<![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary? - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary? - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: We can agree to disagree here, but I don't believe that Obama gets the working class vote over McCain. And I'm not just listening to what the Clintons say in terms of the working class vote, I'm looking at the polls and she's won that demo consistently.

And the Wright thing would have come out eventually (been covered in the Chicago papers for a little while, I believe). The right would have done FAR more with it than Clinton ever would have (not to mention - it was the press that went crazy with that one - hardly Clintons fault).

You mentioned being tired of people insinuating that Obama is some demi-god. Well, I'm tired of people blaming the Clintons for everything. How is it her fault that Obama's reverend said those things? He got involved with a leader in his community b/c that's what he had to do to get elected. I personally don't hold that against him since it's POLITICS. But there are ramifications for some of the rings you have to kiss & he had to take his medicine. That has nothing to do with Hillary.

marin79

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @IBinMN: I really dislike the constant insinuation we think our candidate is some sort of demi-God. We just think he's better than Hillary, I know Carville thinks she's Jesus, but the rest of us don't. And I expect constant, dirty tactics-from REPUBLICANS. Heaven forbid that I expect a Democratic candidate try to stand for some of the party values, especially one that was smeared by Republicans for so long. Instead of rejecting their tactics as bad for politics, she's absorbed them and thrown them at her opponent. If these attacks were coming from a republican, Obama could get traction because a) he doesn't HAVE to handle them with the kid gloves he has to use with Hillary and b) he would have the force of the Democratic Party behind him. Do you think the Wright fiasco would have been as big if he had already been presumptive nominee and had Pelosi, Dean, and yes, Clinton out there slugging for him? Definetly not. Hillary is hobbling him and preventing him from getting the protection ANY candidate needs to run against the opposition.

@Magister: Yes, he is friends with Hillary, and therefore I need backup for all his "Obama is secretly evil, muahaha' stories. And as a former Christian lemme tell you comparing Richardson to Judas is fucking over the top insanity. Just think about it, if Richardson is Judas, Hillary is God. Does that not sound ridiculous to you? Benedict Arnold would have been more appropriate, equally stupid, and less offensive.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): I only read Kos when somebody links there. It, Huffington and the Politico have never excited me because there's just too many comments and it's hard to have a conversation.

I have started reading TPM over the past couple of months and occasionally I post something to the Cafe, which is what I've done this morning on the subject of Hillary dropping out.

The gist of the thing for anyone who doesn't want to click over is that the contested races are increasing the Democratic rolls, so I feel that they're doing more good than harm, plus I've mixed-in some of what I said earlier.

As a general rule, I really don't read many political blogs because I don't care that much about what other people think. I'm an arrogant bastard, who insists on forming his own opinions, but the negative discourse is still very hard to escape.

@nerdsausage is in the tank for SATAN: James Carville works for CNN. He is friends with Hillary (and he knows a lot of people from both sides of the aisle), but he doesn't work for her campaign and he's someone who is employed for ratings.

Because of his religion, I can certainly understand why Judas was on his mind, but I'm not a religious person and it's just words to me.

Magister

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: You are right. He definitely has a history of doing very well when he has time to campaign in a given state.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge: If you can site a link or something to source your claims...I'll take a look at it. You tend to get all crazy and start throwin crazy shit around, yo. For reals.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> You know, it's going to be very interesting, and a little sad, when the supporters of one of our Democratic candidates get a double dose of grim reality.

The first dose will likely come when they realize that their candidate is a mere human who has flaws and weaknesses that can and will be exploited by the Republicans. In this, I think they have some serious disappointment on the way.

The second dose of reality is going to come in the form of learning what a real political fight looks like. For those who haven't experienced it, I can promise you, any divisiveness we have seen by both (yes, both) Democratic candidates is going to seem like a church picnic compared to what the Republicans have planned for us.

I just hope our nominee is strong enough to take it, because this crap is speeding toward us like a freight train. And I don't think telling John McCain that he shouldn't be so mean and nasty, is going to cut it.

IBinMN

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @marin79: I'm in PA and I've seen the working class respond very favorably to his Chicago activist roots. With the time he has it is very possible for him to make inroads with that group, he has already proven himself in working-class, white predominant states, the Clinton campaign just likes to overlook them. If anything, Hillary will have a harder time winning that group versus McCain than Obama. And in his townhall meetings, etc he is very comfortable develing deep into policy in his Q&A sessions, this is where he wins people. In fact, it was an early criticism of his campaign, that he went into too much detail and was too pendantic. He knows when to use what very effectively.

@SinisterRouge: Obama has only gotten better at debates while Clinton uses the same lines. And if you think he's not going to go hogwild with all the crap she's slung over the last months you're very much underestimating him.

And please look up the resolution to the NAFTA-Obama story. He has already been been completely cleared of the prior insinuations and Canadian gov is already on a witch hunt to cream someone for starting it in the first place. High level Canadian officials have said in actuality Hillary's campaign was the one sending soothing signals, not Obama. And Hillary has done nothing but spin NAFTA. She claims she was critical when she has A) gone out and campaigned for it B) approved of it in her book and C) cheerleaded while First Lady for it according to her own released records. If that's 'skeptical' I don't know what 'enthusiastically support' is.

@Political Party Girl: Is this the same Carville who called Bill Richardson Judas for endorsing Obama? Find a less biased source for that story and maybe I'll believe it.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Also, James Carville said Obama had TONS of people in Lansing (MI's capital) lobbying the state legislature AGAINST a re-vote. That is soooo skeezy.

Political Party Girl

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: And the debates? It's his absolute worst format and he knows it. Amazing that you still cling to that he does well there. He doesn't. It's a known weakness.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): Again. Look it up. No they didn't. They were to not campaign in MI. They DID NOT have to remove their name off the ballot. Obama CHOSE to do so. Big difference. And if you look at anything Nafta related you'll see that she has not hidden from it and it only specifically hurt him because he got caught talking to the Canadiens. I mean, this is FACT. It's not some twisting of the truth. And again, they CHOSE to take their name off the ballot in MI, they absolutely DID NOT have to do it based on DNC rules.

Oh my. Let him win the nomination if he gets votes. But geez. Y'all are bending over backwards and bending the truth. That's all I ask. Look at things with some semblance of truthfulness. Be willing to at least be critical of Obama whom you support in some truthful way. Because you do him a disservice by acting as though he's been perfect. He certainly has not. Not even close.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: This Hillbot does not compute your sarcasm. Not programed with humor. (How do you not know this by now?)

marin79

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: I'm sorry, but I think you're kidding yourself if you really think Obama is going to be able to get in and reach the working class Dems - esp in PA. His platform of hope & change isn't concrete enough for that group. He's tried to talk policy, but it hasn't been consistent enough in my opinion. Try as he might, but I don't believe he's ever going to make much headway there. If he's the nom, I think a lot of that vote goes McCain... which is unfortunate considering working class Dems are a huge base for us.

