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"I Don't Like Saying It"
The Truth Might Not Be Pretty, But Obama Makes You Like It Anyway

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AboutToLaugh is longwinded
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"

I saw this picture the other day of a 1959 anti-integration protest, and I feel like the tea-baggers are saying the exact same thing today as these people were 50 years ago. They're just more careful about not putting the words "race mixing" on their signs now.
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bluebears promoted this comment

bluebears
09/24/09

@AboutToLaugh is longwinded: pretty much.
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HilliardTortoise
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
I was on Drudge earlier this morning, and I clicked on the link to an email about the Obama's churlish behavior towards Brown. Apparently, the animums between the two has to do with release the of the Lockerbie bomber. Anyhoo, the drudge commenters (who you would think would side with Obama since he didn't want a Libyan terrorist released) kept saying that Obama hates Britian because his grandfather was tortured by British Colonials. And he's a Kenyan who hates the British. And he's a black who is racist against the British.

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Rooo sez BISH PLZ promoted this comment HilliardTortoise was starred HilliardTortoise was unstarred

Rooo sez BISH PLZ
09/24/09

@HilliardTortoise: When do they get to the fact that he's ZOMGMUSLIM because of his middle name?

*rolls eyes*
*despairs at ignorance*
*worries about corporate China takeover of USA because US ignorance so blatantly on international display, on repeat*
*considers moving to the moon*
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Edited by Rooo sez BISH PLZ at 09/24/09 1:24 PM Rooo sez BISH PLZ was starred

TheUptightMidwesterner
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
It all boils down to the politics of fear. This is not a new thing, but has been proven to be a very effective tool since September 12, 2001. The fact that the Democratic adversary is black is simply icing on the cake for the Conservatives. Think about what Glenn Beck said about Obama being racist against whites. All he did was try to legitimize their racism. "Well, Obama hates whites, so its okay to hate him for being black" or along that line of thought.The assholes out there know there is a fear of the government, fear of the left, and fear of blacks and they are just throwing it all in the blender.
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Edited by TheUptightMidwesterner at 09/24/09 12:01 PM

elysse
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Poor Mondale, forever remembered as "VP to Jimmy Carter, the most awesome prez that ever happened and no-one appreciated".
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ promoted this comment Edited by elysse at 09/24/09 12:01 PM elysse was starred elysse was unstarred

morninggloria
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Obama is black?!?!?!
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bluebears
09/24/09

@morninggloria: I think he prefers the term Kenyan.
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erinna
09/24/09

@morninggloria: Only half. He's also half normal.
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MizJenkins promoted this comment erinna was starred erinna was unstarred

boobookitt
09/24/09

@morninggloria: I know right?
He's so well groomed and well spoken you can barely tell!
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hellosunshine
09/24/09

@morninggloria: Since when!?
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AlbertaOileus
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Half of my family are rural Republicans (actually moved out of the cities to avoid non-whites). With any Democratic president, they assume the administration will write laws that take their money and give it to non-whites. The fact that Obama is black has sent them into a tailspin, since they figure he's even more motivated to take from them to give to non-whites. One of them still thinks Bush was a wonderful man ("So religious!"). The rest, not so much--I'm amazed they can at least admit he was a horrible mistake on their part, that's huge for them. Sometimes I can't believe we're in the same family...
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J.D.Regent promoted this comment SarahMC approved this comment AlbertaOileus was starred AlbertaOileus was unstarred

J.D.Regent
09/24/09

@AlbertaOileus: It's becoming clearer and clearer to me that the white fear of a black president is very much based on this fantasy that capital, goods and services will be removed from white hands and placed into black hands. I think this fear of racial redistribution is part of what's behind the "socialism" refrain. What's interesting to me about it is that the attitude seems to acknowledge white privilege, that whites have been benefiting all these years from having "their own" in charge. I suppose that is the unrepentant racist attitude, as opposed to those who claim race blindness. In a way I kind of prefer it; it seems more honest and more possible to have a conversation with, if that makes any sense. I mean what can you say to a racist who claims they don't see race? At least your relatives admit it.
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SarahMC
09/24/09

