<![CDATA[ - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[ - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[]]> A friend is ftm transgender. He had the double mastectomy and went on hormones. He elected not to have the lower reconstruction because, as others have said, it isn't that great. However, he did have a hysterectomy because he was still having some menstrual stuff -- spotting, cramps -- despite the hormones.

Here endeth my ability to add anything useful to this conversation.

Syrenia

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @shoebunny: What's more, if an expectant mother (father) has any residual androgens, it can spell major deformities, genetic problems, or even miscarriage!

rhinestonedarling

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @rocknrollunicorn and nerdsausage is in the tank for SATAN: Oh, okay...well then that makes more sense. I guess I didn't read the article closely enough.

ULookinAtMyJunk is the Hate Mitigator

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @redphone2: No, he's not.

Neutralize

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @shoebunny: You are completely and utterly wrong here. Let's put it this way: Thomas Beatie is not the first FtM to give birth, and I know this firsthand. Just the first to talk to The Advocate, apparently.

LAS

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Does anyone know if that's actually a picture of Thomas? It wouldn't surprise me if that's the work of the art department at ABC.

Maxine

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @eleanorstrousers: i like it when jez posts on trans issues, i do, i think it's important; but every time i get ready to read the comments i get really, really nervous. most people are cool, though, which is better than i think would happen on any other gawker site.

BritneyCanadaWhore

]]> <![CDATA[]]> the other night i watched the episode of family guy where peter punches a guy in the face, who turns out to actually be an ugly, manly pregnant woman... could life imitate art? cuz that would be hilarious

wigglepuppy

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kierabs: I grew up in Boring, Oregon. Bend can't even hold a candle.

But then, Drain Oregon kinda wins it all.

Sukie in the Graveyard

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @inchworm: Sorry, my bad, I didn't reference far enough back - I read the Advocate and article but missed the link to the original jezzie post/article.

MOJITOBABY

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @BritneyCanadaWhore: Dude, seriously. And last time the article about this was up, I was just raving about how understanding and openminded everyone was. Obviously, some people had Cranky-O's for breakfast today.

eleanorstrousers

]]> <![CDATA[]]> um did Ronny see him without a shirt on?

thatsrealbutter

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @TheUptightMidwesterner: I thought I read that he had his breasts removed, so no boobies.

pumpkinsoup

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @MOJITOBABY:

from the fact that the original article was talking about how much he paid the first doctor before said doctor refused to continue care due to his discomfort (ie due to being a transphobic asshole)?

you know, the words. i got it from those words typed up on the subject.

inchworm

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @TruculentandUnreliable: i was just thinking the same thing.

@NefariousNewt: and it's HE.

BritneyCanadaWhore

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Wow, there is some ignorant shit in these comments.

TruculentandUnreliable

]]> <![CDATA[]]> a pregnant man? isn't this what we've all been wishing for?

gold_gato

]]> <![CDATA[]]> The beard and baby are not necessarily mutually incompatible. It is my understanding that hair growth from testosterone treatments does not go away when the testosterone does- there are permanent effects from the hormones. If anyone is really interested in the tratment regimens and hormonal details, the Harry Benjamin National Standards of Care for Gender Identity Disorders is available here ([www.symposion.com]).

eleanorstrousers

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @Empresscallipygos: Um, not that I want to give the impression that I actually read taboids or anything, but The Sun has a picture of the expectant Dad, skimpy beard, bump and all.
I, uh, read it for the page 3 girls, I swear.
[www.thesun.co.uk]



MOJITOBABY

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @blackbirdfly: And if that was an accurate depiction of males giving birth, this guy will be birthing either a submarine sandwich, a toy boat, or a two liter soft drink.

blackbirdfly

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Wait -- they're basing their "it's fake" claims on the picture that ran alongside the news stories?

So was I the only one that thought that that picture was just a random "pregnant guy" picture that someone had photoshopped to grab attention? NOWHERE did I see any caption that claimed that it was an actual picture of the actual people concerned.

