<![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!" - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!" - Jezebel Comments]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I think there's a really valid message in all this that should be the crux of Gottlieb's article (but unfortunately isn't), namely that this idealized, overly sentimental Hollywood/Disney concept of 'love' that women tend to hang onto with a deathlike grip, is as potentially dis-empowering as thinking you have a 'sell by date'.

Romance is only romantic when it's fictional. Books, TV, theatre, whatever...it's fantastic. But isn't this just a gussied up 21st century Cinderella story we keep repeating ad nauseum in our heads? How does that serve us exactly? One day my Prince will come? What is this unbelievably overwhelming passion everyone is searching for, this ethereal 'connection', this 'chemistry'? It's a freaking fantasy, it really isn't reality. I've had my share of 'passionate' relationships in my time and they are effing EXHAUSTING. I couldn't do that, repeatedly, forever and ever if you paid me to.
Love is not so superficial, romance is having someone bring you flowers on your 50th wedding anniversary. How empowering is this story of torrid passion, cosmic connections and earth shaking romance we keep telling ourselves? And how can ANYONE be 'good enough' in that case, anyway. Life partner, wife, husband, long term long distance trenchmate, how could anyone hope to meet those expectations?

There are clearly a lot of people ticked off by what appears to be an obvious anti-feminist perspective in this article, and I grant that maybe Gottelieb missed the mark a little, but the point that we're all still a bit hoodwinked by what is essentially a Prince Charming fantasy is a fair observation, and that's not very empowering either.

k

keekeed

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> So much to say, a friend of mine got married to her husband because they both wanted to be married and have kids-who they married seemed irregardless. They have been married for two years, have almost always slept in seperate bedrooms and she is not happy, but she settled from the start.

I thought Carrie should have ended up with Aidan, Big is a jackass.

SleeplessNights, that stinks about you and your husband. We go through phases of being roommates and then not...

pepitosgeil

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Either you settle, or you're settled for.

Love and power are never equal.

You can be the more powerful or the more in love, but you can't be both.

Carson McCullers explains it all nicely in "The Ballad of the Sad Cafe" (key passages chosen, by the way, by Mary Gaitskill as the epigraph to "Because They Wanted To").

brassinpocket

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Um, a couple of things that might have been smart to do? 1. Don't have a baby without a father (this seems to be a major source of her complaints). 2. Don't base your life choices on movies, romances, and sitcomes.

Malapert

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @ThereMustBeAPony: The problem w/an older guy is that you might find yourself becoming his caregiver sooner than you signed up for. So if you're settling in the first place, you'll wind up pissed and resentful. A former co-worker of mine told me about a friend who married a guy 10+ her senior and was now spending her time carting him around...she thought she'd be the one being taken care of.

My take is if you are a hetero woman who is going to settle, lock in on a younger guy if you can. They have more years to work in the workplace.

arirang

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @lcosgr: Help yourself, sister!

thatgirlinnewyork

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> My Friday gift to my fellow single-lady friends was not forwarding this article to them.

djdreilinger

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @City_Dater: Christ, it's like your a genius. Thank you for saying what I didn't know I was thinking. There were so many alarming statements in that piece, it was overwhelming. I knew it made me really uncomfortable, but I couldn't focus on just one reason. You did that successfully. Thanks!

eucalyptus

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Thank you Jezebellians! I'm a single mom in her 40s who has been struggling with this very issue regarding an older man (too old) who I could have a great life with and provide better security for my son. Very nice lifestyle. I like him, but find him overbearing and his "fussy old woman" and peevish behaviour makes me crazy. Good in bed though! : )
I recently ended it; we were kinda planning to get engaged this Valentine's day. A real struggle though. To the women on here who did make the pragmatic choice, and say "don't", thank you thank you. I think I did the right thing, great to have the decision reinforced by women who have "been there, done that".


ThereMustBeAPony

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> The problem is, when you settle you're always wondering "What if I had waited" every time you meet a man who is your type.

MakeMeSmile

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Boy, two days late to the party.

When I was 14, my then 16 year old brother had a literal list of what he demanded in a girlfriend. These included such things as she had to have a car and would have copious amounts of sex with him. Now, he was pretty lame in the lady department, and wasn't turning away dates. At the tender age of 14, I knew his list was retarded.

When I read about these people who bemoan "omg I'm settling", I can't help but think of his list. If Mr. Perfect has a secret set of attributes, it's guaranteed that those attributes add up to either a) someone who doesn't exist or b) someone who is a jerk. This is simply because you can't enumerate someone in a list. Robert Downey is rich and a snappy dresser, but he would be a terrible husband.

There is a huge disconnect between "settling" and "accepting". Settling means taking someone who is bad for you. Accepting means that your spouse farts in bed, or dislikes your favorite type of ice cream, or even differs radically in some political view. Settling is immature and counter productive to happiness. Accepting that your spouse/SO/whatever is human and fallible and different than you are is sign of maturity, and dare I say, humanity.

aarvesen

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> "And all I can say is, if you say you're not worried, either you're in denial or you're lying. In fact, take a good look in the mirror and try to convince yourself that you're not worried, because you'll see how silly your face looks when you're being disingenuous."

Hmm. I must be in denial and lying then. I'm 35, divorced, have three kids ... and am totally not giving a shit about no prospective husband lurking around the corner. You know why? Because I am happy in myself and don't NEED a husband to validate my entire existance. Imagine that. That's not saying that I'm AGAINST the idea, but I'm certainly not running around like a chook with my head cut off, in a great big tizzy, looking for a husband.

Also, I really don't crave companionship. I have friends (and kids, but they'll grow up and do their own thing eventually).

I was really hoping that some day soon we'd get past this bullshit. *Insert dramatic sigh here*

Awry

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @titania1285: Ya'no, just for the sake of it ... you don't suddenly end up a crusty old fossil at the age of 40. Just saying.

Awry

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @dutifuldaughter: if he has more than one, then yes they do. unless he's Noah.

@PhillyLass:
why are you calling your (old) friends the co-dependent ones if they go to a couples activity together and don't involve you? do you invite your 55 year old co-worker to rock concerts and to the bar or do you recognize they may have different interests based on life events?

@goodcheapfun: and good to know you've never actually been sick.

Fiends/family/lovers.
So you go out with your 'lover' who you haven't settled for and are not married to. ok, got it. not sure this article is directed at you, but hey whatever. and again, if you spend 27 hours a week talking to your mom on the phone that's just sad.

and again, happy married couples are not that rare for couples who don't marry straight out of high school. here's a site with the rates overall. the rates for college-educated divorcees is lower.