@J.D.Regent: Oh no, I don't think it's an acknowledgment of privilege at all. They think white people work harder than minorities and thus, deserve every penny that's "rightfully" theirs. You are right on about the socialism charge though. It's not blatantly racist but when you consider the context, it is.
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erinna
09/24/09

@J.D.Regent: Yes, exactly, and they somehow see minorities as the root of all problems. I was having a conversation with my dad recently, and I was telling him that Australia has a higher standard of living than the US. He said, with a totally straight face, "Thats probably because they have fewer minorities". I just dropped the conversation because I didn't know where to go with that and didn't want an argument since I only see him like every other month or so...
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wtfox?! promoted this comment erinna was starred erinna was unstarred

wtfox?!
09/24/09

@AlbertaOileus: lly moved out of the cities to avoid non-whites). With any Democratic president, they assume the administration will write laws that take their money and give it to non-whites.

I kind of wish Obama or someone would say "You know, you're right! That's exactly what we're going to do." And then, while all the conservatives and Republicans are helplessly swooning with horror, hustle health care reform through.
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
09/24/09

@J.D.Regent: What Rorschach do you interpret in the fact that I unwittingly read this
"racial redistribution"
as this
"retribution"
?
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ was starred

boobookitt
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
I think this is more than 'feeling it':

[wonkette.com]
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MizJenkins promoted this comment boobookitt was starred boobookitt was unstarred

SarahMC
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
IT IS NOT GOP VS DEM WHEN WINGNUTS ARE CALLING THE PUBLIC OPTION "REPARATIONS" AND SAYING OBAMA IS "ROBBIN for the HOOD."

Ahem. Sorry.
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
09/24/09

@SarahMC: I think you need a backbeat for that.
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Evie Havok
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Yes! Thank you, Mondale. I'm very glad that he said this. Two previously powerful and influential white men finally saying it how it is might change the perception of other whites. God knows no one listens when people of color call out racism. No one can la di da and stick their fingers in their ears this time around.
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
09/24/09

@Evie Havok: Want to bet? Watch the majority of the Democratic party do it. Just like they did when President Carter did it.
Polit-geeking out here a bit, but are you familiar with the party's response to the "Wiliie Horton"/"furlough" ads in the 1988 Presidential election?

Rethugs do that stuff because it works.

Which is why the people I really laugh at are the ones that say America is a 'post-racial' society.

(If I'm feeling really snarky, I say things like "Do you mean South America?"
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Edited by Rooo sez BISH PLZ at 09/24/09 1:34 PM Rooo sez BISH PLZ was starred

Highsmith
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
The Republicans are master demagogues. I can't think of any other country in the world where the unwashed masses are railing against something they will greatly benefit from.
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PinkSoxHat promoted this comment Highsmith was starred Highsmith was unstarred

greengrey
09/24/09

@Highsmith: But...but...one day they might make it to the top 1%! They need to protect their future position!
The average American isn't happy being average, they think one day they'll succeed. They won't. But thinking they will keeps them working and keep them from killing the rich.
Republicans are pretty brilliant sometimes.
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Highsmith
09/24/09

@greengrey: yeah, right? Poor babies. Studies have shown that the great majority of people will never make it out of their social class.
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greengrey
09/24/09

@Highsmith: SOCIALIST LIAR! Studies show that AMERICANS who WORK HARD can be rich! What do you think this is, Europe? We don't have any class systems! ANYONE can move up! Heh.
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TurtleSpeak
09/24/09

@Highsmith: Yeah well those people just aren't working hard enough. Pull yourself up by the bootstraps, people! Be good Amurricans and work 'til you die.
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birminghamdrunk
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
this is pretty telling of a lot of whites' sentiment on the issue- they feel it- they know what it is, but they're uncomfortable calling a spade a spade.

it's beyond me why not, as once you've done it, you realize how easy it actually is. that no one is going to fucking arrest you, or chastise you for it- though here in south you might risk a few friends or perhaps your job.

but whatever. i've reached the point where my perceived though veiled racism cup runneth over, and i'm not holding back anymore. i'd advice everyone else to do the same. Call it like it is! Believe me, the racists sure are.

sigh. /end rant.
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greengrey
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Bad ass. He said it better than I could ever. Most of the time it just comes out as "but...the disrespect! did you? see the!? with at?! and the GUH! NO ONE DID THIS TO BUSH."
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tankearae
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Yep. Today I was driving to work behind a car - a brand new VW - that was COVERED in slogans. Not even bumperstickers, these were hand made message like "Obama makes Bush look smart and honest" and "Obama wants you to keep your head in the sand."