Empresscallipygos

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I can't help but think of that Cosby Show episode where all the men were pregnant.

blackbirdfly

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @iphisol: Very interesting. I wonder if what sex you start out as has any influence (feminization or masculinization in the womb/during puberty having a lot to do with sensitizing the body to either estrogen or testosterone/DHT). Since guys produce about 50 times more testosterone than women , that could explain early sensitization.

You are right -- different individuals have differing levels of sensitivity to the hormones, resulting in differing levels of facial hair regardless of sex (heck, my husband can't grow a beard at all). I don't think it's an only one-way process (my sis has PCOS and now has no facial hair after having quite a bit, all from just going on the pill), but I agree that the mysteries of the world of hormones are vast and complex, and I can't really tell what's up since I'm not Thomas' endocrinologist. Thanks for sharing your insight ^_^

kimsama

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I'm no doctor, but isn't this "guy" technically still a girl? Why all the hoopla?

redphone2

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @MOJITOBABY: Could be a case of the overcavaliers, for sure. For one thing - I kinda thing you need to pick a gender. And then maybe stick with it? Can't have it all, dude.

zivah

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @inchworm: Where exactly are you getting that large sums of cash to doctors angle? Since both parties are withholding details, this may or may not have been done under a doctor's auspices, so I don't think it's really clear. The fact that he now has a MD that's confirming pregnancy doesn't mean one was advising or monitoring him all along.

MOJITOBABY

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @HannahBethD: Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. All my "hair in places I would rather not have it" is intact, sadly, and I am 32 weeks pregnant. Of course, I don't have a big, bushy beard. I also thought that some women actually grow more hair in odd places when pregnant.

LilahCello

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @That_little_attention_whore: But it didn't always end well. Wasn't there an athlete that finally turned male because they were fucking her up so bad with the steroids?

Elisheva

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @MOJITOBABY:

T doesn't linger forever. you have NO idea how long he has been off of it. given the fact that the initial article was about the LARGE SUMS OF CASH DROPPED on doctors, it's pretty clear that they were monitoring his T levels before inseminating. so, no, not cavalier in any extreme.

inchworm

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @caitlinnn: There's been no mention of fertility drugs, he claimed he just stopped taking testosterone, and started menstruating again.

But there's a reason that transgenders are warned against pregnancy after undergoing intensive hormone therapy - since he's supposed to be having a girl, there's a risk she might be born with a really enlarged clitoris, among other genital abnormalities, due to the fact that testosterone doesn't just vanish overnight. So I can't be all warm and fuzzy about this - if true, man, these people are really cavalier in the extreme.

MOJITOBABY

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @Sukie in the Graveyard: Don't you mean off-tit news? (boom-tish)

SydneyGal

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @tasia: If he was taking fertility drugs (which would make sense with the cancellation of the testosterone therapy and sudden increase in estrogen to try to get pregnant) it absolutely makes sense for them to initially conceive triplets - check out Jon & Kate Gosselin for example - fertility drugs gave them EIGHT BABIES! Two the first time SIX THE NEXT!

Personally, I believe this story whole-heartedly and wish them a happy, healthy baby. Pfft to the haters!

feminatheism

]]> <![CDATA[]]> *Uh, first dozen years post-puberty. Awkward.

iphisol

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kimsama: I am kind of with you and kind of not. As a trans lady who spent her first dozen years all full of testosterone, and who still has to shave every morning because I can't afford to have somebody shoot lasers at my face to fix it, I know a thing or two about beard hair.

Well, I really only know one thing, and that is that once it's there, it doesn't really go away. Body hair everywhere else thins out, yeah, but for some reason facial hair, fueled by T, reaches terminal... something, terminal density, terminal hirsutity, terminal something like that. I forget the exact term. But once that happens, it's... I don't want to say "matured," because that has creepy implications, but I can't think of any other words. Then it won't thin out to peach fuzz- it only goes one way.

Which doesn't mean that something strong like chemo won't kill it- just that, once testosterone turns it into a beard, replacing testosterone with estrogen won't turn it back.