Divorce Rate by Age at marry Women Men
--------------------------------------------------
Under 20 years old 27.6% 11.7%
20 to 24 years old 36.6% 38.8%
25 to 29 years old 16.4% 22.3%
30 to 34 years old 8.5% 11.6%
35 to 39 years old 5.1% 6.5%
older ~6% ~10%
[answers.google.com]











drewheyman

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @goodcheapfun: Winner! I'm changing the nic right now!

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Dadadarling: Yeah, I'm kind of disturbed by the photo. There's the possible celery issue, and then there's the fact that it looks like her head is floating. Where is her other shoulder hiding? Why is she hunched over like that? I'm all confused.

The milkshake looks yummy though.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: Pregnant? Oh no. He might have gotter he her pregnant on purpose in order to have more control over her. (Check out this research: [www.endabuse.org])

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @PhillyLass: @goodcheapfun: Um, I heart you guys. And Jezebel. Someone posted this ridiculous article on this forum I frequent to give it praise.

Elevendy

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> This woman seems to be poking a celery stick (hello negative calory food!) into a wonderful milkshake. I do not need another reason to hate her.

Dadadarling

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @drewheyman:
"who picks you up from the airport?"

You park in extended parking and drive yourself home.

"helps you with car trouble?"

You add a bit to your insurance to get towing included (or get AAA).

"goes on vacation with you?"

Your friends (or in my case kids).

"and all your married friends quit going out on the weekends, so you have to get a new set of friends."

I'm the only divorcee and I still have friends (but I have kids so my priorities are not partying).

"then doctor visits"

Yourself

"going to restaurants, etc."

Friends/family.

"And sitting at home by yourself on friday, saturday, and sunday gets boring, and animals are a sad analogue for missing human relationships."

Friends, family and lovers.

"and the divorce rate for college-educated couples who marry later than 25 is only like 10%. it's only the lower socio-economic classes who divorce at high rates."

Really, I'd love to see the statistics for this one. Oh and just because you're married doesn't mean you will be happy. Happily married couples are even more rare than married people period.

"So the person who said settle on looks, not character i'd agree with."

Just don't settle so that you can have someone take you to the doctor and eat out with you. That would probably make for a shitty relationship in the long (and short) run.

goodcheapfun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @drewheyman: who picks you up from the airport?
TAXI SERVICES WERE INVENTED FOR PRECISELY THIS REASON
helps you with car trouble?
THE ONE-TWO PUNCH OF AAA AND A WORKING KNOWLEDGE OF CARS SO YOU KNOW IF THE MECHANIC IS TRYING TO SCREW YOU
goes on vacation with you?
YOU DON'T NEED A WEDDING RING TO GO ON VACATION WITH SOMEONE; AND GIRLS' VACATIONS ARE SUPER FUN
and all your married friends quit going out on the weekends, so you have to get a new set of friends.then doctor visits, going to restaurants, etc.
YOU DO NEED SOME NEW FRIENDS IF YOUR MARRIED ONES ARE SO CO-DEPENDENT THAT THEY DROP EVERYONE ELSE IN THEIR LIVES.
And sitting at home by yourself on friday, saturday, and sunday gets boring, and animals are a sad analogue for missing human relationships.
WHY SIT AT HOME BY YOURSELF ALL WEEKEND WHEN YOU CAN GO TO MUSEUMS, MOVIES, PRACTICE HOBBIES, ETC. AND, BY GETTING OUT INTO THE WORLD AND DOING SOME STUFF, YOU MAY JUST FIND A REALLY GREAT PERSON TO DO STUFF WITH YOU.

PhillyLass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @drewheyman: "and the divorce rate for college-educated couples who marry later than 25 is only like 10%. it's only the lower socio-economic classes who divorce at high rates."

Really? It makes sense that it would be lower, but is it really that low? I guess it could be- if I think about my friends, all college educated and who have parents that were as well, most of our parents are still married... That just seems so low since the overall figure is near 50%

LaFemme

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> She used to have a career in television development and then chucked it to go to Stanford Medical School, where she realized she didn't like being around sick people. She dropped out and then wanted to write and has been writing weird stuff ever since. Po Bronson wrote about her in his book, What Should I Do With My Life? She's just crazy, like in a really uncool weird way.

Sophieindeed

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> If a single guy gets a dog or cat (or ferret or hamster or iguana), do people look at him and click their tongues and murmur that he's trying to fill the awful void in his life that exists because he's unmarried and childless? Or do they just assume that the guy wanted a dog, and that it has nothing to do with being a sad analogue for missing human relationships?

In all my single life I have never operated on the assumption that "single" equated "alone". I just assumed that "single" equated "not presently engaged in a romantic relationship with a significant other". Silly me.

dutifuldaughter

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I think part of the problem is this: she talks about rejecting men not for the content of their character but for the shape of their nose, halitosis problem or "bad aesthetics." Later on in the article, she outlines her hypothetical soulmate by rattling off a grocery list of characteristics that - surprise! - don't match any of the guys she actually meets. In my experience, you fall in love with someone who -becomes- your soulmate. Sure, when I was 13 I swore up and down that my future husband would have long hair, a European accent and a guitar. But she's a bit old to be clinging to these silly "requirements."

Sengi

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I don't know, i think she makes a fair point. As you get older, life gets alot more difficult if you are by yourself. who picks you up from the airport? helps you with car trouble? goes on vacation with you? and all your married friends quit going out on the weekends, so you have to get a new set of friends. then doctor visits, going to restaurants, etc.

And sitting at home by yourself on friday, saturday, and sunday gets boring, and animals are a sad analogue for missing human relationships.

and the divorce rate for college-educated couples who marry later than 25 is only like 10%. it's only the lower socio-economic classes who divorce at high rates.