Its amazing that while you saw some of this in the Bush administration, it wasn't until he'd...well...led us into war. WHERE does this anger come from? What as Obama DONE at this point to warrant it?

I looked at the guy who was driving, it was an older white man. And yesterday I saw a truck with an American flag that had painted "I DON'T WANT TO PAY FOR YOUR OBAMA CARE" on the back of it. Driver was a white guy with a mullet. (No, really. I was at a stop light. He had a mullet. I swear I'm not being flip. It just doesn't help his case.)
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Maritsa promoted this comment Edited by tankearae at 09/24/09 11:36 AM tankearae was starred tankearae was unstarred

kiddicus
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
Isn't playing the race card in this situation kind of a cop-out? The GOP is going to berate and try to undermine any Dem. president -

The color of his skin certainly isn't winning over any bible-thumpers, but he's articulate, intelligent and well-groomed. Whether you agree with his policies, you have to admit we've upgraded from the last yokel.
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tankearae
09/24/09

@kiddicus: While it may be a bit of a cop out, there is a certain degree of anger this time around that differs from even the usual GOP b.s..

Maybe its just resentment from what has been a bitter decade of politics, but its certainly troubling no matter how you slice it.
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SarahMC promoted this comment Edited by tankearae at 09/24/09 11:36 AM tankearae was starred tankearae was unstarred

SarahMC
09/24/09

@tankearae: Nah, it's not a cop-out at all. Most people ranting and raving at Obama can't articulate what policies they oppose and why. Because there aren't any. It's about their identity as white Americans and his identity as The Other.

I have no idea what that "articulate, intelligent and well-groomed" comment is about above you. Aye aye aye.
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bluebears
09/24/09

@kiddicus: why is it a cop-out? yeah they would try to undermine any democrat president but no one ever heckled a dem. president during a congressional address, no one ever questioned the religious beliefs and country of origin of a democratic president. It's the way repubs are going about it, its what they're saying. I think its a cop-out to not recognize it for what it really is, racism.
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kiddicus
09/24/09

@tankearae: I guess I'd agree with that... it does seem over the top - but I'd been attributing that to the ever-growing instamediafrenzy and the immediacy of information available on the internet. Obama kills a fly, 3000 YouTube clips show up.

Great username btw. makes me thirsty.
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angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip
09/24/09

@kiddicus: Can we please not use the phrase "race card"?
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birminghamdrunk
09/24/09

@kiddicus: cop out it is not. if folks who dislike him so could properly articulate which of his policies and why are so frustrating to them, then yes it would be a cop out to call them racist.

however, the vast majority of his most vocal opposition are incredibly vague as to why they dislike him, and even resort to bold face lies to justify their dislike. calling them racists in not a cop out. it's the truth.
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kithkin
09/24/09

@SarahMC: Yeah, those three words, are--yikes. It's feeling pretty post-racial up here.
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angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip
09/24/09

@angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip: From Democratic Underground:

"When you use the phrase 'race card' you are parroting a right wing meme. It was constructed by the same wingnuts who thought up the 'Southern Strategy'. It was designed to do one thing: belittle real racial grievances. If you feel Obama or his supporters are unfairly using race, there are lots of ways to say it without using such a loaded phrase."
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meanteeth
09/24/09

@kiddicus: "playing the race card" implies that it's a ploy to divert people from the "real" issues. I think a lot of us are scared to be more vocal about what feels like racism because we're then accused of "playing the race card." It's a tough row to hoe. Glad that the people speaking up are white so that they have less of a chance of being accused of "playing the race card."
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Maritsa promoted this comment meanteeth was starred meanteeth was unstarred