Anyway, I don't trust anybody's neighbors to be in charge of whether anybody's pregnant. The only reason this would get published is because trans people are so mysterious and undiscovered (puke)- what if literally any non-trans person in the world were pregnant, and their neighbor called ABC news like "clearly she is not pregnant?"

iphisol

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kimsama: I bow down to your superior hair/hormone/pregnancy knowledge. And yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if the picture was doctored.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @cate3710: Dude, but that's not four months of beard growth (if he'd just retained the hair from pre-pregnancy). And yes, the hair would fall out and be replaced with finer, lighter hair (the peachfuzz ladies usually have on their faces), becoming patchy and then fading completely.

But since he had an ectopic pregnancy before, that means that he's been off male hormones for more than 4 months, probably closer to a year (since 1st pregnancy was far enough along to cause complications, revealing it to be ectopic, and then the surgical intervention -- which was severe enough to cause the loss of a fallopian tube -- probably took some time to recover from before pregnancy #2).

Hair is remarkably fast-growing and turnover is high (that's why chemo patients lose hair in addition to the fast-growing cancer cells). Even if my estimate of a year is off, in a more conservative 6 months, I would expect that nearly all the facial hair would have fallen out.

I am not so dubious of his claim of pregnancy, as it's entirely possible, but I am dubious of the picture. I think it's doctored for effect -- as others have said, I don't know anyone who showed that much at 4 months, and facial hair to the degree it appears in the picture (not just PCOS level) would be nigh on impossible.

kimsama

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @ceejeemcbeegee (just debatin' not hatin'): I was on the East German track and field team. They gave out steroids as you do Gatorade. But I assure you, I am all woman.

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kansasgirl: the Governator, of course

GatorGirl

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Dude, the media is bitchy to this guy. Why doubt their family? Do you really care? Leave him alone! This poor kid is gonna have teasing issues, to say the least.

Tiny-Moves

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Because being a pregnant trans-male is sooo glamorous and easy.

oryx

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I just have to add that I love the name of the town: Bend, Oregon. Sounds like "bend o'er again." And I, for some reason, think that's hilarious.

kierabs

]]> <![CDATA[]]> By the way his picture is on the advocate website

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @tasia:It may have nothing to do with him but the journalist doing the story.I don't know what proof he has to do to prove he is pregnant. I'll remain neutral because it could be false but it could also be true.@shoebunny:I know that. I was referring to people who thought he had all of that removed.

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I hope that this isn't a hoax. But as someone with PCOS and all the hairiness that goes along with it, the stubble in the photo did make me a little suspicious, since more testosterone=less chance for pregnancy.

robotitron

]]> <![CDATA[]]> i was a non-believer at 1st - the hormones, the body's inability to be pregnant unless healthy - but then i thought about all of those crack babies that are born to women who only consume drugs, semen and jack daniels, and about Nicole Richie's negative body fat body being able to have a baby, and i thought - eh, maybe. who knows? bizarreo tho.

HappyinaCapsule

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @mwynn13: According to Beatie, his wife had fertility problems and couldn't conceive.

jenny_dreadful

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I'm still trying to figure out why the male half of the couple is the one who is pregnant- isn't that generally the woman's job?

mwynn13

]]> <![CDATA[]]> My dad had that size of gut, then he had his hernia operation and everything was fine, no babies in there.

FairhairedOptimist

]]> <![CDATA[]]> At first, I was thinking, "okay, cool, challenge some stereotypes." After reading the Advocate article, though, I'm all about being skeptical. At one point, right after saying that they did a home insemination (so no eggs transfered or anything), he says, "When I finally got pregnant for the first time, I ended up having an ectopic pregnancy with triplets. It was a life-threatening event that required surgical intervention, resulting in the loss of all embryos and my right fallopian tube."

THAT's just too fucking unbelievable:
1) a man with women's reproductive organs--totally fine.
2) home insemination--also totally fine.
3) ectopic pregnancy--happens to the best of us.
4) with fucking TRIPLETS?--I don't even think so.

If these people are trying to "challenge some stereotypes" and he's NOT pregnant, they've given transgendered folks not only a bad name, but a flippin' crazy one, too. Great.





tasia

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @tetragami: hahaha, no, I was referring to the craiglist posting that offered a baby for sale (under the name of a grandmother from Lebanon) for meth money.