So the person who said settle on looks, not character i'd agree with.

drewheyman

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> This makes me want to puke. I am embarrassed for this woman. WHY, WHY, WHY do people settle? Do. Not. Want. I would rather die alone half eaten by Alsatians than settle for some boring, annoying asshole who happens to be an orthodontist.

blackbirdfly

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Regret is a useless emotion. All those people you passed on you passed on for a reason. What good is settling for someone who makes you stabby if you go to jail for killing him in his sleep when he does what makes you insane for the 100th time? ugh.

pishposhspice

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @entonces: @Mommys_little_attention_whore: Sorry to bud in but may-be it's better to be somewhat more generic to avoid an oddly structured sentence, i.e. that_little_attention_whore.

goodcheapfun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Lady you need a babysitter and a bottle of whiskey.
[www.i-guide.ro]

iguide

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @lisas: @Mommys_little_attention_whore: Yeah now the bad grammar is setting off my ocd. How about little_attention_whore_of_mommy? :)

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @thatgirlinnewyork: "It's a disservice to reasonable women who are capable of critical thinking"

Well said. I'm gonna borrow that if you don't mind . . .

thirdrail

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> My favorite part is where she rationalizes settling because she doesn't want to be old and alone. Hello? Statistics much? The *vast* majority of women outlive their spouses. Statistics say that no matter what you settle (or please god don't settle) for, you're most likely gonna be alone at the end of it all. And I'm not quite sure where the tragedy is in that.

I settled. TWICE. First I rationalized that "well, he's only a LIGHT drug user" - until his high, steroided ass threw me through a plate glass window. That lasted for eight whole months.

Ten years later at thirty*mumble* I settled for a guy because he was a "friend" and it just seemed easier that way. No tingles, no sexual spark whatsoever. He was easily the biggest internet addict I've ever encountered; he was essentially asexual. What I thought was friendship wasn't really anything but him being too fucking apathetic to move into a real relationship. That lasted for four years.

I am blissfully alone and hope to be for the rest of my life. If anyone drops by in the meantime for a pizza and some hot sex, they're welcome to stay until I tell them they need to go. My friends and family have been and will continue to be my best, most reliable support system. Plus I don't have to listen to them snore or pick up their goddam dirty laundry.

♥ dosido ☮

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I'm 35 here, and I live by my mom's advice: it's better to be an old maid than wish you were one.

snark_shark

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Mommys_little_attention_whore: bingo

lisas

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @StupidFace: Huh. What if we were to look at real life? Where Jennifer Anniston married the then-heartthrob Pitt? Only to be left later for a sexier woman. The more I think about it, the happier I am being single with some casual relationships.

AnnieGetYourFun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> ok, newly improved nickname. I don't know whether I can stand to look at the bad grammar, though.. :(

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @cate3710: OK, try again. this time with new version, sans apostrophe

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> *to

bombaxstar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Too all of you ladies giving advice about my friend: thank you. I'm just too scared to really say anything, which I know sounds awful. But she called me earlier tonight at work to let me know that she just found out that she is pregnant. So. That complicates it a lot more. =/

Oh and I guess living in this dinky-ass town in Southern Illinois doesn't help my "I'll never get married" paranoia. Haha.

=D

bombaxstar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Well, that's what i was saying, too. I think it fucks a lot of people's minds up looking for the "perfect one".@goodcheapfun:

PoisonPixie

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Um...she's right. Women do have a peak value in terms of dating. It doesn't mean that they're not getting better with age. It means that they are less valued by men. This isn't even debatable. 29 year old women attract more attention than 30 year old women, 34 year old women attract more attention than 35 year old women, and 39 year old women attract more attention than 40 year old women. So by refusing to "settle", you're leaving yourself with fewer and fewer options - at least until you get the divorced dads on the rebound. Although you'll probably reject them since they have too much baggage.

Point is: YOU may prefer to stay single than "settle" but there's absolutely nothing wrong with making a compromise to achieve a goal of marriage and kids. Just because you feel personally indicted by Gottlieb's advice doesn't mean it's bad advice.

NotAHater

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I don't know why the focus of so many comments is about settling in order to have babies. She has a baby.

I think she's advocating settling in order to have companionship. And I think there's a point to that. Even though I still haven't learned to not be superficial, I often wonder if I'd be happier if I wasn't looking for someone who met my standards in every category. For now I accept that I wouldn't be satisfied if I settled, and that would mean the person I settled for wouldn't be happy either. But what if I could change my values?

Zlevee

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> The difference between being 20 and being 40 is that when you're 20, you're more likely to "settle" on the issue of how someone treats you than on anything else. The guy can treat you badly, cruelly, disrespectfully, and you'll make apologies for him because (1) you're attracted to him; (2) he's the kind of person you've always dreamed about being with; and (3) it's exciting. This is why twenty-year-old schmuck poets get all the action.

By the time you're pushing 40, the one thing you won't compromise on is how people treat you. Maybe the guy doesn't fit your "list," maybe he's not conventionally as hot as you've always dreamed about, maybe he's got all kinds of other nonsense going on, but he treats you right, and that's now the one NONNEGOTIABLE point instead of the one NEGOTIABLE point. This is why genuinely nice, kind, awesome dudes do a lot better when they're 40 than they did when they were in college.

What I'm saying is that now, at 37, I am so infinitely much more qualified to choose partners now than I was when I was 20, or even 25, that I am incredibly glad my 25-year-old ass didn't panic, settle, and wind up married to an "exciting" musician who dicked me around, all because I was terrified I wouldn't have kids. Because all I would have been was a woman with a jackass's kids and therefore chained forever to a jackass, and you couldn't pay me enough to do that to myself on purpose.

Violet555

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @thatgirlinnewyork: I went to the Atlantic site to read comments on Gottlieb's POS (and probs leave one of my own), but the Atlantic forums are powerfully feeble.

LvV

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Hmmm--I just combed through her literary site again, and all I can see is some self-hating former fat girl who wants to parlay her personal journals into some sort of career. Not wrong to do it, but to declare that we heed her conclusions based on irrational (aren't we all when we feel hungry/undersexed?) thinking is an invitation to reclaim ourselves as women who don't need that kind of (shitty) advice.

Perhaps she'd find satisfaction counseling at that millionaires dating club. She can already check off the box for "straight hair".

thatgirlinnewyork

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @ihateyourescalade: Yes--I agree with most of what you say. I have said prior that if a man alligns with 70-80% of your values, it's quite possible (but not absolute) that this is as good as we should expect it to get, humanity being shades of grey and all. But she did mention that the earlier, mediocre choices had some pretty antisocial qualities, and if those were dealbreakers for her, perhaps she should be thankful that she isn't a divorcee with a child, given all the angst that must pass to get to that status.

Do consider that the author seems to need to assign every woman a supposed "peak" age, and that's so fucking subjective that I don't know where to start parsing. Perhaps she wouldn't be thinking this way if she didn't jump the gun and have herself inseminated solo. She could be out like anyone else who's looking for a partner--at ANY age!