Also I'm SO TIRED of listening to people I know call her divisive - when, in reality, they're both doing a good job on that one. Obama has been out there screaming about how divisive she is & how the party will be ruined, which, oh wait, is in itself divisive. He just wants her out of the race & unfortunately for him, there are a ton of voters who disagree. He could have closed the deal in TX & OH, but he didn't. He only has himself to blame there, so I don't have much sympathy for him.

And regardless if this goes on, I believe most Dems will rally around the eventual nominee. I know all the polls that say x amount of Obama or Hillary supporters won't vote for the other candidate, but I think a lot of those people are answering in the heat of the moment. I'm a strident Dem & I've even had moments of total frustration where I think about writing in my candidate anyway, but in reality, there's no way I'll actually do that. So I tend to discount these polls anyway. We'll get it together eventually - at least, that's my hope (see Hillary supporters get that feeling also! :)

marin79

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: Mmm, it is good that it happened NOW and he had time to give that amazing speech. I think even the media will be sick of it by the time April 22nd approaches and PA will too. Don't forget he gets to throwdown with her about all her bullshit in the debates before PA. She can't spin her way out of it like she did with her bitchtatic 'choirs will sing' crap last time.

And yes, it was bitchy, and insulting, and not in a good way. She has continually smacked down not only Obama, but his supporters. She is definetly the more divisive of the two.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: I was much more optimistic about PA before the Rev Wright fiasco. Still, I hope you are correct and that he holds/improves his ground. Don't underestimate her though, she might cry again the night before the election and get more of those sympathy votes.

(I'm kidding Hilbots- don't attack me or I might get all girly and cry. Or worse, I might get 'shrill' and not be 'likeable enough.')

STICKSnSCONES

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: and before I get lit on fire by 'seem' I mean just that, stereotypical overview of another race.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): Two minorities competing for the same crap jobs and black people seem to be the lazier, welfare prone self-entitled side. The animosity between us is ridiculous when we should be joining up together to take it to the Man. *sigh*

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge: Why do the latinos dislike the black folks so much?

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: It's unlikely she will beat Barack in PA by anymore than she beat him in Ohio, again leading to her gaining like 5 delegates. And the longer Barack has to get in there and tell his stories about working for the working class in Chicago, they'll like them. He wouldn't have even lost OH by that much if the NAFTA lies hadn't gone a-circulating like they did.

@SinisterRouge: I'm sorry, but I fail to see how abiding by the rules handed down by the Democratic party is 'playing the game.' The demographics of MI strongly favor Obama. Clinton carried there A) because there was no one else to vote for (imagine that) and B) name recognition. While Obama might loe FL in a revote, he would make a game of it in MI. Especially now that NAFTAgate has now been revealed to be the Clinton's and not him. Auto workers would not be amused.

I'm glad some people appreciate my text of doom ;P

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge: She got 55% against "uncommitted".

Sounded like a resounding endorsement to me.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge: Have to correct you on the michigan ballot. They all pledged to remove their names and then HRC didn't. That's what happened.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge: I hear ya. And I think you're right about FL. My fam lives there and I think she'd beat him, resoundingly, worse than Ohio even.

His style doesn't translate well for the backwater folks, nor for the Cuban and latin vote in Central and South Florida either, which doesn't bode well for a FL dem win in the GE.

And it's totes not over yet anyway. If she beats him terribly in PA then the supedelegate factor looms ahead...more fun to come.

STICKSnSCONES

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Dems taking shots at each other...blech. It's like I made a horrible mistake and logged onto Salon instead.

ramblinrosie

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: Oh I agree. A revote will not happen. And whoever is ahead at the end gets to choose whether or not to seat those delegates. And it'll probably be Obama. And he can seat them once he's the nom. I don't blame him at all for fighting the revotes. I'm just saying had he won those states...he'd probably want them to count. That's all. All I'm saying is They are politicking . Doing what they need to do to win. I get that completely. It's the unfair portrayal that HRC is somehow doing "dirtier" campaigning than him. That's completely false. It was strategic for him to take his name off the ballot. It makes sense. It was strategic for him to wait out the clock and have no revotes. (And revotes are perfectly within the rules if the DNC approves them). That's what I'm saying. They both play the game. And it's nonsense to act as though she's trying to bend rules and he's abiding by them. They're in a dogfight for the nomination. And they are both acting accordingly.

And what are you talking about with "stealing" votes in MI?? He agreed to a split of 50/50 when she got 55% of the vote. I'd rather it not count than for him to get any of the votes that were cast for her. And my only point about either MI or FL not counting...is that it might be trouble for him in the GE. Since about 25% of Florida voters said they'd ditch the party if their votes don't count toward the nomination. It's all games, baby. And good on him for playing it well. But he's definitely playin'.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: Hey Sin. There's no freaking out going on (not by me anyway). And what's your point about the Edwards/Obama campaigning? Back at that stage of the game MOST people thought HRC was a shoe-in. There's nothing conniving about taking your name off the ballot when YOU KNOW THE VOTES WON'T COUNT.

See that's the point, everyone agreed and knew beforehand and acted accordingly. Strategically a loss that doesn't "count" looks bad just as a "win" that doesn't count still looks good. So everyone acted under the premise that it wouldn't count but still tried to do what was best politically. I have no problems with this- as you said that's politics.

Now trying to make those votes count after the fact- that's not politics- that's deliberate underhanded dismissal of the rules. The rules are void apparently only when they don't favor Hil.

And now her supporters have been complaining about the role of the caucus votes. Really? 'Cause those votes are legit. There's no reason to think they are not. They are a valid means of obtaining delegates for every other election, so why not now?

And if she feels splitting FL and MI 50/50 isn't good then she should reject the split and abide by the rules she AGREED TO AT THE START not demand a haphazard last minute revote. So whatever. But funny how she's perfectly fine 'stealing' Obama's votes in MI from an election that didn't count, but she won't split them evenly so that neither candidate has an advantage.

As I said before, I don't think any of those delgates should be seated. We fucked up and made rules that ultimately are biting us in the ass. So we have to deal.

And if it's totally political that he doesn't want revotes for the reason you say, well then I'm with you-Go Barack. Way to play the game, homey. Maybe you're more ready for Day 1 than Hil thinks bc you're beating her on every front that counts. So yay! You're the one I want answering that 3am phone call.

STICKSnSCONES

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: if that state was new york then i'll be concerned. but clinton did not beat barack by huge margins in most of the blue states that she won, but he beat her by double digits in some. THAT should be a cause of concern for hillary hopefuls. barack will take the big blue states that hillary won (NY, CA).

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> oh good lord.