J.D.Regent
09/24/09

@kiddicus: I do think it gets a little sloppy to call everything motivated by racism. I know it's hard because we KNOW a lot of these fuckers are racist, but they would be flaying Hills or anyone who was up there right now. SOME of the criticism is CLEARLY racist and we can call it that. But the criticism of the health plan, for example, is obviously a much more complex stupidity than "just" racism and I honestly think that it weakens us when we fail to point out that it's not (just) racist, it's STUPID and INCORRECT. You know?
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erinna
09/24/09

@SarahMC: Well- I do think there are policies to take legitamite issue with, such as Cap and Trade or the bailouts etc. I agree with them, but I can see taking issue with them. However, any actual debate is clouded by all this noise that is simply against anything Obama does simply because he's Obama. Its very frustrating.
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SarahMC promoted this comment erinna was starred erinna was unstarred

angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip
09/24/09

@kiddicus: " Whether you agree with his policies, you have to admit we've upgraded from the last yokel."

But the thing is, ignorant Americans are, well, ignorant. And they don't see Obama as an upgrade. They see him as a Nazi/Socialist/Communist/Muslim/African/the anti-Christ. Maybe they felt cheated by Bush by the end of his term, but they didn't think he was practicing voodoo in the White House.
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SarahMC
09/24/09

@erinna: If people have a problem with cap and trade they are free to articulate why. If they only say "Go back to Kenya" then... you know.
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AlmostDream
09/24/09

@kiddicus: So what would have to happen for you to believe that a lot of the criticism and undermining is motivated by racism? Since you and many others seem unconvinced at this point despite the evidence.
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Maritsa promoted this comment AlmostDream was starred AlmostDream was unstarred

tankearae
09/24/09

@SarahMC: "Most people ranting and raving at Obama can't articulate what policies they oppose and why..."

I don't disagree - actually, I think that's what has struck me the most. I'd like to think its something OTHER than just racism and clearly, there is a ton of resentment built up...the level of the hate from the wing nuts goes beyond the usual and is clearly fueled at least *partially* - if not entirely - by race in some instances.
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Edited by tankearae at 09/24/09 11:55 AM tankearae was starred tankearae was unstarred

bluebears
09/24/09

@angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip: thank you for posting that.
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J.D.Regent
09/24/09

@SarahMC: totally. there is a difference in sort of levels of critique and discourse but I can see why conservatives who have substantive critiques get annoyed at being lumped in with the crazies. On the other hand, I guess it's on them to put a little more distance between them.
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SarahMC
09/24/09

@AlmostDream: I'm pretty sure some people are waiting for someone to call him a nigger or burn a cross on the White House lawn. Anything less than that and it's not racism in their eyes.
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MizJenkins
09/24/09

@kiddicus: Define "cop-out". What are the Democrats trying to avoid exactly? Rebutting the GOP's objections to specific policies? They don't have any.

"He's a Muslim!" and "We don't want Obamacare!" are not policy critiques, they're personal attacks.

"No medical coverage for illegal aliens!" would be, except that it's not an Obama administration policy.

So what is the strategic advantage to be gained from "playing the race card"?
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Evie Havok
09/24/09

@kiddicus: In the future you might want to refrain from constructing an argument/comment with the phrase "playing the race card." It makes you sound like one of them (the right wing crazies). Also, what was the point of referring to Obama as "articulate, intelligent and well-groomed." Why wouldn't he be? Hmmm? None of these help make you look good.
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Pizza!Pizza!Pizza!
09/24/09

@angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip: THANK YOU. I hate that term almost as much as I hate 'crying rape.'
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Pizza!Pizza!Pizza!
09/24/09

@kiddicus: Nah. There are plenty of people who don't have to admit anything. And they've got pics of Obama as a witch doctor to prove it.
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SarahMC
09/24/09

@angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip: "Whether you agree with his policies, you have to admit we've upgraded from the last yokel."