Sukie in the Graveyard

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @HannahBethD: true. but as someone who struggled with PCOS and the resulting hairiness and fertility struggle, i think it might be safe to say that it's harder for a hairy lady to get pregnant.

as far as this transman goes, i don't see what's so remarkable. he has henparts still, henparts that work. so he's biologically female and his getting pregnant is hardly a miracle or whatever. i am happy to go along with his desire to be called a man, but i don't think it's AMAZING SUPER WOW that he's having a baby. i find it...odd that he considers himself a "surrogate", but you know, gender politics--they're whack-a-doo!

clitoryss

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @shoebunny: No, I've never been/tried to get pregnant. And obviously he's chock full of estrogen and progesterone right now and not taking testosterone. But once the hair is there, I'm not sure that the change in hormones would make it go away. Maybe make it finer, but disappear altogether?

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @dcdulce:I suspect God rolls his eyes when these folks start "quoting" him.

Bindarra

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @cate3710: I'm guessing you and tranquilmademoiselle either haven't tried to get pregnant or are young and unencumbered by PCOS and the like. You need more than a uterus to maintain a pregnancy- you need estrogen and progesterone- enough to at least temporarily resolve testosterone-caused hirsutism.

shoebunny

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I don't take testosterone and I have hair on my belly and a few places on my chest and face. And my choir teacher in high school had some serious stubble and she able to have children. I'm no doctor, but I don't think hairiness is an indicator of whether your reproductive organs are working.

HannahBethD

]]> <![CDATA[]]> But not everyone believes Beatie's story. Some of his neighbors expressed indredulity.

"Quite frankly, I think it's a hoax," Beatie's neighbor Ron Schlieper said. "I saw him a few days ago, and he didn't look like that."

Another Bend resident, Josh Love, said, "I couldn't say that he looks pregnant. I can stick my stomach out and almost make it look like that. I think it's kind of bizarre. I don't know if I believe it or not."

My favorite part of local news is the "man on the street" interview. It always brings so much insight to a story!

Also - I dated a guy who could stick out his stomach so far he looked pregnant. He used to do it once in a while to gross me out. He was (and is) a skinny dude.

He is not to be confused with a dude I dated who did look pregnant or at least like he was smuggling a six-pack (beer, not abs).

I like 'em all shapes and sizes, but I do prefer the not-pregnant ones.

kansasgirl

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @gra: I'm with you, Gra. Talking about such a controversial event doesn't seem like the best policy. I won't be surprised if this is a hoax.

Bindarra

]]> <![CDATA[]]> If I'm suspicious of anything, it's that the photo of him and his pregnant belly was allegedly taken a month ago, when he was 4 months pregnant. I'm 4 months pregnant right now and I'm nowhere near as big as that. And I'm HUGE for 4 months.

MeanSpirited

]]> <![CDATA[]]> comments on the ABC site are crazy...god, please protect me from your followers!

dcdulce

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Tranquil, I do know what a transmale is, thanks. I also know that the bulk of the alteration in a non-surgical reassignment is achieved with hormone therapy. I'm pretty sure he would have to stop taking testosterone--the thing that enables him to be hairy--in order to support the pregnancy.

MissHathaway

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @MissHathaway: Couldn't the facial hair be left over from when he was on T? It's not like it's going to fall out when he stops the hormones, and I could see how maintaining a visible symbol of maleness would be reassuring for him.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[]]> This isn't all that uncommon. Patrick (formerly Pat) Califia and his ftm partner had a baby a few years ago, his partner went off hormones and had the baby.

And btw, every trans person I know, doesn't like being called 'transmale' or 'transfemale'. I think a straight up 'tranny' is preferable to that, but best of all would be if y'all just used 'he' or 'she', based on their gender of choice.

MissBickers

]]> <![CDATA[]]> If I was a pregnant transmale, I would not talk to the press about it. Obviously he and his wife are allowed to tell whoever they want and they shouldn't get shit for it, but I wouldn't want to deal with it... especially if I was pregnant! Stress.levels.rising just thinking about it!

gra

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @rocknrollunicorn: ...