HRC / BO : ok

chris matthews = a big douche.

and that's all i've got.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: And he wants no revotes because he'll get his ass handed to him in those two states again. But I totes understand where he's coming from. Had he won both those states, he'd want them seated as is right away. But again, that's politics. And he's got the upper hand. I don't begrudge his moves. Nor HRC's. It's the whole "he's squeaky clean" part that really grates. Since he's clearly not. He's GASP, a politician of the same variety as every other motherfuckin one. ;)

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: And um giving him a 50/50 split on any delegates from either MI or FL is literally stealing votes he did not get.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @STICKSnSCONES: Oh please. You realize that he campaigned with Edwards and the others to take his name off the MI ballot in order to make a win there for HRC meaningless? That it was NOT EVER in the rules that they had to take their name off the ballot? That he CHOSE to do that because he KNEW he'd lose there?? I mean, COME THE FUCK ON. I have no problem with the games being played by both sides. That's politics. But the idea that he's done nothing and HRC is trying to scam her way into the nom is just beyond ridiculous. Seriously, it's like you've never seen a political campaign before. I understand Barry got new people voting, but shit, apparently they've neve seen an election either.

I'm all for fair. Whoever has the most votes, wins. And it looks like it's Barry. So what's the problem? Why are you all freaking out?? He's 90% sure to get the nom. You don't need to make up lies and bullshit about HRC in order for that to keep happening. Just get him some more votes. He'll be all set. Then it's on to McCain.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: I have no problem with how the delegates were allocated and that's not what I said AT ALL. It's odd and strange but them's the rules. So that's fine. My point was that Barry will for sure have a hard time getting the nom if he doesn't ALSO win the popular vote. Which he's currently also ahead in...so why so worried. And I get the math. Did I say the rules were unfair? No. All I said was that she won the popular vote in TX. Which SHE DID. So settle down there sweets...your boy still gets the nom barring some "miracle" or what have you. And then there's the GE. But that's a whole 'nother story.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: YES to all of your comments in this thread. I totes appreciate your 'walls of text';) Above, you espoused the Hillary Clinton 'By Any Means Neccessary' approach to WINNING!! Yay!!

I love how she didn't care about the FL and MI delegates before the race got tight, but noooooooow she is all about getting their 'voices' heard.

My jaw dropped when she said counting the votes 'as is' was one of the FAIR ways to handle the situation. There's absolutely NO WAY she'd think it was fair if she felt like she'd lose those elections. Personally, I think she'd take FL but not MI, but whatever. Claiming that seating those dels without a revote is in any way fair is a telling example that she's just trying to better her numbers. It has nothing to do with the people, only the votes. And then accusing Obama of not caring about the voter's will because he didn't jump on the first revote plan tossed out? What? Seriously?

Because if we go with her 'as is' suggestion- all the people that would've voted for him in MI had he been on the BALLOT go unheard. So hypocritical. Fairness apparently is all about her winning. It's all relative to her.

STICKSnSCONES

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: As Bill Clinton helped WRITE the TX two-step legislation and had no issues when he won there during his two runs, I hardly see how suddenly pulling out a popular vote argument is fair now. Hillary can only pull ahead in the 'popular' vote if you ignore caucuses, which is ridiculous. If Hillary felt caucuses were a great disservice to the world she could have been trying to fix that BEFORE she was losing. She has 35 years of experience right? So she should pretty damn well know how to run for president without bitching the rules don't favor her AFTER she loses. That ignores the fact, you know, it's almost impossible for her to win the popular vote now in the first place.

The whole point of delegates is that we don't fuck small states with the will of one overly large one, but that's what the Clinton supporters want now, right? Fuck Kansas, Washington, Iowa, etc, only NY, CA and FL matter? Our founding fathers did a lot of backflips to ensure, you know, that DIDN'T happen.

She agreed to these rules happily when she thought she had no competition. No one was complaining. Saying the rules are 'unfair' after you start losing horribly and throwing mini-tantrums to get your way would not be tolerated from any other candidate other than Clinton. Your 'he might fuck up' or the 'she may possibly, with 1% chance pull it out according to whatever metric we decide is most convenient, today' argument is very reminiscent of Huckabee's 'I don't major in math, I major in miracles' bullshizza. He got sneered at by Jezebels and media alike and he got minimal attention and mostly as 'that nutjob still running'. But low and behold, the Clintons still get face time like they're legit. Insane.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective: Seriously, I know that Obama rules claim that it's only a delegate fight, but um, he'll have a hard time getting the nom if he doesn't win the popular vote. And ya know, WINNING more votes in a state usually determines the winner. But we'll see. So far he's ahead there too. But you're gonna have trouble in Denver if he loses the popular vote and still gets the nom. And it's no "interpretation" actually, that is a matter of fact. She got MORE VOTES in TX. As in, MORE people voted for her.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Erm. lets lay off the partisanship. A politician is a politician is a politician. If you are still looking for black and white answers (which this campaign is eerily looking like), you are going to feel pretty sore in eighteen months whatever the outcome.

@MadameOvary: I love the cliff analogy, but I would add that neither see it coming. The GOP is too busy counting their coffers while the Dems are distracted patting their own backs.

Uglyshoe

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @marin79: is ur week any better, sweets?

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): @SinisterRouge on Notice!: Lol! I have been MIA on the political threads lately since I've only been reading economic news!

I practically missed the whole Wright thing! (Took a little break like Moe apparently thinks my girl, Hill, has too!) I didn't realize it was nearly as big of a deal as some people are saying (I was listening to an ardent Obama supporter tell me tonight that he thought it could be the end of Obama). But as all of this stuff, I think the media will be on the next controversy in a matter of days, so I'll just catch that one!

But this is probably a good lesson in terms how much the average person pays attention to some of this stuff! (And given how much the media loves to pounce on every perceived gaffe in this election, that's probably a good thing!)

marin79

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective:Some of them are confusing. We really need work on that.

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: simmer down my sweet.
What's your poison tonight? Are you and Mr. Rouge making a night of it tonight?

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @amoureuse is here because of Ashley!: oh God. How did I see a comment like that coming? Let's keep this a discussion and an educated and mature one at that.

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> victories in these primaries/caucuses are not meant for interpretation like some hillary supporters on this board are mistaken to believe. one person wins more delegates and that person is the winner. popular vote just like in the REAL election don't mean shit.

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!:

You know that's not what upset me. I and every other person that was watching the polls and the candidates behavior knew Obama was losing Ohio. It was TX that was a tossup.

I refuse to be sucked into your vortex of negativity.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> the last time i checked, popular vote doesn't matter. obama won more delegates and thus beat her. name one state that obama won popular vote but not delegates and that victory was afforded to him and then we have an argument for bias

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective: Hillary WON the popular vote in TX AND the primary. Obama won the caucus and more delegates. So yeah, she WON the actual VOTES. But Obama rules apply I suppose and he won everything always every time. He rules.

@cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): Um, no. I was doing none of those things. You just freaked the fuck out because Ohio people had the audacity not to vote for Obama. And you called them racist. Which is what everyone that doesn't vote for Obama is called these days. That's why he'll lose PA too. Cuz of racists.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @nerdsausage is in the tank for SATAN:
To be clear...you are permitted to talk trash about Chris Matthews...just not LIBELOUS trash.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: umm, hillary lost texas. obama won more delegates. just a correction.

