<![CDATA[Savage Hate - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Moe, I love you. Dan, I love you as well. Intelligent, thoughtful people can disagree!!!!!!!!

Bringing him on as a guest blogger would be a wonderful idea.

Vive Les Jezebelle's

BeachLover

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Jezebel, I really liked you at first but now... I don't know.

LittleSheepie

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: This is why I could never be a professional blogger. Can you imagine every little hissy fit you throw being analyzed for its adherance to feminism?

dayglo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: Some signs that library school has really started to sink in: among my thoughts while typing this up were "I really need to make sure I cite this correctly" and "Does this fall under the fair use doctrine of copyright law?"

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: From Andi Zeisler's Some not-so-petty criticism in Bitch's "Love It/Shove It":

"But there's no prolonged Petty Criticism potential to be found in Fashionista, sadly -- it's just too easy a target. So let's talk about Jezebel, the women's destination in the Gawker media empire, which, for a site that likes to front as feminist, is occasionally far worse than Jane ever was in dealing out baldly antiwoman claptrap. Now, the whole Gawker ethos goes something like this: Snarky, provacative posts + even snarkier commenters = mad page views. Since writers are actually paid according to their posts' page views, inflaming readers means easy money. Which brings us to the recent post by blogger Moe Tkacik, who fancies herself Jezebel's rebel ideologue -- a stance that, more often than not, translates into dissing feminism and feminists. Writing on the outcome of New Hampshire's primary, at which a.) Hillary Clinton got a wee bit emotional while campaigning, and b.) won the primary, Tkacik makes with a whole mess of lady-hating. Check it:

"Dear all you commentwhores who said Hillary's teensy little tear session had swayed your vote to Hillary: Fuck you. I'm sorry, I realize that you pay my bills, but this makes no sense. Her narrow lead in yesterday's New Hampshire primary is entirely attributable to chicks like you, and you were alllllll chicks." She goes on to rant that "women suck," voters "showed their pussy side" in voting for Clinton rather than Obama, and rails at female voters for falling for "that wussy little hint of a cry."

Just logically, there's so much wrong with these statements it's mind-boggling. (To start with: The implication that only women voted for Clinton in New Hampshire is absurd.) But since petty criticism is meant to be brief, we'll try to keep it so.

Based on just those comments, you'd be forgiven for thinking that Tkacik is either a far-right Republican or Matt Drudge in drag. But nope -- she's just an Obama supporter, a wretchedly sore loser, and possessed of a troubling sense of superiority. here's the crux of the insult: Does Tkacik really think that Jezebel's readers -- whom a quick scan of comments on any given post reveal to be a sharp and politically engaged bunch (and of whom, full disclosure, I am one) -- are so mindless (and, more to the point, vagina-driven) that they thought, "I like the crying lady candidate because I, too, cry," rather than "I'm so happy to see Clinton addressing the vicious, gender-based attacks on her"? More to the point, if one of the most prolific writers on a supposedly pro-woman site seems to think women other than her are stupid -- and uses misogynist locker-room insults to make her point -- why should women support that site? It's not like we can't see the same sexist crap, delivered with a bit more finesse, on Fox News.

I'm far from alone in thinking Jezebel has something to answer for. The post garnered more than 700 comments, most of them solidly in the "What the fuck?" camp. Of course, all those comments mean that someone's laughing her Hillary-hating ass all the way to the bank, but they point out the lie in Tkacik's original condemnation of her readers, and the fallacy of so much of the ink previously spilled on Clinton's candidacy: Women think for themselves, and most of them don't tolerate being told that they don't. If Jezebel is going to continue to post sloppy, misogynist trip and call it journalism, at least some of us can take comfort in seeing the number of people who won't let it stand."

(Andi Zeisler, "Some not-so-petty criticism," Bitch no. 39: 18-19. 2008)

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dan has issues with weight and eating. He got into a flame war of sorts with Kate Harding of Shapely Prose back in January. He didn't end up looking all that great.

annejumps

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Over in the SF talk threads on Yelp, somebody posted a link to Pot Psychology. I was all "Yay! Jezebel!"

We're a movin' on up! To the top!

TeeEmEff

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I've been reading Jezebel for a couple of months now, but I haven't ever commented. But I just couldn't keep quiet about this.

I love Dan, and I read his column every week, and I often read his blog too. He was spot on about that letter. Jezebel was also right about the fact that if that had been a real letter, then Abby gave horrible advice. I think Dan agreed with you there.

