here. Just a lot of speculation. #blackface
@FaceMonkey: Well an important distinction here is that no one is being painted blue. Whenever someone brings up nonsense like this ("I don't care if you're purple!") it's sidestepping the actual issue. There are actual models of color, so painting a white model to look like one instead of hiring one is very clearly different from painting someone blue.
Of course The choice to hire someone doesn't always depend on the color of their skin just like not hiring someone isn't always because the color of their skin either. But models are paid to look a certain way, so passing over a black model for a white one that you then paint black isn't exactly the same as the time that I wasn't sure if my lack of experience or my lackluster interview did me in. There is an obvious problem here, and that's independent of the fact that blackface should never be viewed as an artistic option (without some kind of important subtext or actual thought behind the photograph). The fact that you don't see it doesn't make it speculation. #blackface
@yvanehtnioj: You are absolutely right to say models are paid to look a certain way. That being said, I wonder if the photographer liked the bone structure/features of the white model but wished she had darker skin. Is that still considered racist? I am just trying to understand the point of view of everyone here. Is it the same as asking a white model to tan before a shoot? Would it be the same outrage if a black model were painted to look white?
I seriously am not trying to be a horse's ass but I just can't seem to grasp what exactly is so upsetting.
PS...perhaps the use of blue skin was silly, my apologies for such a child-like example. #blackface
@FaceMonkey: For me there are basically 3 separate issues:
1. Blackface. This has a very long, very ugly history. Dressing white people up as black people for entertainment purposes "others" black people, is grossly offensive, and taps into the worst part of our history and culture. (This is why it would not be the same if a black model was painted white, the context is different.)
2a. Lack of representation of black models in mainstream media (Consumer perspective). Very few black women are represented in the media, so if one of the few occasions is actually a white woman painted black (perhaps because the painter was enamored of her European features), it skews the already small sample from which other black women (and especially girls) draw role models, aspirational ideals, and positive reinforcement. (The famous doll experiment deals with some of the fallout from this white=pretty message that gets reinforced every day in a billion ways.)
2b. Lack of representation of black models in mainstream media (Model perspective). Models of color are routinely excluded from photo shoots (sometimes specifically, with notes like "No ethnic models" at casting, and more often de facto). When a photographer is looking for contrasting skin tones for artistic purposes (and it almost hurts to give that much benefit of the doubt to this twit) and chooses to go to the trouble to paint a white woman's entire body rather than hire a model who comes ready-made with that skin tone, it not only takes away an opportunity for that model (in an already hypercompetitve world where her opportunities are artificially restricted because of her race), but it also feeds the problems mentioned above. And if his reason actually is "I want black skin but white features", that is an excellent example of furthering the idea that white=pretty. Which is a destructive problem in the first place, but potentially even moreso for women whose jobs center around their looks. If regular women are getting boob jobs by the score because the media tells us it's hawt, how much worse must be the pressure for black models to get nose jobs or Asian models to get that horrifying eyelid surgery or what-have-you when their entire job is reliant on photographers finding their faces worth filming? (Also this is not the same as asking a white model to tan, for the simple reason that a white model can tan. A black model cannot show up white one day.)
I am getting tired of people saying that this isn't blackface.
Not all instances of blackface require the performer to look like a golliwog. Blackface is essentially a White person made up to appear as a Black person for entertainment purposes. This fits the bill. The bottom line is that a White model is getting paid to look like a Black model. In the ANTM shoot they actually wanted them to embody the spirit of a biracial person, as though that is something that one can just take on and off like a costume. Arguing over whether it can officially be defined as Blackface only serves to derail an important conversation. #blackface
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: Thank you, thank you, thank you. We need to talk about this and I'm really frustrated with people who just want to derail the discussion by saying they don't care and don't see why anyone else does (if you don't care, don't comment!) or seem to think that something has to be like Roger on Mad Men to be a problem.
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: I don't think that every person who disagrees with calling this blackface is trying to derail any conversation. I think it may have to do with differences in how we define blackface. You say it's all about the make-up. But, for me, the defining characteristic of blackface performances was the intent to belittle the people that performers were imitating. If people simply painted themselves and did nothing, I don't think blackface performances would be remembered the way they are today.
