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Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Speculative Cabinetry Redux: Clinton, Geithner and Richardson To Come On Board

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SkipToMyLou
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Hillary Clinton is my sick fantasy when it involves me getting sick and her providing me with universal health care.
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Dudezebel
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Since Andrew Sullivan's gay, I doubt it is his fantasy, sexual or otherwise, to be punished by Hillary.
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braak: You are, as usual, completely correct.
11/24/08

@Dudezebel: Human sexuality is a vast continuum of attraction and arousal. Just because a person self-identifies as gay does not mean that they're incapable of having sexual fantasies that involve women.
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TheGuvnah
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Omg rebecca traister has given me a reason to read Crappy Hour again!
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morninggloria
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Hillary Clinton is totally shaping up to be that girl that I was always jealous of in high school because she seemed to get along so well with the hot boy clique without oversexualizing herself.
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pantsless economist...access RESTORED
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Re the Geithner pick, I'm wondering if he did not choose Summers because the Treasury Secretary role would have been subject to congressional approval, whereas the advisor role wouldn't.

Just wondering who's gonna chair the NY Fed now. Anyone heard anything?
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ChristieLove
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I literally spat out my coffee over my copy of the Sunday Times yesterday morning when I read that line about Andrew Sullivan wanting to see HRC in a veil. Really, WTF? I mean that was overtly Freudian.
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HarpMadness
11/24/08

@ChristieLove: I don't get why he thought it was okay to write that. I mean, TMI! TMI, dude. Sullivan's sexual fantasies: DO NOT WANT.
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ucelluccia
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Aaaagh, I cannot even focus on this because I am so nervous about who he'll pick for education. Please, please, please pick Linda Darling-Hammond!!! Please?
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rah29
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I can't get my head around what Sullivan thinks he's trying to argue. Clinton just isn't more hawkish than Obama--not in the slightest. They're just hawks/doves in different ways. She supported the Iraq war; he supports airstrikes in Pakistan. She talks a (very, very slightly) harder line on Iran; he counts as an advisor Sam Power, a huge proponent of military intervention for humanitarian causes. Plus, on the world stage, even he admits that HRC has huge political capital and is very well-regarded. So the idea of a good cop/bad cop scenario really is just a fantasty of a mildly sexual nature for dear Sully.
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howdybeep (runs with monkey wrenches)
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I'm actually feeling bad for Richardson at this point. He built his whole damn career for SecState, and it's rumored around the local party he was promised the position if he'd switch his pledge of support from Hilary to Barry (and it's also rumored that she wouldn't commit to giving him any sort of position of power, which was probably a smart move on her part).

On the other hand, I'm glad that he'll be extricated from the state. There are rumblings that he was going to spend the next legislative session dicking around with the state employees retirement fund and health care, and you don't fuck with my mama's health insurance. You just don't.
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NefariousNewt
11/24/08

@howdybeep (runs with monkey wrenches): I wouldn't feel too bad for Bill Richardson. There's nothing to say that at some point Hillary won't want to be Secretary of State anymore, and Richardson could step right in. In the meantime, he gets to be on the inside, help to shape policy in an important area, and make a strong case for getting the job when/if Hillary decides to step out.
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NefariousNewt
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I still think Sheila Bair would have been a better pick... but I am not a counselor to the President-Elect.
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braak: You are, as usual, completely correct.
11/24/08

@NefariousNewt: I think Selma Blair would have been the best pick.
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NefariousNewt
11/24/08

@braak: How about Salma Hayek? Or is that just silly?
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NefariousNewt
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I don't think Obama pretended to want Hillary as his VP. I think the primaries forced him to take a long hard look at making her his VP, as well as public opinion, but Obama is his own man. In the end, as with everything surrounding Hillary, I think it came down to Bill. Did Obama want a VP whose husband happened to be a former President? Talk about a threesome! If she's Secretary of State, I think there's more natural insulation there, than if she were a stone's throw from the Oval Office.
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rah29
11/24/08

@NefariousNewt: It's also a way to turn Bill into a force for good on behalf of the Obama administration, rather than to leave him out as a potential rival. HRC said all throught the primaries that if she won Bill would be kind of a world emissary, capitalising on his prominence and the respect he still has around the world. Now he can do that in an official context, working explicitly on behalf of Obama.
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NefariousNewt
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Spent part of my weekend rewatching Season 1 of The West Wing... two moments came back to me vividly. One, when Father Cavanaugh visits President Bartlett in the Oval Office and Bartlett says there's a difference between the office of the President and the man, and I think that holds true. I think while Michelle and the kids are going to keep calling him Barack, I don't think anyone will call him that where there is any possibility of it being misinterpreted. Once he's inaugurated, he's "Mr. President."