Sure he wasn't the most tactful about not hurting the Jezebels' feelings, but he's just a blunt person.

Come on girls. Have some ovaries. Don't be so thin-skinned!

sympathyforthedevil

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> haven't caught up on the dan savage, but i'm excited to have just noticed mention of jezebel in the new york times today! [www.nytimes.com]

helenahandbasket

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I'm not a big fan of the column, but I love the Savage Love podcast. Dan Savage holds no punches and says what he thinks/feels... and he doesn't usually claim to be right or superior, which isn't always the case in his writing.

Like someone said above, I enjoy both Dan Savage and Jezebel because they're similar in a lot of ways: opinionated, feisty, hilarious.

Can't we all just get along?

sane_in_berzerkeley

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I feel sort of responsible here, because I posted both here and on Slog that Dan was probably going to spot this letter as a fake. That said, he didn't have to be such a jerk about it. His advice about sex is generally great. He's not so great about other things.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Page views are page views, kiddos. I, for one, fully support anything that gives the Jezzies a few extra bucks.

JaneBadall

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dan Savage hates pit bulls, too. That was just the tip of the iceberg of douchebaggery. I knew something like this would emerge, eventually.

strangerthanfiction

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Katxyz: If I remember and no one has done it before then, I'll try to type it up tonight when I get home. I make no guarantees, though.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog:

Um, I meant myself when I said lazy. Calm down.
Thread meltdown in 3...2...1....

Katxyz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Sigh, registering on account of this flap may take the sunshine out of my declaring my love for this site, the commenters, and Moe, but I have to say I'm with Dan on this. Even chiming in on comment 140+.

Aside from his well established love and blood loyalty to Dear Abby (seriously, if you were a long time reader of his you'd know he's practically a groupie), he is actually only calling for Jezebel to calm down, not decrying the character of the objection to Abby's advice. Now personally I think it's a sign of integrity that Moe got progressively more angry, and for some reason it makes me like her more even when I think she is wrong. The point being is that Jezebel was calling for Abby to resign, rather than merely pointing out that she gave bad advice. You disapprove of her smelling a rat somewhere and then pinning it on the woman, but if Dan is right about the authenticity of the letter then she could be given some slack, as she was at least sharp enough not to trust the initial story.

Once again, I really enjoy Jezebel, and wouldn't nearly like you ladies so much if you weren't so readily pissed off.

InstantAwesome

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Katxyz: Be my guest, asshole, since you're so fucking unlazy.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog:

The article does not say that Jezebel is anti feminist. It says it "occasionally" deals out offensive bullshit. It's a blog with multiple editors and writers. Bullshit may occasionally be posted as a result. It's fair to point out the bullshit and discuss. Can someone less lazy scan or type up the full text?

Katxyz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Yeah, okay, Dan might have been up on his high horse about this faux-letter business, but what ever happened to taking the high road, Moe? This is just going to cause pointless animosity. I could, however, understand Moe slamming BITCH magazine, because they DID directly insult her...and not really in the most intelligent ways.

I think this "response" post is in bad taste.

cheera

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @special_boots: I feel the same way but along the Dan savage Jezebel lines. I like Dan. I think he's honest and has clever and fun advice. I also think he has TOTALLY missed the point on this. Like so many other Jezzie's have mentioned the outrage was over the fact that A woman (stoopid abbie) would give such horrendous and vicious advice about the potential rape of another woman.

Like Hello, Dan? If Abby is taking it as truth and thats her response to the situation she is treating as real shouldn't we be pissed at her for perpetuating the stereotype that women are lying cheating whores who cry rape more often than tyra smiles with her eyes?

sillylittlelawgirl

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> No way. I LOVE Dan Savage. He's a bitch and he's funny. That's why I read Jezebel too.

HokeyPokey

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @lisas: yeah...just read the Starbucks thread from last week. It was a nasty, nasty thread (its tone)...and it had apparently been x-posted at Consumerist.

TeeEmEff

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> but i love dan savage. i've had a crush on him since 11th grade.

i forgive him.

wedropscience

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @lodelasea: I remember the Columbine thing! That WAS rad. It just seems like he's saying dumb shit more and more lately, and calling out jerks less and less. Maybe I just used to be more oblivious to douchiness, though, but now I'm old and I hate everything so I notice itmore.

iphisol

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @DeafChick: Don't take it personally, it's just that a LOT of our trolls come via consumerist.

lisas

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Le Kangourou de Kataroo is reading this sexy blog.: I love you for quoting the Sandlot. That is all.