When I look at this image, I don't see the malicious intent that made blackface performances so disgusting. I just see a painted person. #blackface
@Primrose: 1. the dictionary definition of blackface is "a performer made up to imitate a Black person" so technically, regardless of what you or I may think, the above photo is indeed blackface. 2. Blackface would be remembered poorly even if people "simply painted themselves and did nothing". Black face is not just offensive because it showcases a caricature of Black people, it is offensive because it displays a lack of understanding about the innate privilege involved in being white. It downplays the Black experience by allowing White people to "play Black for a day" 3. Regardless of whether or not you find the image above offensive or malicious, there are many POC that do. We need to take their word for it, and not tell them that they shouldn't be offended because the image "isn't really blackface." #blackface
@Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.: I guess that it all comes down to opinion then. I'm a woman of color myself, and I don't find this offensive. As for other POC? Well, I'm wouldn't change my opinion just because one of my siblings/parents/cousins thought otherwise. #blackface
@Primrose: Right, again, whether or not you think it is offensive, other people think it is. You can say that you don't find it offensive, but you can't say the the image is not offensive because some people think it is. You can say that you don't think the image is blackface but you can't say the image isn't blackface because if you go by the dictionary definition, it is.
Edited by Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny. at 10/30/09 8:28 PM
Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny. was starred
Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny. was unstarred
11/04/09
(sorry for the shouting) #antichrist
11/05/09
Abortion should be safe, legal, and rare - rare because women should be able to access resources to prevent unwanted pregnancy and shouldn't be at such high risk to be raped, not because pregnant women are forced to not have abortions. #antichrist
11/05/09
11/05/09
11/04/09
As an African American man, I can only offer my two cents but, uh, duh. In other news, water is wet. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/04/09
I did my senior capstone for my BS last year in "Reducing stigmatization of mental illness among the African American population of Portland" (longest title ever), which really opened my eyes to the extent of the discrimination and lack of cultural competence amongst mental health professionals. There is a clinic in Portland through OHSU that offers culturally competent care specifically for African Americans and Africans as well as SE Asians. I enjoyed working with the providers at the clinic. #antichrist
11/04/09
But yes. A part of the mental health issues of pretty much every single brilliant African American I knew in college and law school is derived from the fall out of racism. You do deal. But it can sting. And depending on one's resilience, it can be utterly debilitating. It's fascinating work and I'd love to learn more about what you do. #antichrist
11/05/09
My professor for the capstone is an African American man who has mental health issues that went undiagnosed for decades in large part because of his race. Either he didn't fit "the mold" of someone with those disorders, or it wasn't suggested that he seek treatment because within his community there was a feeling of distrust of medical/mental health professionals (understandably!). I took every class from this professor I could as an undergrad and am now applying to do the MSW program at the same school to learn more from him. I am trying to find my place of where I will be able to best serve people of color within the mental health/human services field. It was heartbreaking and infuriating to learn and see how people of color in my community were being treated when they tried to seek help. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
This sounds like the logic that concludes something can't be offensive if it was intended as a joke. I mean, I'd support a poster with an entire ass hanging out. But the "logic" makes me giggle. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/04/09
By which I mean, that poster makes me want to bone. A lot. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/04/09
This is all anecdotal, of course.
And strange, of course. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
Related: I am considering experimenting with a sweet ranch dressing that could be used as a sauce on desserts. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
He's totally innocent.
11/04/09
11/04/09
11/05/09
11/05/09
11/04/09
Sorry. Frustrated teacher rant. #antichrist
11/04/09
I do believe some of them have a passive-voice relationship with their studies. There is no sense that they have an active role in their education. They just sit there with their mouths open, accepting whatever comes along, and each paper/test/graded unit is another kind of event that just happens. Failing happens. Grades happen. Improvement, if it happens, just happens. Having once been like that myself, it's incredibly frustrating not to be able to get them to see, as I once did, that if you just DO THE WORK, suddenly the world is a much better place. #antichrist
11/04/09
11/04/09
He really is astounded by the concept that learning history like a narrative rather than as a rote recitation of dates and names can be fun. It's like he invented fire, he's adorable about it. #antichrist
11/05/09
This is what comes from receiving a set of papers that are, on average, worse than the last one. Yay. #antichrist
10/30/09
10/30/09
Well they might try to call it art, but I don't see how they'd get away with calling it fashion. These women are naked. They're not even wearing accessories. Where's the fashion, again?