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @nerdsausage is in the tank for SATAN: Oh...don't get me started.

Yeah...he's a grouchy old man that has made some sexist comments. But on the whole he is the only guy in the MSM that has been calling the Bush administration on their horrible behavior...even before it was fashionable.

He doesn't get much on style points...but on the whole he gets a lot of respect from me for standing up when the rest of the media was too spineless to do so.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): What the hell is wrong with talking libelous trash about Chris Matthews? Tweety's a douche with a hysterical fear of icky girls. He sucks.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Can we all agree on one thing???

Geraldine Ferraro has the most FUCKED UP hair!!!

I can't stop looking at it. She is like Trent Lott with a vadge.

Please Gerry...if you're listening...

Resolve the haircut Pinnochio

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: You was dismissing folks voting against obama because he was black and you were talking significant libelous trash about Chris Matthews.

Your brown ass had to be administered to...

I'm sure you would be fun to have a drink with...but I think you are thinking of someone else. You are in NYC and I'm in Chicago.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): Marin is stressing out about the economy,...yo! ;0

Oh also you can totally have notice. If you want it. XOXO (for reals, it's kind of funny at this point right????)

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @MadameOvary: Oh I'm sure by October or so I'll not be so off the rails about this...and I'm sure Obama will come back around and appeal to me when he's fighting McCain instead of Hills. Just right now he's pissing me off. But I've been a Dem all my life. That will not change. I'll most likely be pulling that lever for him if he's the nom (which he probably will be). If there's one thing I hate...it's fucking filthy scummy old Republicans.

@cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): Totes. I'm the nutty one here right? LOL. I thought we were sharing margaritas back in Feburary. :(

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Where's Marin?

I miss Marin.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: All I'm trying to say, but not sure am being heard, is that any Dem who says I'm not going to vote for X because I love Y, and vice versa, is being something of a childish ass. If all these Dems who have been energized by this campaign don't go out and trample the GOP back into the ground from which these trogdolytes [sp?] came, than we are in for more war and more deficit. I am a pessimist who is for Sen. Obama, though I will certainly vote for Sen. Clinton should she become the nominee, no matter how that may happen. I do think that Sen. O is the START of a change, not the entire change, but just the beginning, to get us rolling in the right direction. Mostly, I think the GOP drives us over the cliff at 100 miles an hour, while the Dems drive us over the cliff at 50 miles an hour, giving us a chance to enjoy the scenery, but we're still going over that damn cliff.

MadameO asks - WWOD?

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> TO ALL OBAMA SUPPORTERS

YOUR ASININE ASSES HAVE BEEN PUT ON NOTICE BY THE BROWN ASS OF HER FIERCENESS SINISTER ROUGE FOR CHILDISH COMMENTS AND NASTY BEHAVIOR.

DUE TO YOUR AFFRONT TO HER LEFT WING IDEALISTIC LIFESTYLE YOU HAVE TWO CHOICES...

1. GET YOUR ASININE ASSES OUT OF HERE!!!

2. SUCK IT, YO

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: girl, I admire your fire and all, but you are completely deranged.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @MadameOvary: OH please. Cheerup freaked the fuck out last time HRC beat Obama down. She used to be downright pleasant until Hillary didn't have the good grace to lose in TX and OH and she's been downright nasty ever since. She was buying me a drink before TX and OH went down!

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> To whoever said it above (sorry I'm a little drunk)...Obama will for sure be the nominee no doubt. Then he'll promptly get crushed by the old man. Hell, at this point HRC will too. We'll have a new Republican president, barring these two dopes get on the same ticket. That's the only winning possibility. However, for all those whining about HRC's campaign (which has been no "dirtier" than the great O.) being dirty or whatever...you sound like children. Have you ever seen a poltical campaign before? It sure doesn't seem like it. I know Obama got some new peeps to come out and vote...but um, really, um...this is POLITICS people. It's been nice and dirty since forever.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @amoureuse is here because of Ashley!:
Sorry if I broke your concentration during your intense session of mental masturbation.

Hey..that rhymes!!!

Sorry if I messed up your melodramatic ditty...about how a female establishment candidate is entitled to lots and lots of pity.

Yay!!!!

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @amoureuse is here because of Ashley!: It is comments like yours that give Sen. Clinton's supporters a bad name - Cheer up was pointing to a positive aspect of Sen. Clinton's! I like what IBinMN has to say, too - save your vitriol for the real opponent, McLame.

MadameO asks - WWOD?

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> God, I'll be glad when this election is over. I really can't take any more of Moe's loony "I heart Obama" rantings.

Mrs. Stephen Fry aka MonkeySeeMonkeyDo

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): My bad. Let me give you some privacy so you can fellate Obama in private.

amoureuse is a second class citizen

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): You're funny. I like you.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @Magister: I have no problem with the nomination fight continuing, but I have big problems with the way that Clinton and her advisors are running her campaign. James Carville just said, "Mr. Richardson's endorsement came right around the anniversary of the day when Judas sold out for 30 pieces of silver, so I think the timing is appropriate, if ironic." Judas? Judas who will burn in Hell forever? I'm not a Christian, so any moral outrage on my part would be feigned, but that seems like a pretty fucking inappropriate way to express disappointment that your candidate lost an endorsement. Carville is way too experienced an operator to have just let that slip.

Combine that with the way in which Clinton is using McCain's supposed foreign policy experience as a stick to beat on Obama with (instead of, say, pointing out that McCain is revealing he has no idea what the hell he's talking about every time he opens his mouth), and it really does seem like she cares more about smacking down Obama than ensuring McCain loses this fall. I don't have the authority to speak for anyone but myself, but that shit seriously turns me off. And I just don't see it coming in anywhere near the same volume or nastiness from Obama's camp.

I'm no foe of hardball politics. Hunter S Thompson's Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail '72 is my bible (I re-read it every election year). The fact that the Democrats are campaigning hard this year is a huge improvement over 2000 and 2004, when they just didn't seem to get it and let the Republicans walk all over them. However, every time Clinton's campaign uses one of these sleazy old-school ploys against Obama, they make it that much harder to deal with the Republicans after the Democrats do decide on their nominee. Regardless of who it is.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I am a Clinton supporter who will definitely vote for Obama, if he gets the nomination.

Having said that, a lot of bridges have been burned in the Democratic Primaries. Anytime the supporters of one potential nominee, demonize the other potential nominee, there are those who will become alienated and resentful.

There is nothing more disturbing than to go on a liberal site and, after reading the comments about the Democratic candidates, having to check to make sure I didn't accidentally click on a right-wing site. Think about that.