Jerseylicious

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Well that's BITCH for ya. I think MOE should response back, let's aim for 800 comments this time.

And you have some hatred against Consumerist. Good to know.

DeafChick

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> That's it. I'm never going on vacation again. I missed out on this entire mess. So please don't smack me for the following:

Fake or not, did anyone consider that the "wife" did not view the experience as rape? Of course the whole brother thing might change her mind, but she wasn't reporting the experience as a rape. She actually thanked the "husband".

Further evidence of the letter being fake: if the wife knew it was the brother all along and was willingly cheating on her husband (as Abby implied), she probably would've just kept her mouth shut about the whole thing.

veraikon

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: @DeafChick: "Oh god you're a CONSUMERIST poster. Just never mind."

Omg - ha! I totally just spit diet coke all over my keyboard.

blubirde

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: The irony of someone who was just up in arms about Gawker hating on Jezebel, now hating on someone who posts at Consumerist, is hurting my brain.

megnificent

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Gawker's just compensating for its man-boobs.

♥ dosido ☮

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @eleanorstrousers: Word.
@Le Kangourou de Kataroo is reading this sexy blog.: Ya, and I'm also impressed by the 12hr gap in the middle. It speaks to Moe's serious work ethic, repressing her anger so she can have a solid day and then getting back to the still-pertinent Savage hate business when time permitted. (could also be that no one emailed again until the evening... but I don't like that scenario as much)

B_boy

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @DeafChick: Oh god you're a CONSUMERIST poster. Just never mind.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @freedc: What you just said makes a lot of sense.

chelotoyou

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @BritneyCanadaWhore: I completely agree. And he does it with humor and common sense.

NosebleedSeats

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NosebleedSeats: actually, dan savage regularly calls out dudes who refuse to go down on women for being selfish assholes, he doesn't shy away from calling guys out on their misogyny, and he continuously denounces the use of the term "pussy" as something weak, and advocates instead for the use of the word "scrotum." dan savage can be a bit of a bitch sometimes and i'm not a huge fan of his trans politics, but he's no woman-hater. he one of the very few feminist guys out there who is not afraid to call out other guys, and that's a really, really important voice to have out there.

BritneyCanadaWhore

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @VioletFirth: Did you understand what that comment meant? Because I didn't and I am still trying to puzzle it out.

buttonflyer

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NosebleedSeats: That's mighty big of him. I'm touched.

VioletFirth

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @dayglo: Though as far as Dear Abby's response went, rape was never mentioned, so hopefully the column won't result in people doubting rape victims' stories. Of course, this also raises the point that if the story is true and the wife really thought it was her husband than it was rape and the response should have acknowledged that. And then there's my biggest problem with the response: Abby never says "You know, you should really tell your wife it wasn't you and work through this problem together."

But this is rehashing old ground. I'm just trying to find any possible distraction I can from my homework.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Savage has some useful insight at times, but I agree that his work has gone downhill. And for someone so sensitive to people disrespecting him and his fellow gays, his obvious prejudice against feminists, overweight people, and women in general is unforgivable.

VioletFirth

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @DeafChick: I think using ONE post by ONE editor to condemn Jezebel as anti-feminist is sloppy and simply just not true. And writing an article for a magazine criticizing Moe while commenting under the guise of being anonymous is chickenshit--if you have a problem with her and want to call her out in print, at least be brave enough to stand behind what you're writing.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Funny you should mention that b/c I have the BITCH magazine right here in front of me.

Jezebel is mention in their "Love It/Shove It" section where and I quote:

"Jezebel, the women's destination in the Gawker media empire, which for a site that likes to front as feminist, is occasionally far worse than JANE ever was in dealing out baldly antiwoman claptrap."

It goes on to talk about MOE and her rant about Hillary crying, women voters calling it misogynist locker-room insults how can this site be pro-woman:

"If Jezebel is going to continue to post sloppy, misogynist trip and call it journalism, at least some of us can take comfort in seeing the number of people who won't let it stand."

DeafChick

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dan Savage hates women because he regularly calls out the male partners of women who refuse to give oral sex or similarly "go out of their way".

NosebleedSeats

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @rocknrollunicorn: @dayglo:Okay, I understand now. I saw the post but dropped out of the discussion after a while. I still can't hate on Savage but I don't have to agree with everything he says either.