Whatever. Fuck you, thoughtless, lazy, played-out, uncreative photographers and whatever other "artistic geniuses" insist on keeping this trend going. Just because you pissed people off doesn't mean you're a Misunderstood Artiste.
#enoughalready
10/30/09
I have one question though: are the two women in the picture the same model? It looks like it to me. If so, I take this photoshoot as a commentary on the light/dark inside of every woman. Sort of like a yin and yang type of shoot. Can someone find out if this is the same model because that is how I interpret this photo. I'm open to being proven wrong, however. #blackface
10/30/09
11/02/09
11/02/09
10/30/09
I'm over this "trend". #blackface
10/30/09
10/30/09
So yeah, it absolutely bothers me. #blackface
10/30/09
10/30/09
Is that supposed to be a joke? Instead of taking the powerbrokers to task for racism, you think that the answer to widespread discrimination in an industry is to tell the people being discriminated against, "oh well, all the people handing out jobs are jerks, so you're probably better off"? This is ridiculous. #blackface
11/02/09
11/02/09
Of course The choice to hire someone doesn't always depend on the color of their skin just like not hiring someone isn't always because the color of their skin either. But models are paid to look a certain way, so passing over a black model for a white one that you then paint black isn't exactly the same as the time that I wasn't sure if my lack of experience or my lackluster interview did me in. There is an obvious problem here, and that's independent of the fact that blackface should never be viewed as an artistic option (without some kind of important subtext or actual thought behind the photograph). The fact that you don't see it doesn't make it speculation. #blackface
11/02/09
I seriously am not trying to be a horse's ass but I just can't seem to grasp what exactly is so upsetting.
PS...perhaps the use of blue skin was silly, my apologies for such a child-like example. #blackface
11/02/09
1. Blackface. This has a very long, very ugly history. Dressing white people up as black people for entertainment purposes "others" black people, is grossly offensive, and taps into the worst part of our history and culture. (This is why it would not be the same if a black model was painted white, the context is different.)
2a. Lack of representation of black models in mainstream media (Consumer perspective). Very few black women are represented in the media, so if one of the few occasions is actually a white woman painted black (perhaps because the painter was enamored of her European features), it skews the already small sample from which other black women (and especially girls) draw role models, aspirational ideals, and positive reinforcement. (The famous doll experiment deals with some of the fallout from this white=pretty message that gets reinforced every day in a billion ways.)
2b. Lack of representation of black models in mainstream media (Model perspective). Models of color are routinely excluded from photo shoots (sometimes specifically, with notes like "No ethnic models" at casting, and more often de facto). When a photographer is looking for contrasting skin tones for artistic purposes (and it almost hurts to give that much benefit of the doubt to this twit) and chooses to go to the trouble to paint a white woman's entire body rather than hire a model who comes ready-made with that skin tone, it not only takes away an opportunity for that model (in an already hypercompetitve world where her opportunities are artificially restricted because of her race), but it also feeds the problems mentioned above. And if his reason actually is "I want black skin but white features", that is an excellent example of furthering the idea that white=pretty. Which is a destructive problem in the first place, but potentially even moreso for women whose jobs center around their looks. If regular women are getting boob jobs by the score because the media tells us it's hawt, how much worse must be the pressure for black models to get nose jobs or Asian models to get that horrifying eyelid surgery or what-have-you when their entire job is reliant on photographers finding their faces worth filming? (Also this is not the same as asking a white model to tan, for the simple reason that a white model can tan. A black model cannot show up white one day.)
These are my top 3, at least.
10/30/09
Not all instances of blackface require the performer to look like a golliwog. Blackface is essentially a White person made up to appear as a Black person for entertainment purposes. This fits the bill. The bottom line is that a White model is getting paid to look like a Black model. In the ANTM shoot they actually wanted them to embody the spirit of a biracial person, as though that is something that one can just take on and off like a costume. Arguing over whether it can officially be defined as Blackface only serves to derail an important conversation. #blackface
10/30/09
10/30/09
When I look at this image, I don't see the malicious intent that made blackface performances so disgusting. I just see a painted person. #blackface
10/30/09
10/30/09
10/30/09
10/30/09
We get it. You don't mind offending large groups of people.
Love/hate,
World. #blackface