I'm with Moe--the Atlantic piece takes her opinions out of the context she's already established for her OCD-filled life. It's a disservice to reasonable women who are capable of critical thinking--shall we carpet bomb them via letters to the editor?

thatgirlinnewyork

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @PoisonPixie: May-be the problem is the idea of "soul-mate". Research suggests that our media perpetuates an unrealistic view of marriage (part of which most likely includes the myth of "soul mate"). If we had a more realistic view of ourselves, our significant other and marriage we may fare better. Or we can just say that marriage, as it currently stands, is outdated and patriarchal and that as women it's time we redefine relationships that will work equally well for us.

goodcheapfun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> is this woman fucking serious?

"And all I can say is, if you say you're not worried, either you're in denial or you're lying. In fact, take a good look in the mirror and try to convince yourself that you're not worried, because you'll see how silly your face looks when you're being disingenuous."

eh? disingenuous: that's a big word for such a small, narrow mind. I'm going to be 32 years old in 2.5 weeks and I don't want marriage and sure as hel don't want kids. I do want a loving relationship (even long term) but that's about it.

when I looked in the mirror this morning I was happy it was a good hair day and wondering when Pioneer was going to start shipping that new LCD tv with absolute black technology so I can hook up my xbox.

alice

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: This guy is abusive. He's attempting to isolate her from her friends and family, he's working on her self-esteem, and he is bad newz. As her friend, make it clear that you're there for her no matter what, no judgment, no pushing, just a safe place. She will need you once she comes to her senses.

As for your own marriage worries ... honey, when you go off to college, you'll see this whole amazing world open up before you. Marry when it feels right, not when you're worrying that if you don't, there's something wrong. And that goes double for you, LORI GOTTLIEB.

sallyfloyd

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Considering how many marriages end in failure... But basing a case on a TV SHOW! If Carrier would have married, the show would just die there.

Victo

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Pickles_in_my_tuna: By the way--I genuinely, genuinely love pickles in my tuna. Score on that.

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @entonces: It really is a bit of a pity party.

Ummm, I'll take Project Runway, mindless sex and a paycheck bonus please...oh and can I have a cocktail with that.

PICKLES

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> sheet nope. Get ride of your ' ?

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Back to topic. (Sorry I'm late; was compelled to work today.) I've been a bridesmaid/maid of honour five times. Once for my roommate who was getting married the week after she turned thirty and was already convinced she was washed up. She wanted a husband and a baby and she married the first guy who was too lazy to run. Right up to the ceremony I kept telling her that she could still back out, I could wear the dress again. She didn't back out. The longed-for baby (now referred to as Demon Child from Hell) was 3 yrs in coming. That's because, as I found out from another mutual friend, she married that guy knowing he was impotent.

THAT I call settling.

I'm 43, single het female. Not looking currently, never married, no urge for kids. And no worries about it. I don't need a better career or a smaller waistline and I have a nice little apt, WHICH I BOUGHT WITH MY OWN MONEY THANK YOU VERY MUCH. What I want most out of life ... right now ... is someone to clean it.

And I have the Dog of the World and wonderful friends so I don't get lonely. What is this woman smoking? Despair sticks?

dutifuldaughter

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> MLAW: Still no luck. I hit the reply arrow and it just sends me to the top of the page. Could the apostrophe be causing any problems?

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> hai. this is a test. someone reply to me. kthxbai

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @entonces: huh...that would make sense. I've only coded statistics programs, but variables can't have spaces, so I guess that makes sense. Let me try to do it with underscores and see if it makes a difference...

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> AND...since we're talking about coding, can someone please attend to the bug that refreshes to a random comment on the page instead of the page itself after you submit a comment? Gracias.

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @MommyLAW--I think it's because you have spaces in your handle. The code that generates the HTML markup snippet anchor back to your original comment doesn't know how to handle the "space" characters. Try shmushing your display name or using the underscore and see if that fixes it.

Sorry to be a dork. Also, your line about about not limited your dating pool made me laugh out loud.

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Pickles_in_my_tuna: Sucks for your friend. I don't think anywhere here is arguing that there aren't people--both men AND women--who truly want marriage and family and, as they get older, are pretty frantic about it. (Having been on numerous dating sites, I can assure you that the xy's get pretty freaking aggressive about getting you into their houses to change the wallpaper and make them buy you a fucking car so they're not alone at night, too.) What everyone here is objecting to is the cloying, despicable way Gottlieb--and, by extension, the Atlantic--seems secure in their tsk-tsk pity for me to not have a man. I am happy to bring a PARTNER in my life. But anyone who thinks I'd be happier off with some mediocre dude yelling "Bravo" at ESPN on my couch or whatever the fuck she says would make me die happy needs to take some Project Runway, mindless sex and paycheck bonus and call me in the morning.

I also love how she's like, "I asked my friends for their husbands, and no one has taken me up on it!" No flies on you, Gottlieb.

Entonces is ironing your dumb ass

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @cate3710: huh, lots of people have problems replying to me for some reason. Maybe I'm doing something wrong...

It's funny, cuz my mom got married at 26, and I'm now 27 and she keeps telling me there's no rush. I don't think my mom regrets getting married - she hasn't said anything like that - but she definitely had to make some sacrifices for my dad's career. So, I think because of that she really wants my sister and I to do our own thing.

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Dogtanian: @howdybeep: Happiness does take work. Marriage takes work. Having and caring for children takes work. Just about everything takes work. Hopefully you'll get back what you put into.

OK here's a tale and I think this is somewhat what some women fear and it's happened/is happening with one of my friends. She is an accomplished person, got her degree, makes a good living, owns her home, has toys (a boat, a cabin), is athletic, smart, funny, attractive. She is also 45, never married and entered an early menopause at @40 and has been told she "missed the boat" on becoming pregnant. Her own eggs are too old to harvest for a surrogate.

Every year when I throw a birthday party for our youngest it's a large event (at that young age parents accompany their kids) and it's a party for everyone so there is plenty of alcohol for the adults. For the past four years someone at the party inevitable walks up to me and says "why is X crying" or "oh yeah, you're friend X...". Well, she has a few drinks and looks around at all the parents ("married") and the cute kids and begins her horrific descent into that ugly place of regrets/what ifs/why not me. And as with many people after a couple of cocktails it all comes pouring out. But even without the liquid reality check, when we have conversations about it, she is truly unhappy that she did not marry and have children. She has been with someone now for almost two years and he is a wonderful man, but at 50 very set in his ways and lifestyle. Yes, he would like children, but no he does not want to adopt.