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @dayglo: Agreed. Cuckolding fetishes, etc. are common knowledge to regular Savage Love readers, but probably not to the general populace.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NefariousNewt: perfect - consider this my perfectly valid electronic signature.

whyknot

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @tranquilmademoiselle: The way he delivers it, particularly the nasty little joke about how feminist bloggers are all up in arms, surprise surprise or whatever.

And I didn't read the original post on Jezebel about it, but it sounds like a number of commenters pointed out that the letter was fake. Then he pretends it was his discovery and doesn't mention that, just making it sound as though everyone here was busy sharpening their knives and screaming bloody murder. Also, he only links to jezebel in general, which is disingenious -- his readers could have seen for themselves if he linked to that post in particular.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @dayglo: Heh. Well, it was focused on one specific post: [jezebel.com]
That post definitely fell under the category of "shove it"

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Jezebel is fake feminism?! WTF?!

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @tranquilmademoiselle: I think you (and Dan) are overestimating the intellegence of the average dear-abby-reading american.

When people read advice columns the information gets stored in their heads in a little "I heard somewhere..." file. And it gets pulled up when something similar stimulates their mind.

So what happens is that people read this stuff and then the next time they hear a rape story they find themselves saying "You should really get chapter and verse on that victim's story before you consider believing her. Women lie about rape sometimes."

The stories that we tell become the truth that we percieve.

dayglo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Ugh. I had to register here (not the reason for the ugh) just to register my hatred of Dan Savage. Like most people, I read his column for years and thought he was awesome. I've seen him speak twice. But in the last year or so, I've found that (I think, at least) his column has gone downhill. It was just a lot bitchier than it used to be. Then I read his book Slouching Towards Gomorrah, which is fat joke after fat joke with a couple of jabs at women thrown in occasionally. Dan Savage was on the line before, but now he's dead to me.

Also, I swear I've read some pretty sketchy letters in his column too.

sarahmazing

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Well, it looks like Princess Kashmir got kicked out of the Disney Princess Fairy Wedding Fun Park and is feeling a leeettle bitchy today.

treecut...will cut a beech

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @freedc: exactly. plus, is it not somewhat of an overreaction to call for abby's resignation given one bad advice column? i read shit on jezebel that i think is ridiculous all the time, but i still consider it a valuable forum with above-average commentary.

bobbiewickham

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Anyone's ears ringing? [gawker.com]

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: Well, are we supposed to love or shove Jezebel?

I love Dan Savage but it's kind of silly to congratulate yourself on your superior knowledge of fake kinky letters.

dayglo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @LadyNo: @hamburgerhotdog: @Dauphine: And now you know that I am just a big goofball. And I am glad that you fucking dykes like Bloom County too!

badmutha

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @nellicat: I too find that Dan is an equal-opportunity bullshit-caller.

buttonflyer

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @BeejShan:

Ahh found it:

[en.wikipedia.org]

BeejShan

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @ShanaElmsford: I think he was slamming the comments because people were calling for the "rapists" death and all. Which wouldn't be moral or efficient even if it had really happened, which it obvs probs didn't. Yes, he should've pointed out Abby's crappy advice as well. Everyone makes mistakes, even the wonderful Dan Savage.

freedc

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @iphisol: Dan Savage is no new douche. Dan savage has been douchy lo these many years. Howevs, Dan Savage was also the ONLY journalist I am aware of, who called out bullying teens and their parents in the immediate wake of the columbine massacre (I don't know if it was picked up nationally, I read it in the Chicago Reader). I don't always agree with him (hollo monorail debacle) but I always want to know what he has to say. Except for this week's Savage Love, which was total crap.

lodelasea

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @nellicat:I agree. Dan Savage doesn't take shit from anyone.I don't get how he was being anti-feminist. Explain please cause I don't get it and I'm being serious. I read his column and he just basically said, why get angry over a fake letter when most people can tell it's fake and wouldn't take that advice.

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I'm mostly amused that his diatribe was smoothly segued from some ridiculous letter from a dude who primarily wanted to talk about how he gets offered soooo much pussy that he just can't possibly want it all! Oh noes! Constant aggressive sexual propositions from people he doesn't have any interest in sleeping in, methinks this guy may actually be a woman...

Also, Dan did make one valid point - out of the thousands of letters you get, why this one Abby? If you really thought it was real, write the guy back privately, don't turn it into masturbation fodder for sickos everywhere. Please.