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I had no idea that his neighbors were medical doctors...oh wait they aren't. Why tell the public this? It doesn't affect them and if this couple are making the story up it will come out with them running their mouths.I think the neighbors are looking for attention@MissHathaway: He's a transmale. You do realize that he still has a uterus?

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[]]> my dark heart felt for this guy and his wife's lack of medical/family/community support reading that article so i will be pissed if this is a hoax!

pink_orchid_martini

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @nerdsausage is in the tank for SATAN: Since I was first, you owe me the coke.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @rocknrollunicorn: jinx!

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @Sukie in the Graveyard: You wouldn't happen to be referring to the idiots who "thought that because it appeared on the Internet it was true," and proceeded to ransack a house?

[blogs.pcworld.com]

tetragami

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @ulookinatmyjunk: Beatie never did the "bottom work". His genitals are still female. It's a common enough choice among transmen, because the surgery for female to male is still pretty primitive.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @ulookinatmyjunk: He did not get the sexual reassignment surgery -- he was on testosterone, but opted to keep his original junk intact.

rocknrollunicorn

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I will bet dollars to donuts that Ron Schlieper has given massive amounts of money to either The 700 Club or the GOP in recent years.

I wish people would get off this dude's ass. All they want is a family. I knew as soon as it hit the major national news outlets that this couple would be in for a shitstorm. And so it starts.

GodOfBiscuits

]]> <![CDATA[]]> I guess I don't see why anyone would bother pulling off a hoax like this in the first place. This isn't Ahnold, for god's sake, it's someone who has an actual uterus & all the rest of the female equipment downstairs. The transguy part is an interesting angle, but it's not like this is something scientifically unique.

Legalese

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @andBegorrah: I Was A Pregnant Man And Then I Wasn't But I Really Was: The Thomas Beatie Story

Speaking as someone who grew up in Oregon, it would not at all surprise me if someone in Bend had a shady agenda. It's not a bastion of tolerance or good cheer.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Won't his boobies kind of start growing back too?

This is so very confusing for me, it kind of makes my head hurt.

TheUptightMidwesterner

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Okay, I'm not up on my sexual reassignment surgery knowledge. But if was he artificially inseminated and his vagina's been reconstructed into a penis. How did they gain access? Isn't it kind of "closed off"?

ULookinAtMyJunk is the Hate Mitigator

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kansasgirl: Adam Baldwin. Or maybe Tom Arnold.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @kansasgirl: Did you not see Junior?! It was an Arnie classic!

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @MissHathaway: Right. I'm a perfectly healthy gal, but years of the pill left me hormonally imbalanced- I'm finally (sustainably) pregnant now, two years after going off the damn thing. No way a hormonal structure which allows one to have a beard also allows one to support a fetus.

shoebunny

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @andBegorrah: You are so right.

Who's going to play the pregnant man?

kansasgirl

]]> <![CDATA[]]> @noseriously: We have a crazy lady neighbor who recently called our landlord to tell him that we needed our exhaust vent cleaned out. So it seems like she was UP ON OUR TOWNHOUSE ROOF acting all crazy, literally all up in our business.

I know, it's not related, but Crazytown is Everytown.

noseriously

]]> <![CDATA[]]> This is going to make for the best Lifetime Original Movie ever.

andBegorrah

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Is that facial hair in the wee little picture? I'm pretty sure a that a woman can't grow a fetus and stubble at the same time. Like Nicole Kidman and her Botox, Tom would have to give up the testosterone kickers.

MissHathaway

]]> <![CDATA[]]> But will they name the baby Junior?

ceejeemcbeegee

]]> <![CDATA[]]> If you want another link to the story - this is from the local news website, KATU.
[www.katu.com]

Oregon has some off-tilt news stories lately...


Sukie in the Graveyard

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Sorry, not going to believe it until s/he gives birth. Too easy to fake.

NefariousNewt

]]> <![CDATA[]]> Or the Bree Van de Kamp of transmales?

Eeva

]]> <![CDATA[]]> My God, leave the pregnant man ALONE! Is there no raving psycho who will threaten violence to the bullies of the pregnant man?

OK. I will. I am little but mean, mean, mean.

noseriously

]]>