Moment two was when they were getting ready for the State of the Union, and the President asked the Asst. Secretary of Agriculture if he had a best friend, and if that friend was smarter than him. "He's your Chief of Staff." Very poignant.
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southernbitch
11/24/08

@NefariousNewt: oh, the west wing. i got obsessed with that show around 2004ish. by far my favorite episode from the first season is the one about protecting the right to vote, with the man whose congresswoman wife had died and he had stepped in to finish her term. so poignant!

and once again, i reiterate that i am really not as impressed with sam power as everyone else seems to be in the world. and that has nothing to do with the hillary bashing, and everything to do with her work.
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rah29
11/24/08

@southernbitch: It's ok, I think you and I can form the 'Sam Power Isn't Actually the Shit' club... two is better than one!
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Rofold
11/24/08

@rah29: Count me in. I think she is ridiculous.
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LaFemme
11/24/08

@Rofold: @rah29: Add me to the list. Not impressed.
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rah29
11/24/08

@Rofold: @LaFemme: She gets my IR grad student knickers all in an angry twist, let me tell you!!! For one thing, the conditions that brought humanitarian intervention to the forefront in the 1990s no longer exist, and she can't seem to get her head around that. US hegemony is no longer so absolute that American actions have automatic or even near-automatic legitimacy; there can't be any kind of meaningful intervention in Sudan, for example, until there's at least a semblance of a new multilateral order that keeps oil-hungry China on board. Plus the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan have highlighted so many practical and moral dilemmas for intervention advocates like Power--everything from how to nation-build with an overstretched and ill-equipped military, to whether it's even right (or indeed neo-imperial) to impose American norms and values with little understanding of the society being invaded.

I'm not sure where I personally stand on some of the moral and ethical dilemmas of intervention--i'm a big fan, for example, of civilian crisis management if it's done well and sensitively, but I recognise a lot of the problems. But Power is pretty much just an advocate and an ideologue, and in that respect I don't frankly think she belongs in a policy-making position--especially since her priorities are so out of line with the current realities Obama faces (yes I'll say it--SO 1990s).
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
Speaking of Obama fantasies:

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kate!
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: what's this all about? anyone care to elaborate?
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@kate!: It was taken at the Alfred E. Smith Memorial Dinner, where McCain and Obama roasted each other for charity. I have no idea who the woman is, but I'm sure there's a pretty innocuous explanation behind the photo. She might've been showing Obama a dog tag of a brother serving in Iraq. Or she could've been flashing him and trying to seduce him in public. Either way. :-D
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PurplePurple
11/24/08

@kate!: @Kilotwat: This one probably is innocent. But I have heard things that weren't so kind about our new prez. Very disappointing, indeed.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: Oh, what things? Spill!
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PurplePurple
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: I'm so hesitant to say! Because when I heard, my opinion of him was tarnished. I've been sitting on it since Friday, and feeling sad.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: Make like a hijacked oil tanker and spill!
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rosasparks
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: I'm honestly surprised.

And also? You don't drop bombs in here like that & then disappear or don't back it up with something, such as.

That's pretty icky.
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Lizawithazee
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: I heard he kicked an old man when he was down.
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TRexstasy
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: OH MY GOD HE ISN'T GAY!

I feel so betrayed!

I voted for change.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@iamtrex: He could still be gay. To be honest, he doesn't seem particularly excited to be looking at that woman's chesticle region.
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PurplePurple
11/24/08

@rosasparks: I was freaking shocked by the stuff I heard. My friend who interned for a Senate ally of Obama's worked with him several times before and after he ran for prez. After he started running, his personality changed a lot and became more Clintonesque, shall we say. It's not hearsay, she was an intern, and she saw the stuff go down. She told me Friday after I asked her to tell me why she's excited about Obama politically, but not personally.
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SisterMaryMartha
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: Oh come on. Rumors like that always get told about political figures. You are still being overly vague. You got something to spill? Spill it.
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SisterMaryMartha
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: Also? I refuse to believe he would be so stupid as to let an intern witness his "transgressions".
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PurplePurple
11/24/08

@SisterMaryMartha: I am! My friend worked as an intern. He hit on the interns, and young staff, including her. It just makes me sad. My friend is hoping the with the extra security now, he'll behave better.
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SisterMaryMartha
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: "Hit on"? What does that mean, exactly? Like he was charming and paid compliments, or did he ask to fuck them? There is a world of difference between the two.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis: Thanks for the spillage! I'm agnostic on your rumor, but I appreciate you sharing it.
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PurplePurple
11/24/08

@SisterMaryMartha: With my friend, who was an intern, when they took a photo together, he let his hand touch her butt. You can tell in the photo, actually, which I used to joke about, until she told me he really was. It was that kind of stuff-- flirting mostly, with the interns. But the young staffer she worked with was propositioned directly. My friend still thinks he's great-- though she says it seems like the campaign changed him a lot, expecially with the people who surrounded him and the stress he was under. Then again, she says getting hit on by Senators was a daily occurance when she was an intern.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@SisterMaryMartha: Well, sometimes personal rumors can go a bit funny. One time, I had a guy who was A) not a Claymate, B) not into American Idol, C) not even remotely into pop music tell me that he is a personal acquaintance of Clay Aiken and his family, and that he knows the truth about Aiken: Aiken apparently had an affair with an older black lady who was his backup singer, that's why he keeps his relationships a secret. There were a lot more details to it. But suffice it to say, I was pretty convinced. This was years ago, and we all know how that turned out. The moral of the story is: even gossip from people you know may not be all that reliable.
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ucelluccia
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: I would make that "especially gossip from people you know"; it's the rumors spread by otherwise reasonable people that get the most out of control.
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yellow_dog
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis:
Did that happen between Nov 11 (when you posted this comment) and now?