The Boyg

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @nellicat:
Yeah, I love Dan Savage too, but I hate that he felt the need to slam feminist bloggers but not Abby's shitty advice.

ShanaElmsford

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Macloserboy:
"I still shudder from the son whose father was fucking the son's wife for twenty years. It ended when she confessed and then killed herself."

Link to this news story, please!?

BeejShan

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> oh whatever, the V.V. is just for hooker ads anyway.

ManhattanManHatin'

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @dosido: Except that D.S. regularly launches criticism at his fellow gays when their throwing, in his opinion, hissy fits or otherwise behaving the fool. He doesn't suffer fools lightly, no matter what their stripe.

nellicat

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Y'know the thing where you start out and you're on point and you have an interesting perspective, and then you publish some books and get popular and successful so you turn into a big douche? I think that happened with him.

iphisol

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Yay!! Bill the Cat! Just the other day I was referencing how Opus' butt always fell off like a slice and my coworker did not get it at all. Love me some Bloom County.

LadyNo Fondles Sweaters

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I did myself wonder if the letter was fake, b/c what twenty-something goes to the "folks'" house to "eat supper"? I'm from the Midwest and I don't even talk like that at my age (and I'm a couple years older than the letter writer).

But I totally get and support that Jez was busting on Dear Abby's lame advice.

saralegal21

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: ahh thanks!

atalanta

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: Yeah, that is what they wrote about, nothing else really, and the writer admitted that she was a regular on here. I didn't think it was bad, not at all like they used to talk about Jane.

BoredButNoLongerInNH

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: Yeah, you're right. I just hate all the snippiness. Why does Dan have to be such a bitch about it? Why, of all blogs, did he have to cite Jezebel? I'm thinking this looks suspiciously like tall poppy syndrome - new kid on the block makes good and all that - and Savage is sort of cuffing at it, being all, "get back in your place, upstart!" If that is the case, he needs to simmer down and *recognize*.

Women are just beginning to find a cohesive, coherent voice on the web, and a lot of men - however "enlightened" they fancy themselves - insist on treating us as though we're desperate housewives at a sewing circle. The more I think about this, the more I feel Moe's kind of on target for getting so up in arms. If gay men were the target of Savage's mockery (instead of "feminists"), there would be general hue and cry about it. As it is, he's just putting the little women in their place. Fuck him.

♥ dosido ☮

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Sorry, but I lurve Dan Savage and I think he's right about this. Jez could have ripped the advice AND seen that it was a fake letter, like some of the commenters did. And saying "fuck you you fucking fuck" for pointing out that you were duped is, sorry, typical Moe.

nellicat

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I was really, really confused as to why we were paying any attention to what somebody like Dan Savage was saying, when I realized that it's Michael Savage that I was thinking of. Sorry Dan, your level of jerkiness has dropped a bit now.

TeeEmEff

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> All this from a guy who had an existential crisis over whether or not to circumcize the son he and his partner adopted. Get over yourself, Dan!

langtry

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NefariousNewt: While that is fine letter, it was way too nice, which proves that, dude, you were not elected to speak for us...

BAngieB

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Flack, coming from a guy who was licking doorknobs at a hotel to get a presidential candidate sick with the flu a few years ago?

Occasionally this man is amusing, but more often than not I find him to be pretty damn lame.

Abby's advice is obviously fscked.

Xavoc

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @badmutha: YES!!

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Rare though my agreement is, I have to say: major word, Moe. I used to read Dan Savage religiously, until several months ago he did this weird exercise in pronoun-switching bent to demonstrate to his readers that....straight women are assholes? I'm still not exactly clear what his goal was, but it was bizarre and misogynistic and just hateful without a larger point, and I haven't been back since.

Meanmllemustard

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> "I can feel the hate swelling in you... now release your anger, and your journey towards the Dark Side will be complete!!!"

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @lurkystars: I am picturing that sex act, and it's amazing.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @atalanta: It wasn't a full article; I think it was part of Love It/Shove It.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Can anyone tell me the name of the article in Bitch mag?

atalanta

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @badmutha: I would vote for Bill the Cat in a heartbeat.

Dan Savage's columns used to be amusing a couple years ago before all of the new questions were ones that had already been answered before.

Dauphine

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dear Jezebel,

Dan Savage is as bitchy to one's face as he is behind one's back. It's delightful. I'm also not sure he hates blogs as he posts on The Stranger Blog, or Slog, pretty damned often.

lodelasea

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Ooooh. Ouch.