So does she keep the man whom she does love and live without children or does she try to adopt, get a baby and say later to the man and raise a child alone? Are either one of those choices settling? After all what she really wants is the man and the baby package deal.

Does she scratch it all and continue to look for the whole package knowing how elusive its been for the past 20 years? BTW, if the average age to start dating is 16 and she is 45, she has been "dating" for 29 years. 29 YEARS.

I certainly do not have any answers for her. Her situation does seems to be very common. It may look sad and desperate and something wrong with her when you are in your twenties and feeling pretty strong and independent. In your thirties you may tell yourself that won't happen to you. But when you turn 40 and realize, like the woman in the article it is you or will be you, that's fucking a scary, sad and miserable place to be apparently for a good number of women.

PICKLES

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Does anyone know if this woman has ever been married before? Because the way she talks about it makes me think that she has no clue what it's like, and by extension just how much it makes your life suck when you have to share it with someone you are not totally into sharing it with.

whynotshesaid

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Eh, she's right. I will probably marry my nice, sweet, dorky, not at all good-looking boyfriend. I know he'll be a great husband and father (I want kids, non-negotiable), even though he's never set my heart racing. Sure, ideally I'd like an an attractive, charismatic alpha dude, but I'm realistic. With my average looks and shy personality, that's not the type of guy I'm able to attract. (My boyfriend, on the other hand, is certainly not settling--he thinks I'm, like, the awesomest chick ever, plus more attractive than the girls he's dated in the past!)

Re: Peak marital value: All the hollow anger directed at this phrase mostly proves that deep inside you know Gottlieb is right, but you don't like it.

julsy

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Happiness takes work.

howdybeep (runs with monkey wrenches)

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Ok this article pissed me off to no end and I have to weigh in. First, I have a mother who asked me to "just settle and get married." The fact that my mother is still in the process of divorcing a man who ruined her finances and with whom she spent 30 miserable years didn't apparently teach her anything about "settling." Second, this twat is just a miserable human being and rather than wondering why and how she can fix the things she's uncomfortable with she's focusing on the easiest answer "because I'm single." If you're miserable and self-hating when you're single, you'll be miserable and self-hating when you're married. Marriage is not some magical panacea for whatever ails you. In sum, Laurie grow the fuck up and get a (better) therapist, but don't put your shit on me and my single ass.

Alohamaid

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> After a heartbreaking breakup with Mr. Big, there's a reason why Carrie started dating Aidan. Is just fooling around/dating someone kinda blah settling, even if you have no intention of marrying them? I don't think it is. Not every guy you're in a relationship with has to be a soul mate. Granted, I'm 21, and probably won't understand what settling means to this lady for another two decades...

judgingnora

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> There are women who've had the "soul mate" who is dark, passionate, intense, beautiful, and everything society tells us is romantic and good...but, that person, for whatever reason turns out to be less than ideal. And then, a woman has to try to find another soul mate (unlikely). What then? Does she wander the world alone looking for another perfect one, obsessing over the first? Or, maybe she should try men that she wouldn't have before? Maybe his faults turn out later to be attributes? Maybe the things he has that are unlike the first make him wonderful and good, and exactly the right person for her, but not a "soul mate" at all.

And, might I add...no matter how strong we are, or feministy we are, we all long for someone to hold us at the end of the day. It doesn't make you a weak 1950's housewife...it makes you human. So, don't struggle with this...it will ruin your life. No matter how shitty men can be, hetero women we still need/want them.

PoisonPixie

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @cate3710: i concur! we've all been there, and there's no shame in dating a douchebag-- the shame is ignoring the concerns of your friends or not stepping up to tell your friend that a guy (this guy!) is a controlling, potential abuser, douche.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: Oh wow, that's all different kinds of bad and worrisome. Controlling behavior like that is NOT GOOD (in fact, I'd say it qualifies as emotional abuse), and you're right to be bothered.

This is way, way out of my league, but I encourage you to talk to a trustworthy and informed adult (maybe a teacher, school counselor or someone at a women's shelter) about the situation and try to help your friend.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Dogtanian: *because I can spell really, sometimes, just not when i have a picture of something delicious in front of me.

Dogtanian

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @IT'STHEROOO- Excellent advice.

Actually, reading the comments on this thread reminded me of why I read Jezebel, you're a bunch of wise ladies.

Can I also add that even if you do find cool and lovely guy, life does not turn into a big bowl of happily ever after.

Happiness is up to you, whether you're single, in a relationship, married or whatever and life is what you make it.

Finally - that milkshake looks gooood! I would eat it, not vomit it up and let it pass through my digestive system at a natural pace becuase that's how you look after a good milkshake.

Dogtanian

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @cate3710: Yep. And it's all a secret relationship (as far as her family goes) because her mom doesn't like him. It's infuriating that I can never see my BEST FRIEND because he throws a fucking hissy fit if I try to. Apparently he "doesn't trust me" because he thinks I'll "make her find another guy" (he seems to think I'm some sort of whore because I haven't found the "right one" yet and have had two boyfriends within the past year or so). Sorry for the paragraph but it bothers me more than anything. =/

bombaxstar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> My mother has been divorced twice, so there's been very little pressure to "settle" in my family. How fucking boring! I don't see why the prime goal of a woman's life is "Attain Man." I understand the fear of being alone but I'd rather be with my delightful friends than spend my evenings with some mouth-breathing douche because he fulfills the "has a penis" requirement.

Not to say that I don't like the mens...they have their uses...but ultimately, "settle this."

UndeadLemon

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> That is so sad. I really can't think of much else to say besides that.

Jadoremonchat

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: best friend has been with a guy for the last year (who never lets me see her, btw) and wants to marry him right as she turns 18

Aah! Big, scary warning bells ringing in my head! Based on this very limited info, that does NOT sound like a good situation.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Abogada: A take off of the old "are you me?" thing... Are you my mom? Either way, *giant hug*

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @goodcheapfun: Yep. And hopefully medical school after that.

I don't even know WHY I worry about it exactly. I just do. I guess it doesn't help that my best friend has been with a guy for the last year (who never lets me see her, btw) and wants to marry him right as she turns 18, and one of my other good friends is already engaged.

bombaxstar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Mommy's Little Attention Whore: Why can I never reply to your comments without doing HTML voodoo? Why?