On another blog, I have been lobbying for months for every Democratic supporter to tone down the rhetoric. I suggested that they try telling people what they actually LIKE about their candidate, instead of what they DON'T like about the opposing candidate. As you can probably guess, I had very little luck.

So, we have bridges that need to be rebuilt, and we had better be working on them pretty quickly. Neither of our excellent candidates has a chance in hell of winning the GE without the votes of the other candidate's supporters.

IBinMN

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @amoureuse is here because of Ashley!: Oh please...like Hillary doesn't benefit from liberal guilt. Give it a rest...can we please end the pity party. If you want cry...cry for white guys Biden, Dodd, et al that had tons more experience than either of them.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Here's a pretty good article on Clinton's time in the Senate:

[news.yahoo.com]

Too bad she doesn't push this more than her thirty five years of experience and her and Sinbad calling in air strikes over Kosovo as first lady.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: You're right. McCain will not benefit from her leaving the race...and Obama will. DNC benefits...RNC does not.

I've said a million times...I DON'T CARE IF SHE STAYS IN THE RACE. There's always that one in a million chance something really unfortunate happends to obama.

But for christ sake...cut out the McCain has more experience than obama...obama not as patriotic as mccain shit.

You guys just pretend this shit isn't happening...and THIS IS NOT NORMAL. You don't see this in even the most ugly nomination races. You don't say the other party's guy is better than your competition. This isn't rocket science.

That's not obama hurting himself. That is Hillary trying to lower obama's poll numbers against mccain...and it's total bullshit.

So...have you considered the possibility the Moe may just be pure evil as opposed to an obama supporter?

Maybe she's not in the tank for obama...but instead in the tank for SATAN.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @Tanith: If you actually thought the bug jar comment was serious and not making fun of the mentality on here...then you just lowered the brow about a foot hun.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @Magister: I think that there is certainly divisiveness on the web...but you make it sound like there are not well known blogs that are clearly pro-clinton...which there certainly are.

I don't read any of those echo chamber type blogs anyway...Kos...eschaton...myDD...talkleft...etc. I don't like kool-aid...no matter the flavor.

I think that TPM is pretty good though...of the decidedly left blogs.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: Love it - keep it coming! Let us not forget that politics is theater, no matter how important the outcome is. Will Exxon/Mobil/Haliburton suddenly cave? Hell no, but this hope of democracy gives the little people the illusion of change. The real power rarely changes, and when there is a threat of it changing, collapsing, the Feds step in and bail them out, witness this week's hand out to the riches. I prefer to elect a person who actually had to work for things, maybe actually had a little bit of a hard time, may still remember what it was like to eat ramen as a student. Michelle and Barak had student loans, not something that ever burdened Hillary. People who have been rich all their lives have a hard time imagining what it is like to live like the majority of citizens of this country. To me, it seems that Obama has not forgotten this, and that Clinton has never known it.

MadameO asks - WWOD?

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!:
It looks like it may be too late for a revote in Michigan and Florida, but if they were to happen, I lean more toward them being a wash. My knowledge of Florida tells me that Hillary would win that state, while demographics and political history makes me think that Obama would carry Michigan.

Magister

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> If nothing else, the extended race has certainly showed me why Howard Dean's supporters suddenly decided to stop going to the polls after he placed second in Iowa; The media told them that he didn't have a chance and they believed it. Nevermind that at that point, only one state had voted and Mr. Dean decided to continue another month (without winning any contests) before he "listened" to the voters. John Edwards, on the other hand, he kept trudging until March 3rd having won only South Carolina and I remember the media kept asking him why he didn't drop out, but he insisted on "letting the voters decide".

Hillary's presence in the race isn't stopping anyone from voting for Sen. Obama and it doesn't stop him from turning his attention toward McCain. Sure, he has to think about beating Sen. Clinton, but for him to win, people have to quit voting for her. I can see, if folks wanted to argue to the voters of the upcoming states that the party would be better served, if Obama were to get a clear and unquestionable victory, but I really have a hard time understanding why the burden should be put onto Hillary, if she's headed toward a victory in the next contest and when the polls say that she could continue to win the majority of the remaining races.

I'm a Democrat. In more than a quarter century of voting, I've never voted Republican for national office. I'm not wrapped-up into either of the candidates because I see them both as having equal amounts of strength and weakness. As long as our candidates dominate the headlines and as long as we're benefiting from nationally televised debates, I see the continued race as a good thing.

I also remember that though the media kept asking Sen. Edwards why he was still in the race, back in '04, nobody was accusing him of dividing the party. Eventually, he saw that he was unlikely to get enough victories to stop Sen. Kerry from getting the number of delegates needed to win the nomination, so he decided to step down. Neither, Obama nor Hillary are going to get enough pledged delegates, so we've sort of adopted the "whomever is ahead" position and based on the polls, she'd have a hard time getting to the majority, but it's not impossible.

If the voters want to send a clear message to Sen. Clinton, they should quit voting for the woman. Otherwise, though the vocal Obama supporters have decried a quote from some Clinton aide by saying that all victories are equal, a lot of them seem to say in the next sentence or with the next breath that her's don't count.

Magister

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SpicyTamale is like the smartest kid with Down Syndrome: I KNOW! This election has turned me into one of those smartass political debater peoples *eep* Someone, give me a PHilton post to snark at, stat!

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: holy mother that's a long comment!

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> *15 million the hospital will refuse to treat, frammit.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @eatsshootsleaves: The 15 million is people who may afford it and choose not to, yes. It's not 15 million who hospitals will afford to treat, which is how Clinton makes it sound. MA has the exact same problem, we will not achieve Universal Healthcare in one shot no matter how much Clinton rails on about it.

Do you really think that Wright = 15 some years of Clinton baggage? I hardly see how that is an advantage Clinton has over him. Just because Obama hasn't sunken down to the vett-fest levels doesn't mean the Repubs won't. And they'll have from now to November to remind EVERYONE every single reason they could possibly have to hate the Clintons' guts. If all they have is a pastor who said God damn America (he was quoting someone else when he said it, btw) then I hardly think it's going to be as ugly as it would be with Clinton. And like I said, Walnuts has encountered and courted too many wingnut pastors for him to push the issue. The press will just nail both of them for having psycho pastors, whether it's true or not.

I'm just really tired of all this crap, honestly. The Clinton's just keep changing to the metric of 'success' so they can keep dragging Obama through the muck. First, it was money raised, then it was delegates, then it's winning 'important' states, then it's the popular vote, now even though they have NO chance of catching up they're just hanging on like a bunch of goddamn vultures hoping someone finds something that will blow up in his face so they can swoop in and steal the nomination. I hope he calls her out on all her bullshit in the coming debates so we can wrap this up and I can start hating the opposite party like I'm supposed to. Gah.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: Ok. Look. Clinton does have some valid points about her electability over Obama's. Really. Obama's name doesn't inspire hatred YET, but with a full Republican attack machine on his tail, it could very well, especially with the Rev. Wright thing.