BlondeGrlz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Hilarious. This reminds me of me. I cannot let shit like this go.

And yes, this is total bullshit.

TruculentandUnreliable

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I really like and trust in Dan Savage.

Please don't bite me.

TropicalParadise

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I love you so much, Moe. Always have, always will.

Dan Savage can go screw himself in his left ear.

lurkystars

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> "Yeah, Dan Savage can suck it. he just hates blogs."

To be fair, I actually met Savage a couple weeks ago at a blog party in Seattle. I have to stand up for the hometown, and my fave newspaper.

Ipomoea

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NefariousNewt: I love Oswald the Octopus. I have no children.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @SarahMC: Which post was that one? I'm drawking a blank.

katekate is squared isn't scared of you, Walnuts

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @dosido: He does sorta of ignore the fact that many commented that the letter was probably a fake. And fake letter or not, the advice Abby gave was pretty crappy, which I think is the main issue. It sets a bad precedent and all that.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @CarrieMC: I think that just about covers it. I'll join you at that wall right about now.

LadyNo Fondles Sweaters

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I love to watch anger grow. This is beautiful.

I like Savage Love, but he's being an ass. He should fucking call out stupid old Abby for not spotting a fake (the one thing I agree with, it is OBVIOUSLY fake. She probably knew and wanted to print it to seem a bit more... modern and useful). And her advice obviously sucked anyway!

I love that he hates blogs. Why? What is more worthless than an advice column? I'll give him that his column is a bit more worthwhile than most, since he encourages people to be GGG and all. But people write to these columns to have "professionals" confirm what they already know. Probably 99% of the letters are fake anyway, because WHY would you ask someone you do not know for advice? Mostly they are just entertainment for voyeurs and perverts like myself who like to spy on other people's alleged problems/feel better about myself because I don't have that problem.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @lydia_gwilt: Dr. Ruth rulz

Dear Blond Diary

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Le Kangourou de Kataroo is reading this sexy blog.: I totally got that response, love the typo!

garrison-tequillor

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @myrtlebeachbum: I feel your pain...

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: ill just go read it at a bookstore or something.

ineffable.me

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Y'all? Lay off Dear Abby. My hometown newspaper sux so hard that she is the only thing worth reading.

Why didn't they have American flags at the Democratic debate?
Obama is a Muslim.
I don't want to pay taxes for your kids to go to school.
Gay marriage will be the death of America.
Dear Abby.

Throw me a bone, peeps.

myrtlebeachbum

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: That should be "fancies", as I fancy myself too superior to proofread.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Oh, and let me hasten to say that Savage isn't saying that the woman wasn't raped - he is saying the letter was a fake. I think he'd be whistling a different tune had he considered it to be a real letter. I like the Dan.

♥ dosido ☮

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> The article was just nasty and too personal and it reads like a commenter using her job at Bitch as a platform for grinding her axe against Moe. Some of the quotes:

"Moe Tcacik, who fancers herself Jezebel's rebel ideologue..."
"She's just an Obama supporter, a wretchedly sore loser and possesssed of a troubling sense of superiority."

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> What really gets to me is "Feminist bloggers were outraged-a highly unusual occurrence-because the only correct response, according to Jezebel.com, was something along the lines of, "Your wife was raped! Kill your brothers-all three of them! Now! NOW!!!'" Because, right, women are just hysterical and silly. Women never get raped by their family members or close acquaintances!

So sad. I loved Dan Savage, too, but this characterization of feminists makes me very stabby.

coisepants

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Even if he's being a dick to my beloved Jezebel, I still adore Dan Savage.

lisas

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I gotta say I'm not seeing where Savage is ripping Jez. He's saying we were all a little bit naive, but I don't think that's much of a slam. After all, Moe and the other Jez eds aren't advice columnists - they're writers and editors - so why should they be expected to spot a fake the way someone like Savage (who's been doing his advice schtick for years) can? Truth is, they have a much harder job. All Savage has to do is field odd letters, give his opinion, and show up at web conferences.

♥ dosido ☮

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> The article in Bitch does not insult Jezebel as a whole. In fact it says "a quick scan of comments on any given post reveal [the posters] to be a sharp and politically engaged bunch." The article in Bitch is about Moe's politically attitudes and her response to many readers, specially her post about Clinton crying and women voters. It's fair criticism.