Anyway, moving on: who are these women whose mothers are telling them not to be so picky? ... I guess I live in supportive parent bizarro world...

I live in supportive parent (well, mother) bizarro world, too. Anyone remember that cell phone commercial where the daughter calls up the mom to tell her that she and the bf are in Vegas? The call cuts out, and the mom is freaking out, afraid they got married, saying "Don't make the same mistake I did!" Yeah, my mom saw that and called me up to say "No, really, don't make the same mistake I did." And I'm not going to.

cate3710

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Erm. If I had testicles, they would have retracted into my torso at this point. What a castrating wing-nut. She should leave her kid's fuschia tutu in the toybox too. With these chicks, 40 IS NOT the new 20. She might as well be 65 with that mentality.

Tanith

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @marie123: YES!! Neither me or the hubs wants kids, we have three cats and we like it that way. Constant warm, furry snorgles.

One of the most beautiful and realistic writings about "true love" I've read is this one:[gretachristina.typepad.com]

Brigit

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> "It's like musical chairs-when do you take a seat, any seat, just so you're not left standing alone?"

In my view never. More than ten years ago I broke up with a man who wanted to marry me, but over the years we were together, I felt my identity slipping away, and I felt as though he didn't treat me as a true equal and partner. I ended the relationship, and I have never regretted it for a moment. I'm perfectly comfortable standing alone.

I've been in relationships I enjoyed tremendously since then with men who were far more suitable partners, but I also find that I'm equally happy when I'm not in a relationship. Being partnered comes with tremendous stress sometimes, and in good partnerships each partner has to make compromises and tradeoffs at one point or another. In recent years, I've seen my career really take off, and I'm not sure it would have if I'd been partnered and had to see to the needs of another human being. Would I rather have been married or had a boyfriend during this time? Honestly, I'm not sure. Would I have seen my career move at the same pace? I've never once been with a man who didn't act jealous of the time and energy I give to my career, and I can't deny that their jealousy was often justified. At the same time, I enjoy my work, and I've enjoyed my success in recent years. And as shocking as some might find this statement, I'm glad I didn't have to worry about making tradeoffs in the name of a relationsihp while I was working my way up the ladder. Does that make me a terribly selfish person? I don't know. But I don't have any regrets, and I have wonderful friends who keep me from feeling alone in the world.

I recently had a candid discussion with a single friend of mine, and we both agreed that we have a hard time motivating ourselves to date because we like what we already have, and have a hard enough time squeezing in all the people who are already in our lives. Being 30 or 40 and single can be a wonderful, rich life if you can tune out all the noise from outside.

twistedspinster

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @fizzyg: Huh. And, kind of embarrassed that I know this, but Barry was going to marry the best friend, and right before the wedding, cheated on her with Rachel.

That guy was kind of a schmuck.

braak

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: "I'm 17 and am terrified that I'll never get married, and will end up settling or something."

Wow, I never thought about it at your age (I'm now in my 30's, been married and am not now). Aren't you preparing for College or something?

goodcheapfun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> "marital value was at its peak".

This is the most offensive, disgusting statement a woman can make. Fuck you. Thank you to the lesbians out there and the single women who enjoy sex on their own terms. Meaningless sex looks SO good right now (and not because I'm heading down the slope of my marital value!). Because what the fuck do you really need a dude for other then sex (especially if you already used a donor for your kid).

goodcheapfun

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Well here's the thing:

I don't understand girls/women who nix guys on the dumbest (or vaguest) pretenses at any time in life. Men are just flawed messed up people like us, and I don't understand how so much of this discourse is polluted by a 'perfect man' v 'loser' dichotomy. That shit is just as bad as 'madonna' v 'whore.'

Give things a shot. Have an open heart and an open mind. If it doesn't work, you learned something.

Also, PS, you don't have to be married to have a loving partner to raise your children (holler, Goldie and Kurt!). Perhaps if women didn't reek of deperation to sign a legal contract, men would hang around. The validity of marriage itself would be a great thread...

betakitty

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Um, the orthodontist was a complete arsehole IIRC. If you're going to reference TV shows, at least watch them.

bowleserised

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @bombaxstar: No, no! Not at 17 - you have all the time in the world. I'm 35, so it's OK for me to be despondent. (yes I'm kidding).

VoxPopuli

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Don't hate me, but I actually agree with this woman somewhat. I wouldn't settle for someone I wasn't attracted to, or someone who is abusive, but other things are negotiable as I get older.
Some women always have boyfriends, etc. and just seem to draw men in and will probably get to pick and choose as they like. I'm in the other group, so I tend to be more forgiving of men's flaws - and yes, sometimes too forgiving but I always snap out of it.
But I have no problem being single if it someone acceptable doesn't come along. Still, I'm sorry to say that there's some truth in what she says, in my opinion.

VoxPopuli

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I actually cried reading that article. I'm the most paranoid person ever. I'm 17 and am terrified that I'll never get married, and will end up settling or something. Like I'm reaching my "ZOMG MARRIAGABLE PEAK!!"

Fuck you Lori Gottlieb

bombaxstar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> As a woman dating one of those men that Gottlieb cast aside, I'm grateful that she waited until now to get desperate. From what I've heard, she's just as crazy as you might imagine.

bamber

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Right...because there isn't enough mediocrity in this world...and "marital value"? since when did matrimony become a stock market? It's nice to see our feminine freedom and independence has become a commodity. Someone ought to chuck a copy of Das Kapital at her head...maybe it'll help save those milkshakes for people that actually savor them.

BtwnTheBars

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I know women who got married just to do it before they turned 30. I don't know when 30 turned into the finish line for marriage. Anyway, those marriages ended in spectacularly terrible ways. Of course.

LisaMc

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Abogada: THANK YOU!

katastic

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Kill me first. KILL. ME. FIRST.

katastic

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @ivanabtaken: A-MEN. Thank you for saying that so succinctly. Because if somebody thinks they 'settled' for you, or if you think you 'settled' for somebody, both of you are still gonna be looking.

panther61

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> could one of you wonderful women who don't want kids find it in your heart to come out to SF and steal my wealthy/geeky brother who doesn't want to have kids away from his i needed a 25K engagement ring because my friends will talk otherwise fiance? she's a waspy see you next tuesday and i hate her. and this comes from someone who has been happily married w/ a beautiful daughter for the past 10 years.
btw, he'll be 42 this month & has no debt!


dvs

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I'm 43 and single with no kids and happier than I've ever been in my life. I wouldn't mind being attached, but I have trouble tolerating my closest friends when they're being whiney or needy or make a mess when they're staying over - why would I want a HUSBAND that I don't at least feel passionately in love with when he annoys me by being whiney, needy and messy (as we all are and do at times)? Insanity.