Secondly, the 15 million is not a number pulled out of thin air. It's actually something of a conservative estimate, according to MANY outside experts. It's understandable that some people may be uncomfortable with being forced to buy health insurance, but a large majority of the people that won't be covered under his plan will be able to afford it -- they just won't want to buy it. REALLY. This has been proven. And this is coming from someone who voted for Obama.

@amoureuse is here because of Ashley!: Actually, I think electing a black president would help to heal the country, as corny as it sounds. So would electing a woman president. Both groups right now have so many ingrained forces working against them that having one of them as the leader of the country would be, in my opinion, a tremendous leap forward.

eatsshootsleaves

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I agree with Bill Bradley.
When asked if he would support Clinton if she were the nominee, he looked at that cardboard ferret Wolf Blitzer like he wanted to slap him: OF COURSE he would support Clinton over McCain. It's absurd idiocy to suggest otherwise. However, that's what I've gathered from a lot of Clinton supporters (including respected personal friends) -- that they'd actually sabotage the party if they don't get their candidate. I'll CAMPAIGN for Hillary if she's the nominee. I'll work my tush off to make sure she's elected.

Tanith

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Randy Rhodes (sp?) was funny talking about McCain's passport - imagine those visa stamps from the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Kingdom of Lithuania - lol!

hnlsfo

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I will scream at the next person who insinuates that Obama's biracialness will "heal" this country (my fuckin neighbor)
I just have a gut wrenching feeling that the liberal elite are exploiting Obama, his ethnicity/race and the African American vote.

amoureuse is a second class citizen

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: And as Obama WILL be the nominee, she is hurting her party's chances by staying in the race. He will be ahead in pledged delegates, popular vote, and states won, what else do you want from him? Unless she goes on to win ever single state with more than 60-70% of the popular vote she cannot even bring his delegate lead under 100. Unless she wins 60-70% of the popular vote she cannot overtake is 700,000 popular vote lead. Even if she wins ever single state left she will not have won more states. If you think CA, NY and NJ are going to vote for Walnuts because Hillary isn't running that's more than slightly ridiculous, I'm sorry. MO, IL are traditional swing states, and he's won them. And since he does not inspire the hatred of 99% of Repubs just by saying his name, he will be able to TURN some states. That's the idea of the 50 state strategy, instead of saying they don't matter, those latte-drinking, botique frequenting, African-American hippie conservative places.

And do you think OH will be thrilled with her ones the Repubs start their machine? They will mercilessly point out her cheerleading for NAFTA, the fact HER office was the one assuring the Canadians, and that SHE will garnish their pathetically low wages so they can have 'healthcare.' They will tie it all up to the idea that they will be paying for some welfare queen/illegal immigrant when they've never had a cold in their life. And if you think the fact that neither Obama's or Clinton's plan covers illegals will stop them? Look at Cliton's bogus '15 million do not deserve health care under Obama's plan' spiel. It stuck, even though the 15 million is pulled out of the air, and it means 15 million will not be FORCED to buy it, not 15 million will get booted out of their local hospital. Unfortunately if you say anything enough times with conviction, people start to believe it (see Bush regime).

FL may very well have swung Clinton with their mail-in primary insanity. Obama is not responsible for the fact the FL Democratic machine can't get their shit together. If you thought hanging chads were bad, that would have been a fucking disaster. Hillary 'won' MI by 55 to 40. 40 was 'uncommited', if you add in Kucinich, Dodd & Gravel votes, she won 55 to 45. That was with NO campaigning by the opposition. I highly doubt a redo would have swung Hillary's way, even if she won by that margin, 55 to 45 she would get ~4-5 more delegates, hardly a resounding victory. And Hillary may be kicking and screaming that Obama 'disenfranchised' MI, but she was the one who obstructed his logical assertion that Regan Democrats/Independents may very damn well have voted in the Republican primary because everyone said ther VOTE DIDN'T MATTER. Therefore, Obama wanted them to be able to vote in MI, and guess what? Since Hillary polls horribly with independents she refused to concede the point. If she wanted them seated SO badly she could have, don't believe the spin.

There are plenty of Hillary supporters who have either insinuated Obama supporters are a) stupid b) brainwashed c) young dumbasses or all three. And have condescendingly told us not to be stupid, and vote for the obviously superior High Empress. Will this make me not vote democrat if she steals the nomination? Hells no, the economy, Iraq and the Supreme Court are too important to throw in the garbage. And heavens forbid that Obama expect for fellow Democrats to coalesce around the nominated candidate, because that totes has not happened since the history of the two parties. It is what you are supposed to do, no matter what party you're in. You campaign for you candidate, if the other wins, you support them and bring hell to the opposition party. We are not supposed to behave like independents and run splinter candidates because you're pissed your candidate lost.

OMG wall of text, no one will read this anyway:P Peace guys.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Obama: liberal guilt meets opportunist.

amoureuse is a second class citizen

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: Virginia, Iowa, Wisconsin: these are some big swing states he's won.

I've heard very few supporters from either side say that they wouldn't vote for the Democratic nominee, whoever that is.

By the way -- I might be confusing her with one of the other Jezebels -- but isn't Moe actually biracial?

eatsshootsleaves

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @J.D.Regent: i'm 100% with you on the "dems-doing-the-gop's-job-for-them..." front, which is partially why i haven't been commenting on the political posts. my point was: i'm impressed obama went for it, with the race speech, rather than ignoring or avoiding the issue to avert any negative polls.

i frankly think america will be on a better, more even keel with either mr obama or mrs clinton (since both is too much to hope for) in the white house. the consequences of mccain's win don't bear thinking about.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @Tanith: Oh and if you want low brow refer to the shit fit, insulting post from Moe the day after the country didn't feel like crowning Obama back on Feb 5. Now, that was some low-brow shit.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): OH please. He's injuring himself. The only person it benefits for her to drop out is OBAMA. And him and his supporters are just pissed she won't just get out of the way and let us crown him already. He does NOT have enough delegates to get the nom either. And he as YET to win a nice big swing state in a primary. But he can keep trying. We'll see.

@Tanith: Yes, it always gets low brow when people just don't do what they're supposed to and love Obama and refer to The Speech to End All Speeches as life-altering.

@onestrawplz: Exactly why Obama is afraid of revotes in MI and FL. Cuz he'll LOSE.

And whatever. I was ALWAYS behind the Dem nominee. Until all the Obama supporters everywhere were telling me they could just not even in good conscience vote for that evil, evil Hillary. Their sweet little hearts just would not allow them to vote for her if O didn't get the nom. Then Obama said he'd just "get" HRC voters. Good luck with that O. See ya in the Senate in November.

SinisterRouge

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @charlotte corday: there's something really depressing about other dems portending this speech, or the Wright psuedo-fiasco, as the death knell for Obama. What's your point exactly, that America is just too racist to deal with Obama? I just find that incredibly depressing, as depressing as it was a month or two months ago when people were saying Hillary was too "shrill" or whatever code word for "female." I reeeealllly wish Dems would stop doing Republicans' jobs for them.