This Dan Savage bullshit is not. Way to miss the point, Dan. Sigh.

Katxyz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Oh yeah? You bob for apples in the toilet... and you like it!

Cyberbully that, Bitch*!

*the mag, not you

(Sorry guys... I'm in a weird mood today).

Le Kangourou de Kataroo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @zivah:
Exactly. To me, the column smacked of egotism. Dan wants everyone to know that, because he gets fake letters from fetishists on a daily basis, HE can spot them. Too bad Abby's readers aren't well-versed on Savage Love and might actually make something of Abby's poor advice.

I like Dan but his column occasionally drives me a little crazy. This week was utterly useless.

MumbletyEmma

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @NefariousNewt: I'll gladly sign.

lydia_gwilt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @ineffable.me: Actually, and this is for everyone, there's an awesome article about dealing with cyberbullying in online communities in this month's issue that I highly recommend.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dear Ms. Savage,

We, the assembled members of Jezebel, do, on this day, the 27th of March, in the year of someone's Lord 2008, do hereby pronounce, with mailce in thought, that you are a twit. Scuttle back under the rock from which you slithered and leave the good citizens of Jezebel and their duly-appointed leader, Moe, in peace.

Signed,

NefariousNewt, for the majority.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> If Bitch mag had beef w/ that awful Hillary post, more power to them, as it SUCKED.

SarahMC

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @cate3710: Oh, that's a bit of a relief! Thank you!

But still, it's not like Bitch is perfect. I don't want 'em sniping at each other!

special_boots

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Hilarious, Moe! Fuck Dan Savage indeed.

marin79

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @ineffable.me: No, read 'em, it's actually a really great magazine with very interesting articles, which is why I was totally surprized. They also ranted about fashionista.com in the same column, which is like apples and oranges.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @CarrieMC: I bow to your superior mastery of nutshelling.

Pinkosaurus

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @braak: It's amazing, but even if you write someone off as crap, they can still get under your nails and irritate you.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @ineffable.me: @blondegrlz: @SarahMC:
Unfortunately, they don't have it up on their website. I'll try to remember to reread it and sum it up this evening for you guys.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @BrutallyHonestBabes: Oh now see I love that too. "Ack!" reminds me of Bill the Dead Cat who ran for president in the oooold "Bloom County" cartoon. It was his answer to even the most controversial question. His second most common answer, which I often say but dont write, was "Thfffftthh!"

badmutha

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: That makes me cry! I don't always agree with everything on Jezebel, but I don't always agree with everything in Bitch, either, and I love them both for pretty similar reasons. I hate feminist infighting in all its nefarious incarnations.

special_boots

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> WHAT. A. DOUCHE.
And reading that letter just creeped me the fuck out.

Cuteasabutton

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: ok, ill check it out.
i obviously wont give them money of they have beef with the jez.

ineffable.me

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Go Moe. This is hilarious.

I remember someone asking Dr. Ruth years and years ago why she answers obvious joke or made up questions seriously. She answered that even if the person asking the question didn't have the particular problem that was being asked about, someone in her audience probably did. So I don't think the veracity of the letter at hand is really the point.

That said: what the fuck is Dan Savage's problem?

lydia_gwilt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Savage is clearly just mad that Jezebel gets more readers than he does.

I have no idea if that's true or not, btw, but it's the story I'm sticking with.

BadenBaden

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @Leiakat: And Fred Savage is the voice of Oswald the Octopus... that's what happens when your toddler watches Noggin all the time, you learn these things. It's hard to reconcile that with the psycho he played on Law & Order: SVU.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Ok, here's the timeline:
1) Person writes fake letter asking for advice about a fake rape scenario
2) Dear Abby responds saying the best thing to do is not believe the victim's description of the event and to accuse her of willfully cheating on her husband
3) Feminist bloggers say that Abby's advice was nasty bullshit
4) Dan Savage asserts that feminist bloggers should have ignored Dear Abby's nasty bullshit advice because the letter was fake.

Ok, so Dan Savage likes to beat up on feminists, Dear Abby likes to beat up on rape victims, the letter writer likes to beat off to rape scenarios, I like to beat my head against the wall.

CarrieMC

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Fake or not, Abby's reply was the problem. A national columnist should not be sending the message of, "Women who have been raped are lying about it." Messages like these are exactly what makes the "she was asking for it" mentality so prevalent in our culture. Women are not to blame when they are raped. They are the victims. The only people who should be looked at with distain and disgust in a rape case are the rapists.