40's and single is not a death sentence if you don't treat it like one.

Jaztea

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Of course, we'd be loath to admit it in this day and age, but ask any soul-baring 40-year-old single heterosexual woman what she most longs for in life, and she probably won't tell you it's a better career or a smaller waistline or a bigger apartment. Most likely, she'll say that what she really wants is a husband (and, by extension, a child).

Oh, shut the eff up, Hector Projector! I mean, do I want to be old and alone, of course not. No one does. But forty is not old. And there are no guarantees in life anyway. Don't try to depress the well-adjusted independent ladies just because you feel fug and sad, Gottlieb.

Also, I checked out her site and she wrote an article for Salon called "But Enough About Me: Does Writing a Memoir Give People Carte Blanche to Analyze Your Life[?]"

a. duh
b. your link's broken, brain trust

LvV

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Also did she even watch Sex and the City? Carrie didn't want a Baby Bjorn.

merci

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Moe - you are the bees's knees! It's great how you see through things.

merci

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Actually, that would be MAJOR case squad. Law and Orders are starting to run together in my brain. I dream of an all-star Law and Order featuring Tutuola, Munch and Benson from SVU, Goren for CI and the late great Lennie Brisco from the original series.

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Well, if I had to choose between Aidan and Big, or Barry and Ross, I would opt for Detective Robert Goren of the special case squad, since I don't want to limit my New York-based fictional character dating pool. Also, I don't want to settle.

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> ok, if i were able to speak right now, there would be little flecks of angry spittle on my monitor. i'm not exactly a role model, but my personal experience has been that being single and unattached is INFINITELY preferable to being stuck in a crappy marriage. mr. "good enough" never is. period.

kittenfoo

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I saw this kook on the Today show this morning and laughed out loud. Her shtick totally reminded me of "You have a better chance of being shot by a terrorist than of getting married if you're a woman over 40..." that whole line of crap that we all heard during the 90s. Ho-hum.

The concept of "settling" for a life partner is absurd on its face.

Settle for a half-assed manicure, or an overdone steak, or a car you're not crazy about. Don't settle for a spouse who doesn't make you weak in the knees.

NoStyleHere

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @marie123: petfinder is my go-to site when i'm all hormonal and nuts.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I was sitting on a scuba boat w/ single people when I was 40. Some guy asked why I was married. Right that moment, I wondered too, but I said "It's good to know somebody's got your back." I broke my neck 6 weeks later, and he drives me insane many times, but he's got my back. Given all that, 7 years later, and the damned grass is still greener.

Mrs. DeLesseps To You, Dahling

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @Abogada: srsly, thank you for your wisdom, sister. even the strongest among us has the wobbles when they contemplate having to leave out lots of food so's the cats don't eat you. or in my case, dogs.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @AAES: I feel sorry for her too, but can't believe she's telling people to settle.
I'm 40 and single. I've been engaged six times - whatever, stop judging. I didn't want to settle.
I just couldn't imagine being married to any of them without being a raging alcoholic/pill popper wife and mother.



CreoleSugar

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I don't know. My cousin always had the most fantastically hot, fun boyfriends, but none of them wanted to get married. When she hit 29, she went on Match.com and was married and pregnant by the time she was 31. She married an accountant nothing wrong with accountants in general, he just fits the stereotype. He's not attractive, and maybe he's a great guy, but the times I've met him I've wanted to punch him.

She wanted to get married and have kids, so I can understand why she wanted to dump her cool, commitment-phobe boyfriends, I just don't know if it was necessary for panic to set in at 29. Settling for "Mr. OK" got her a family, and maybe what she sacrificed was worth it to her.

I can't imagine wanting to have kids in the first place, and I really can't imagine settling for someone. At the same time I am totally committed to my boyfriend even though he's short, I don't really feel the need to go out and find someone 4 inches taller, and I know a lot of my friends would really care about something like that! I can understand the overall point that if you want kids, or want to have a serious boyfriend, you might need to sacrifice some things.

goldengirl11

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @ihateyourescalade: Yes. I agree with both of you, and am embarrassed to admit that money was big on my list. I'm still not entirely over that, but it's nothing to end a marriage for. We're certainly not starving. And things will very likely get better. They can always get better.

I used to think I needed someone who shared my whole worldview, and I dated a few of those and found out that it's not all it's cracked up to be. I like being challenged. I do not like being mirrored. I like that my work is my own thing and his is his own thing. And it makes me so happy to see what a terrific dad he is. If anything gives me that fall-in-love-all-over-again feeling, it's that.

TheFormerJuneBronson

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I almost married a man who lost his damn mind and told me he couldn't help but wonder if there was more/better out there for him. Luckily, in his insane delusion, he made it horribly easy for me to dodge what would have been the biggest mistake of my life. When I get lonely and sad that I don't have anyone, I just remind myself that it would have been infinitely more painful to be with someone who i knew didn't love me the way i deserved. I don't believe in settling, but what I do believe in is finding someone you're crazy about, who is crazy about you, and trying your hardest to make the rest work out.

kikiGee

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @JessicaLovejoy: I know he's on it but it's all downhill for him after that show.

Macloserboy

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> And the guys I know who want children (I'm in my early 20s) don't even LIKE children so much--it's more of a status, bread-winner, knock up the broad because she likes kids kinda thing."

@toothsome: That shit pisses me off to no end (women are guilty of it too, but I think the "Must spread seed....go to work, dick!" sentiment is worse...esp. considering of alot of MOMS get both the breadwinner shift and the domestic duty shift).

And yes, I find myself cruising Petfinder and Petco and wistfully staring at people's cats and dogs on the street (babies and children occasionally too, but Jesus, if someone offered me my own, I'd run screaming in the other direction)....planning for the time in my life when I won't be such an asshole and can commit to thrice-daily walkings and space for my dog, or else, two cats and their litter boxes and Kitty Kastles.

I think of animals--basically as cuddly as children, and they never grow up, at least intellectually (no cerebral cortex, but easier to please...)--and wonder why the hell so many mediocre, "Why did I have kids again?" parents couldn't have tested out their willingness to clean up after a little emotional/financial dependent by testing large pets first.