J.D.Regent

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @ShanaElmsford: Thank you! I think it is just ridiculous the way the majority of dems are acting. I'm an Obama supporter ALL the way, but if Hills gets the nom, you bet your sweet ass I am voting for her.

thatsspinach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: @cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???): @ShanaElmsford: @charlotte corday: @ObtuseIntolerant:
These threads ALWAYS lower the brow/tone of the site. (And this is the place for a good butt waxing debate, so figure it out.)
I guess I'm a bug jar shaker too because I love to listen to the enraged buzzing and eventual suffocation.

Tanith

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> also: i think obama was very brave to take on racism in america. i don't claim that he "nailed it", but i simply don't think that's possible, b/c i don't think there is any "right" answer. racism is everywhere, all over the world. as loopy as this may sound, i've seen and heard chinese people being racists to other chinese people-- in china! for example: there's a racial slur to describe the cantonese in mandarin that translates as "whores and fishermen". yeah.

let's try to listen to what someone is actually saying, rather than judging them on their clothes, accent, or dis/ability.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I've been saying for more than a year that Obama would most likely become the Democratic nominee, but he'd need to be tested and vetted by the primary process because he was an unknown and he needed to perfect his agenda.

Of course, I'm sure that several have noticed that I've often sprung to Hillary's defense because the blogosphere has seemed stacked against her (due to demographics) and while I realize that one of the Obama's recent talking points has been "divisiveness", I'm really not seeing it outside of the chattering or commenting class and in my eyes, the vitriol has come from both sides.

With all that said, I also think it'd be a shame for Sen. Clinton to drop out anytime soon, even if there were any chance that she'd consider it. Sen. Obama's campaign has practically ceded Pennsylvania to her and she's now pulled even in the most recent North Carolina poll, so I think it'd be nothing but hubris for anyone to suggest that a candidate drop out, when they're expected to win the next primary and when they could possibly win the majority of the remaining ten.

This is her one shot. I know that blog commenters like to theorize during their demonizations that she's laying the groundwork to run again in the future, but I don't think that she'd have the stomach or that the party would allow it.

Ten more states get to vote. The last several election cycles were decided before half the country had gone to the polls and it's been a long time since we've gone all the way through. I don't see any harm in letting the contest continue and I actually see some potential benefit, by letting everyone's voice be heard.

She's still raising money; She's still getting votes and she's still winning primaries. Perhaps, mathematically she has a hard row to hoe, but she's getting her issues on the table and though I'm sure a lot of Obama supporters would like for the Democrats to join Sen. McCain on page three of the papers and for our next two debates (free commercials) to be cancelled, I see no legitimate reason for her to quit and no harm from letting the race go on.

Magister

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> oh wah, wah, wah. like ANYONE on here is going to vote for mccain. if hills wins the nom, we'll vote for her; if obama wins, we'll vote for him.

you know, unless we're all suddenly in favour of anti-choice/pro-life legislation, creationism getting equal time in schools to SCIENCE, and everlasting war with iran/iraq/anyone uppity enough to try to make us uncomfortable (hat tip: hunter s thompson).

it's all to play for, people-- and if anyone on here doesn't vote in november, i hope they have their jezzie card revoked.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Ewwwww. I just remembered why I don't usually read the political posts over here. Irrational anti-Obama comment vitriol abounds...Ouch.

I hurt every time he gets slammed. BUT I am sure Clintonites feel the same. It is not over by any means...but she is at a disadvantage, be honest.

And the spew about him being doomed in the general sounds like the usual desperate defense. If you demand proof of Politico, where are your references for these generalizations? It's just not true. I know a lot of crazy ass Republican & Independent hicks of several colors in PA (ah, family!), and they are all more and more for Obama, and they are changing their registrations like mad to help narrow her lead though it seems inevitable she will take the state.

This is JUST me I do not claim to generalize, BUT - I know very few Hillary supporters, and the ones I do all fit in the same neat demographic box. But more of them are registered Democrats, I will give you that.

So it might be a bit unfair, but I think his most impassioned base is populated by Independents. If we were registered the way we usually vote (Dem), this primary would not be so close.

McCain really is a loon, peeps - you know it. He admits to having no clue about the economy, has SHOWN he does not understand some intricacies of world politics, and is in the Bush pocket, so to speak. Respect to him, but he is weak and can be taken down. Unite, DNC!

Plus Obama and his stance on National Service/Americorps rock me...IDK how much the rest of you get out into the ghettoes or involved with the possibilities of fed service programs but trust me, it's the boot straps we need to be pulling ourselves up on right now. Bleak times ahead.

ObtuseIntolerant

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @myrtle et al. I'm up for the beach party. I'll bring frozen margs. But let's go to the Rivera and stay. That's where I'm gonna wanna be for the next 4 years if either of the apparent prez-elects win.

chicklit

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I wish in the pic...hillary was waving buh-bye.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective: I don't think her lead is even as impressive as polls say, so I doubt she'd get the 20+ points she'd need over Obama to break his lead.

I've been on the streets in Erie, the VAST majority of people I've met seem to be either undecided or for Obama. And the undecided voters have always been very receptive to any info about Obama we could provide. Erie is rust belt, and the areas I've been in are heavily blue collar/ working class. Places that should be Clinton strongholds.

(oh, and I lost my Hillary love when she broke every fucking one of her senate campaign promises to the western half of the state that she made in 2000... and blamed it on not having a dem controlled congress and white house. Since, you know, politicians never have to work with the other side. After I had campaigned and for her I felt like a total asshole. Because I believed in her she made me a liar.)

kellyhelene

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective:
exactly, and that's what continues to turn me off towards her, more and more every day. at first it was like eh, i love obama but i could vote for hillary to stay true to the dems, but now since it's obviously impossible for her to win fairly, it's just pissing me off. like really, drop the fuck out and let us unite behind the dude who is obviously more popular, so we can beat mccain. but of course she won't do that, she's gonna fight to the death because she thinks she's so deserving of it. and to be fair, if their roles were reversed, i'd expect obama to drop out, since either scenario would benefit democrats, and we'd have a better shot of beating john mcdouche come november.

onestrawplz

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> wins not wind. Damn iPhone.

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @ShanaElmsford: your comment was smart, clearly written and eloquent. Wish more commenters could write like you.
if Hillary wind, great. I will vote for her. I'm not going to be childish and not vote at all cause my candidate didn't win the nom. I certainly won't vote McCain. Fuck that noise.

SpicyTamale is a GA peach

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: Luv the shout out to Sinbad.

Has anyone ever actually heard any of his material?

I've heard it's pretty bad. It must have been pretty tame though given the folks that book him.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @bess marvin, girl detective: It really does seem like Hillary's trying to permanently injure him for the GE. I seriously think she may be trying to set herself up for a 2012 run. If that's the case...she must have been really pissed that he ran against her and she must have really felt entitled to the nom.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> "@ShanaElmsford: "While the math makes it seem like it will be impossible for Clinton to win the nomination."