Sev

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dear Dan Savage,
Bite me.
xo,
HD

hellodarling!

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I knew we were soul mates Moe. When somebody aggravates me like that, I too have to repeatedly remind people as I get more and more aggravated. I do the same thing if I'm hungry and don't get food, I just start telling everybody "I'm hungry" and it gets louder and louder.

Lymed in Cali

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @special_boots: If I remember correctly, the Bitch column was focusing mostly on Moe's Hilary tears/stupid women voters rant, which a lot of Jezzies got pissed off about too. So loyalties don't have to be completely divided. Or so I tell myself.

@hamburgerhotdog: I'm really curious about that too!

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @jezebellian: NotAbby is apparently pretty slow on the uptake.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Jeez, this must be a testicle thing, because I was suspicious of the letter for different reasons. I'm thinking men can smell each other's bullshit. It would be a different set of circumstances if the woman had written about the sex she thought she'd had with her husband only to find out he never joined her that night and one of his brothers did. Then I'd join you with the hanging rope.

But I hope it's fake. I know shit like this (and worse) happens all the time, but I do hope it's fake. I still shudder from the son whose father was fucking the son's wife for twenty years. It ended when she confessed and then killed herself.

Macloserboy

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Moe! Don't forget the horse he rode in on.

BAngieB

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @ineffable.me: @blondegrlz: I think you have to buy it--or check on their website. I would but I'm blocked.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Lurves you Moe for using "Aaaack!" together with "Fuck fan savage!" I routinely use Aaaack! and Erp! and Derf! in my written communications.

BrutallyHonestBabes

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: What is it? What is it?!

SarahMC

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> He is obviously an annoying little man, as we know the only interesting Savage is Fred.

If feminist blogs are so awful, why are you reading them Danny-boy?

Leiakat

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Links? Website? How do I read this?

BlondeGrlz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: really? is there a link?

ineffable.me

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @special_boots: Word! Whose table am I suppose to sit at during lunch?

Jessi Ramsey

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Yeah, I said it was fake. Lot of people agreed. What we were pissed about is that Abby's response was crappy. Doesn't Dan Savage have some poor trisexual hooker who's into spanking he can go advise?

BlondeGrlz

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @special_boots: It's in the new issue and it was written by a commenter here on the boards. WHO COULD IT BE???

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> It is definitely funny that she just continued to flip about about it all day long.

I've had days and issues like that.

braak

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I love Savage Love, but Dan got this wrong. The advice was read by millions who didn't have Dan's fake-spotting skills, and to them her advice applied to what they imagined as to be a real situation. And her advice was fucked.

A recap: Dear Abby is a shit for the advice, Dan Savage is a shit for not realizing that advice can suck even if the letter was fake.

zivah

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Dan Savage, women are use to faking it...

angryblackgurl

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Wow, this is too funny!

KathrynwithaY loves Joan Collins

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @hamburgerhotdog: Aaack! No way! Why does Bitch hate Jezebel?! Whywhywhywhywhy?!

This is like when two of my awesome friends have a stupid fight and I can't deal with my divided loyalties.

special_boots

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I know we're supposed to be nice and all, but Dan Savage is a giant douchenozzle.

Le Kangourou de Kataroo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Yay Moe!

Pinkosaurus

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> @eleanorstrousers: exactly - even if the letter was fake, if Abby decided to print it, she should give an appropriate response

jezebellian is feeling cranky

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> This is fucking rad.
I hope this is a recurring column.

ineffable.me

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I love that she was still irate at 10:04 pm to shoot off a message from her blackberry. i hope it was a drunken one.

Le Kangourou de Kataroo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I think Abby's advice blew (she abviously took the letter seriously). And on that justification alone, she should quit. Whether or not Dan Savage expects Jezebel to ignore bad advice because the letter is fake is not the issue. The issue is that a female advice columnist told America that if your wife says your brother raped her, she is a liar. That is all.

eleanorstrousers

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Well, then I wouldn't recommend you read this month's Bitch magazine, where you have replaced the Jane Magazine Petty Complains Column.

hamburgerhotdog

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> I wonder if (hope) my email inspired one of these rants!

AndYourLittleDogToo

]]> <![CDATA[Savage Hate]]> Hahaha. I love irrational hatred/rage. Be my friend, Moe.

Rhody

]]>