Ramble, ramble.

I'm all for the "my animals are my children, but here's a check for the National Center for Missing Exploited Children and Teach for America" adulthood.

marie123

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @it'stherooo: I would add to your excellent advice that women get over the need to have Mr. Right also be a freaking investment banker or independently wealthy.

ihateyourescalade

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @marie123: YES! I do not want children either (or may, but really am pretty certain that I don't) and these sorts of women drive me batty.

As for ending up alone, there are plenty of wonderful, nurturing men out there who don't want children either. They would rather live their own lives, with a partner, and enjoy children as uncle or whatever. I'm dating one right now! And the guys I know who want children (I'm in my early 20s) don't even LIKE children so much--it's more of a status, bread-winner, knock up the broad because she likes kids kinda thing. Or they like kids and are searching for some wide-hipped 18 year old to have them with (uh, exact sentiments of one of my male roomates, claiming it's "genetic" to have urges like that right now. ok. and he has a girlfriend, and kinda wants to break up with her, so he can sleep around again. so, wouldn't trust his take.)

Anyway, my point is... have animals. And the menz out there are just as diverse as the ladies in neurosis, looks, personality, children-wanting, etc. Just like us, they don't all want the same thing. Which gets shoved down our throats anyway. Bleh.

toothsome

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> @marie123: Funny thing is, I do think you're going to find that guy. He'll be older, with grown kids from a previous marriage, and will think you are the most refreshing woman he's ever met. Godspeed, sister.

ihateyourescalade

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I think the "settling" thing has been dramatically misconstrued to the detriment of many, because it was never properly defined.

I am so tired of hearing men say they're not going to "settle" for "less than a dyme". GLAP GLAP GLAP.

Here it is, people.

You SETTLE on LOOKS.

You DON'T settle on CHARACTER.

And you work on compatibility.

Then you don't end up with a gorgeous nutcase who abuses you before s/he takes the kids and splits your head in two.

That is all.

P.S. I'm sure I sound quite pompous. But let's take a look around at the world that's been created by folks doing the opposite, shall we?

Rooo sez BISH PLZ

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> someone take her kid away, stat! she's teaching it this deranged shite.

Charlotte Corday

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> ugh. i do appreciate her honesty, however. at the same time, i question the atlantic's choice to publish something so... tired. haven't we beaten this subject to death, already? women have choices (thank heavens), make your choices, and live your flippin' life already.
settling? it sounds like she simply judges others way too much, and is overly concerned about their judgement of her.
articles like this in publications with wide male readership just perpetuate bullshit platitudes about what women become when they pass that "certain age". now, she just comes off as a neurotic, conceited man-hater. either men only want young things to reproduce with, or they are too weird for her and her fabulous circle of women friends.
hmmm.
i'm sure many men would be insulted by her insinuations. but they will probably just go back to their life of knocking up young things, being "too wierd" (i.e. socially inept, successful and handsome but rude, etc.), and just being whoever the hell they are to really give a damn.

toothsome

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> OK, so I finally got through it all. That was one of the most depressing reads ever. In fact, it made me LESS inclined to want to get married. Also - who are these women whose mothers are telling them not to be so picky? I don't think my mom has liked anyone my sister or I have dated. She once said, after a family friend got married for the first time at forty, that this is why we shouldn't rush into marriage or simply settle; give it time, and eventually find a person with whom we'd be the most happy - and the most compatible. I guess I live in supportive parent bizarro world...

That_little_attention_whore

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Ok, so I crunched the numbers, and I am totally over the curve. I'm like milk that you smell and aren't sure about!

Will he still pour me on his Cinnamon Toast Crunch? I don't know!!!

Inkymonkey

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> f your goal is to have babies, then "settling" for a decent man--someone who perhaps falls short of your Mr. Perfect ideals, but someone who cares for you and will be a good father and a good companion and is actually there in front of you and not just a conceptual man who may never materialize...well, I don't entirely disagree.@ihateyourescalade: I agree if you're someone looking for someone who will help you invest in your child...but many would argue that "Mr. Right" loves you AND loves the children you share.

I agree with everything else regarding the problems with "settling" and I particularly resent her because (after reading her really, REALLY depressing memoir---her parents were DISGUSTING people, if her diary was accurate, and it was pretty straightforward descriptions of their day-to-day interaction that really said it) she bitches and moans extra b/c she's a single mom through in vitro.

I understand wanting to have a child before "Mr. Right" comes if he keeps you waiting, but like others said...she's just OBNOXIOUS. I've read some of her other stuff.

Not to be an asshole--but I wonder if she'd be so grating if she wasn't raising a son (couldn't have adopted, Lori?) alone, and then bitching about it. Or if it would seem any less distasteful. (I sure as hell know I would want to "settle" for a good earner, a kind, warm, averagely attractive body, and someone to cuddle and help me raise my child if I was in position. Good thing I don't want kids.)

I don't know.

That said--100% I would have gone with John Corbett and his precious, smiley, dreamy-faced little bald one and dog over Mr. Big any day, but then again, my "Mr. Right" will fucking accept I may like kids and be a caring aunt/child advocate, whatever....do not want kids.

Don't think I ever will.

And will probably die alone because of it, b/c I like the sort of warm and fuzzy guys who have enough empathy and good-humoredness to be nice and sympathetic to children and animals.

marie123

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> I don't know how "super-skinny" her poses make her look...mostly it seems like she's got a stiff neck or nearsightedness.

Lowti

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Didn't Po Bronson interview her? Isn't she, like, bipolar and anorexic or some combination?

I'd like to know she devoted her time to self-care before I listened to her advice on an issue this sensitive for those of us that are past, oh, 15. Sinz then ur old and cannot moddle.

Rooo sez BISH PLZ

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]> Settle? Shia, what if you find "Mr. Right" and pop out some cuties only to discover you're Mr. Right thinks he shouldn't have to work anymore and boy, shouldn't you grant my every whim? Oh, and don't dare complain about it, or he'll pull out everything in the book that you do wrong. Basically, life has no guarantees... you're better off keeping your eyes & your heart open. If you settle for 2nd rate and you lose ground, you'll be buried! And once you're in for awhile, you may find you don't have the courage to high-tail it.

PixiePoser

]]> <![CDATA[Settle For Mr. "Just OK" -- While Your "Marital Value Is Still At Its Peak!"]]>