PurplePurple Day Lewis commented on These Boots Were Made For Talkin'
"@badmutha: I think Obama is super sexy, and part of it is that he's good-looking, but the biggest part for me is that he does love Michelle, and seems completely committed to her."
[jezebel.com] 3:01 PM on Nov 11
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SisterMaryMartha
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: Oh I know. I just think her hints are silly. And people define "hitting on" many different ways. AND he is handsome and charming person- and I can well imagine that people misconstrue or look for reasons to misconstrue a situation. ALso, I find that some people will interpret behavior far differently than what is actually happening.
For instance, someone I know has a crush a guy- and she always insists that he is flirty with her and stares into her eyes and is touchy feely. I saw them together and he looked distinctly uncomfortable and was in no way touchy-feely.

So, you know- people see and experience what they want to, not necessarily what is reality.
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clevernamehere
11/24/08

@yellow_dog: If you look a couple of posts up, she says she was told on Friday.

Lately there has been a lot of idealizing of the Obama's marriage- HuffPo even had a blog about how Barak's body language shows what an awesome husband he was. But I doubt they have the most perfect relationship ever. No one is Wesley and Buttercup. Maybe he cheats, maybe their marriage is open, maybe his hand slipped on picture day, maybe someone made up the story.
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Kilotwat
11/24/08

@ucelluccia: You're so right. I was convinced to the point where I stopped making any Gayken jokes. So yeah, I was actually one of the few people who were shocked when Aiken came out. ::facepalm::
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ucelluccia
11/24/08

@Kilotwat: LOL. No, it's so freakin' difficult to disbelieve something you're told by a friend (which is what I think happened in this case, with the vagueness and such) or even just a fairly normal person you know. Also, Gayken? I never heard that one, but I LOVE it :-)
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dancerevolution
11/24/08

@PurplePurple Day Lewis:

This makes me really nervous. Our country cannot afford a sex scandal right now from our idealistic new president. Thanks for the begrudging heads up, but I have a bit of a sick feeling.
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dianersb was bit by a zombie
11/24/08

In reply to Hillary Clinton Is Everyone's Fantasy, Sick Or Otherwise
I'm still not entirely sure how I feel about H.Clinton as SecState. I would have loved her at Health and Human Services, or she should stay in congress to write a comprehensive health care bill.

However, I would not blame her if she's a little gun shy after the debacle that was the reaction to her health care reforms in the 90s.
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SarahMC
11/24/08

@dianersb: Hillary at HHS would have been great. Now that she's going to State, we are losing one of our only advocates for women's reproductive freedom.
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Lizawithazee
11/24/08

@SarahMC: Tom Daschle will be great as Secretary of HHS. And if any of you have any evidence to the contrary, I don't want to hear it. Thank you in advance.

(You know I do want to hear it but I'm hoping there isn't any.)
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Maritsa
11/24/08

@SarahMC:@dianersb: I've been saying Hillary at HHS forever! It seemed like such a great fit and that she could do so much there. I think she'll be a great Secretary of State too, but I feel like she really would have gotten shit done at HHS, and I'm not sure Daschle will.
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pantsless economist...access RESTORED
11/24/08

@SarahMC: I was hoping she would be appointed to the Supreme Court. Or who knows. Maybe she will be. That would be a great place for her.
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emilyanne
11/24/08

@Maritsa: but Daschle has a rep for being able to get the difficult stuff through. Personally I suspect Hillary isn't at health because Teddy's dedicated his life to it and didn't want his name usurped, this is merely evil speculation on my behalf though and I have to say I like Hilary as sec of state.

Also yay to the Han Solo/Luke Skywalker comparison, made my morning.
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tscheese
11/24/08

@Lizawithazee: I keep hoping that Daschle won't let us down. He isn't the Second Coming of Jeezus with Pancakes and Faires and Rainbows and Confetti Everywhere, but I still think he's a good pick. I think he'll make progress.
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Lizawithazee
11/24/08

@tscheese: He is a good hard workin' South Dakota boy. They're not flashy, as you know, but usually they do get things done.

I never could figure out why they voted him out as Senator, seeing as how that state is so dependent on pork, I mean farm subsidies. Just kidding, I know why they voted him out. The same reason I like him. He's a liberal on social issues.
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will_this_dissertation_ever_end?!
11/22/08

In reply to Speculative Cabinetry Redux: Clinton, Geithner and Richardson To Come On Board
Silly gays, thinking we're going to be getting rights and stuff under an Obama administration just because he said "gay" in a couple of speeches. *sigh* My post-election euphoria sure didn't last long.
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Dodgergirl
11/22/08

@will_this_dissertation_ever_en...?!: I think he's genuinely committed to reversing Don't Ask Don't Tell, and the question is when, not if. It seems like there's a feeling that if he tries to rush through it in the first few months, it will not end well for a policy change or for his working relationship with the military. Obama generally has a good handle on issues of political timing.
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