It doesn't make it seem, it IS impossible for her to win unless she does some shady ass shit and rather than her drop out for the good of the party, she remains. so this bullshit will continue. it's no one fault at this point but hers

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: but she cannot win unless she wins by huge margins for the rest of the way which isn't going to happen. in whose best interest is it for her to take this shit all the way to the convention while mccain sits back and watch? only hers.

bess marvin, girl detective

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @ShanaElmsford: i'm fine with obama. it's the anti hillary stuff i can't stand.

land surveyor k

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> there's nothing white liberal men and the young women who hope they'll leave their wives for them them won't do to kill the "mommy-first wife-witch." let's all throw ourselves on the pyre of liberal guilt for racism. you're not even allowed to say you think sexism might exist without getting a shit bomb thrown on you.

land surveyor k

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I am also of the opinion that Hillary is taking a much-needed rest during a particularly long stretch before PA. The other events of the week were so obsessed over by the media that nothing she did would have caught their eye, anyway (unless it were equally "scandalous" in the media's eyes), so it's not a bad time to rest up.

And poor Abigail Taylor. That is just a horrific and sad story, and makes me ridiculously mad at people who want to jump aboard the tort-reform-express. I hope the club responsible gets slapped with such tremendous punitive damages that no kid ever dies like this again.

I remember being terrified of pool drains when I was a kid. Sadness.

kimsama

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Spanish basketball is a ton of fun to watch. They mike it strangely, though. You can't hear the shoes squeaking and the ball bouncing.

librisdraconis

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> A dem who says they won't vote for one if the other gets the nom is a true example of a schoolyard "Imma take my ball and go home!" mentality.

ceejeemcbeegee

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @ShanaElmsford:I hear what you're saying. It's frustrating. I'm not the biggest fan of Hillary but I don't hate her. I just wish that she had said intelligent statements and not played the nasty political game which basically made her look bad in the end. Whoever gets the nomination, I will vote for as a democrat
@cheerupsylvia (Can I a Haz...Notice???): LOL.What I can I say? I just over analyze ;)

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: cause uh, the car inspection industry totes cares how you vote:P *drinks more coffee*

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Reading the comments sections of "News Roundup" and "Crappy Hour" is consistently one of the more depressing parts of my day. (Why do I even bother? I'm a glutton for punishment.)

It's like watching the Democratic party crumble before my eyes and that's what I'm really scared of come Nov. 5th. That no matter who the nominee is, Dems will be so pissed THEIR man/woman didn't win that they'll vote McCain. Or even worse not vote at all. Seriously, why are people (who identify themselves as Dems) gleefully predicting a McCain win if only to tell the other side, "Nyah, nyah, I told you so!" How old are you people? Grow the fuck up! Even though I'm an Obama supporter (an Obama supporter who voted Kucinich in the Fla primary) I will happily vote for Clinton because 1) she's not a retard and 1,000 times better than McCain and 2) a McCain presidency is genuinely scary. He's not a "good" republican who will only mess up the country "a little." He wants to go to war with Iran!!! Whoever the nominee is, we have to unite to make sure this shit doesn't happen. And if Obama is the nominee, Clinton lovers? Guess what? Despite what you heard, he doesn't totally suck!

We've been blessed with 2 charismatic and engaging candidates. While the math makes it seem like it will be impossible for Clinton to win the nomination (even with her mostly likely winning in PA), it's not over. I wish it were, if only so the party can stop tearing itself apart and unite already.

ShanaElmsford

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: Have you ever considered that maybe...just maybe...Moe isn't an Obama supporter at all? Maybe it's just that she realized that crappy hour and news roundup are predominantly populated by angry rabid hillary fans. So...like a little boy with a jar full of bugs...she shakes the jar angering the bugs but knowing they are harmless to him...but in this case racks up lots of pageviews as a result.

Maybe...just maybe...Moe isn't an Obama supporter at all. Maybe she is instead....PURE EVIL.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @brendastarlet: John Lewis used to be my example of Hillary supporters I have respect for. Ed Rendell is my new example.

What I'd really like to see is Ed Rendell as a possible VP.

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @tranquilmademoiselle: Really? I haven't noticed ;)

cheerupsylvia (Can I Haz...Notice???)

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @GinaLouise: unless Ed Rendell keeps saying stupid things and loses it for her. There's still a month to go.

brendastarlet is on it

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Actually besides Hillary and Bill's dumb statements, Hillary supporters turn me off from her.Don't like Obama, fine but some of the stuff that some of them say sounds like Fox News

tranquilmademoiselle

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I predict win in Pennsylvania for our girl HRC. Remember how the media was gloating in advance over Obama's surefire win in Texas? Her core base of the working class, Latinos and women may not be well-represented in the media, but they sure as hell vote. Viva Hillary!

GinaLouise

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka: Tagalongs and samoas, but i can get more if we need em!

Cfredl54

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @SinisterRouge on Notice!: The only one stupid enough to dance down the merry path of Wright might be Clinton if she sees the lights going out for reals. McCain knows damn well he as actively solicited the support of utter cuckoos and the media would be happy to run Wright's 'US KKK A' next to his pastors spouting a bunch of bigoted crap. They won't turn down a 2 for 1 sale.

Obama has by far run the cleaner campaign. Ergo, the earlier she gets out the earlier he has to get the party reunified and fired up, which I fully expect him to do. Once our eyes are cleared of the fog of bitching about whether a mandate is necessary for Health Care, whether touring Ireland with Sinbad lead to peace or whether a Marine-pastor who's pissed at America automatically makes someone unelectable we will see how fucking INSANE McCain's policies would be. Because right now the DNC is having to try to do the job of a presumptive nominee but they're getting smushed out of the media for more sensational news.

However, none of this will happen if either side sits back when their opponent clinches the nom and says 'haha, well you bitches will see when your candidate LOSES and we're fucked for 4 yrs.' Either side will have to suck it up and run with it because there will be hell to pay if we don't. I wasn't happy having to cheerlead for Kerry after the 'Dean Scream' but I did it, and in this case both candidates have excellent chances of winning in the GE.

battleaxonista

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I can't wait till November when Moe has to eat her words.

BadenBaden

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> I'm sorry, did the fat lady sing? cause I didn't hear it.
It's not over till it's over.

PICKLES_IN_MY_TUNA

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> Somehow "throwundering" just mutated into "thunderwang" inside my head.

nerdsausage is a busysausage

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @battleaxonista: His bitch slap is waiting. No need for us to hand it to him.

myrtlebeachbum

]]> <![CDATA[Is This Goodbye, Hillary?]]> @petunia942: No worries. About 25% of Clinton supporters won't vote for Obama, either. The Dems have managed to fuck it up just