Also, plenty of people will not admit that because they don't think a black man belongs in the White House. Not as president, anyway, heh.
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angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip
09/24/09

@SarahMC: EXAAAAACTLY.
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angelina jolie-laide is a gaudy tulip
09/24/09

@SarahMC: Even if Michael Steele was president, there'd be Republican crazies complaining about a black man in office.
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birminghamdrunk
09/24/09

@kiddicus: well kiddo, i hope you've learned something from this pile on. if not, PM me for some reading material- that is, if you're interested at all, and not running for the hills. i know we all hit you pretty quick, but try to take this as a learning opportunity, and come back stronger.

that's why i hesitated to be condescending because i can't honestly read your vibe. if your originating comment was just made without thinking too much about your wording or your context, then i hate that you've been piled on so. but it's hard to designate not knowing any better from malaise on the interwebs.
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Edited by birminghamdrunk at 09/24/09 12:07 PM birminghamdrunk was starred birminghamdrunk was unstarred

MizJenkins
09/24/09

@all: Heh. Y'all beat me to it! Well done friends...well done.

@kiddicus: Stick around, we'll have you re-educated soon enough ;)
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MizJenkins
09/24/09

@J.D.Regent: ...I can see why conservatives who have substantive critiques get annoyed at being lumped in with the crazies. On the other hand, I guess it's on them to put a little more distance between them.

YES. Absolutely. The one good thing that's coming out of this is that by the end of four years it's going to force a lot complicit/quasi-racists to take a good look at the state of things and choose a side.
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kiddicus
09/24/09

@kiddicus: Wow. I'll have to work less from now on, I suppose. Here goes:

I apologize for using the term "race card" - it is quite tacky, but I couldn't think of a better term at the time.

The "articulate, intelligent, and well-groomed" comment was meant to show that people are overlooking these qualities. Whether that is because of or in spite of his race, no one really knows. We all have a good guess (especially those of us south of the Mason-Dixon line), but there is no "proof"

I actually played both sides of the argument there - which in and of itself is a cop-out. Yes, there are racist people in America. News Flash? No, I do not think that he is receiving any more hate than any other Dem. president would be right now, based on his skin color.

Questioning his religion - well he brought that on himself. Name one other president who didn't openly admit to being Christian in some way, shape or form. There were none.

The "No Obamacare" cries would have been "No Hillacare" cries had she won the primaries.

For the record (and so you all stop calling me a right-wing crazy) my political agenda lies somewhere in the middle, leaning left. I love me some Obama. I love hearing him speak. Half the time, I think he makes mistakes just so he can look smooth and flawless digging himself back out.

Well, that got long winded in a hurry.
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SarahMC promoted this comment kiddicus was starred kiddicus was unstarred

kiddicus
09/24/09

@kiddicus: Damnit! Third paragraph reads: I do not think that he is receiving any more hate than any other Dem. president would be right now, based on his skin color.

What I meant: The same detractors who are calling for his head because of his skin color would be calling for Hillary's because of her gender, or Biden's because of his oldness or something. It is just the easiest target.

/bring on the onslaught.
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SarahMC
09/24/09

@kiddicus: "No, I do not think that he is receiving any more hate than any other Dem. president would be right now, based on his skin color."

Obama faces 400% more death threats than Bush. And a LOT of people hated him.
It's unprecedented and it absolutely does have a lot to do with his race.

[crooksandliars.com]
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kiddicus
09/24/09

@SarahMC: I'm sure that's true, but how many liberals send death threats? Not that many, I'd guess. The people who want to tar & feather Obama are the same damn bible-thumping hillbilly sister-fuckers that elected Bush twice.

The same detractors who are calling for his head because of his skin color would be calling for Hillary's because of her gender, or Biden's because of his oldness or something. It is just the easiest target.
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WashingMyHair
09/24/09

@kiddicus: These same people would possibly have a problem with Hillary because of her gender, though I wonder if it'd be as rage induced as it now seems to be with a bi-racial man in office.

However, I call bs that they'd have a problem with Biden because of his age. Otherwise, why didn't they have a problem with Bush Sr. or Reagan. Why? Because they were white guys.

Sometimes the most obvious answer is the best and truest one!
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bluebears
09/24/09

In reply to "I Don't Like Saying It"
aw. mondale. next up, Dukakis!
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