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There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
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Kali Mama
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Suzanne Somers is absolutely batshit insane and an ACTUAL danger to people's lives in promoting her bullshit superstitious woo-woo "medicine" based on NO scientifically falsifiable data (something evil money hungry strawmanny big pharma actually has to provide).

She is a goddamn ACTRESS. Can we please stop taking health advice from people with no medical training?

[scienceblogs.com]
[scienceblogs.com]
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mrsdalloway
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
When I was on SSRIs a year or two ago, I got so many comments from friends and family who'd read articles like these and thought that I was just buying into the evil pharmaceutical companies' plans to steal my money. Nevermind that the drugs actually helped, or that I was near-suicidal before I started taking them.

I ended up stopping treatment after a year because I couldn't stand it anymore. :/ But I do refuse to judge other people for taking what they need to take to feel better.
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Anna N. promoted this comment Edited by mrsdalloway at 12/14/09 2:38 PM mrsdalloway was starred mrsdalloway was unstarred

Anna N.
12/14/09

@mrsdalloway: I do refuse to judge other people for taking what they need to take to feel better.

Totally agree -- I get how this dovetails with psychoactive medications, and I agree that in both cases people who feel they need medication deserve no judgment. I'm a big supporter of SSRI and other mental-health medications when warranted -- and I believe PE and menopause treatment can be warranted to. But I do fear pharmaceutical companies overmarketing and convincing people they have to look, fuck, and feel a certain way.
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mrsdalloway
12/14/09

@Anna N.: But I do fear pharmaceutical companies overmarketing and convincing people they have to look, fuck, and feel a certain way.

Oh, I totally agree with you on this! And I get that that was the main point of your article. I just feel that often criticisms of these companies accompany criticisms of people who take their drugs. We don't all base our claims of illness on television commercials.
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msAnthrope
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
what pisses me off at least about menopausal meds is that, just like with almost any other medication, doctors never ask "why" these issues come up. not every woman experiences menopause the same, and i believe that women around the world also have different physical reactions as they enter menopause.

but here comes the pharmas, looking to shove every menopausal woman into their one-size-fits-all drug.
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morninggloria
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Sounds like drug companies have a raging case of PE-ness envy.
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CissyPants
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Silly me. I read the title and automatically assumed that PE stood for Public Enemy.
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GreyCat
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
"one in three men have PE"

Well, if you define PE as finishing before you make sure your partner does, then yes, that number seems about right.
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Edited by GreyCat at 12/14/09 2:09 PM GreyCat was starred GreyCat was unstarred

redqueenmeg
12/14/09

@GreyCat: Then I'd say those stats are low.
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GGobsessed
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
My mom's on HRT, and fucking LOVES it. For her, it's worth the risk because breast cancer doesn't run in the family. We get other shit.

Obviously, this sin't a fucking DISEASE. But the hot flashes are horrible for her. Pretty much. that's why she takes it.

As for PE, why do you need a damn spray? You read a basic psych textbook, and they have solutions right there. but you do need the help of a partner for that, and some men may be too embarrassed.
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Zombie Ms. Skittles
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: "Think of the mailman!"
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Anna N.
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: but you do need the help of a partner for that, and some men may be too embarrassed.

Communication: much cheaper than dick spray. Again, I believe both menopause and PE meds can help people (like, in the case of menopause, your mom) -- but they may also be pushed on people who don't really need them.
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FrannyR
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: Less than 5% of all breast cancer cases are herditary, I hope your mother isn't serious when she says that she'll risk it because no one in your family has had breast cancer
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run_sunshine
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: It's not always so simple, and it's not always psychological. I really feel that Anna and some other commenters are too quick to dismiss PE as a problem that affects men physically, emotionally, and psychologically--and affects their relationships with women, and those women's emotional states as well.
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GreyEminence
12/14/09

@Zombie Ms. Skittles: The mail, Finn! THINK OF THE MAIL!
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@FrannyR: My friend said the exact same thing last week. There might be a risk of getting breast cancer but if you are getting such bad flashes NOW that it affects your ability to get a decent night's sleep and therefore impignes on every aspect of your daily life, you might well feel the same. I know I do not consider the risk of getting breast cancer worth giving up HRT in my case. Give me the facts and I will decide for myself what risks I am prepared to take.
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blahblog
12/14/09

@Rare Affinity: just don't stay on it for too long. my mom stayed on HRT and menopause symptoms decreased. Cut to 7 years later and she needs a double mastectomy, chemo and radiation. We too had no history of breast cancer. Because even if you do have a history of breast cancer, you are only 3% more likely to get it then anyone else. I think HRT in the short term is fine, just don't stay on it for years (as they used to advise).
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GGobsessed
12/14/09

@FrannyR: Well ,she's on a low dose. And the rates of breast cancer are actually really low. They're higher than without HRT, but in actuality, the rates of breast cancer are still really low.

So for her, the benefits outweight the risk.

Also, she takes it untuil she feels better. And then she stops. So the risk decreases. And she does see a physician.
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GGobsessed
12/14/09

@run_sunshine: If sex therapy doesn't help, than try whatever does. BUT, desensitization exercises work 90% of the time. It might not work for everyone, and those should try it.

And it's not a psychological issue. It just may have pyschological consequences.

The whole idea is to tell your partner when you feel too excited, and then she/he squeezes the base of the penis, and it stops an orgams from happening (I may be wrong on the details, as I didn't focus on that much).

This is a tenchinqye sex therapists use to help cuoples who have that issue.

The whole idea is that this is only a problem if the people involved are bothered by it - NOT what anyone else says, not even the therapist.
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FrannyR
12/14/09

@Rare Affinity: As long as you don't feel a false sense of security because you don't have breast cancer in your family. Hereditary breast cancer is very different from sponaneously occuring breast cancer, and as I said above the latter accounts for more than 95% of all breast cancer cases. No cancer in your family doesn't guranatee anything
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run_sunshine
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: Yes it has psychological consequences, but it could very well be a psychological issue--previous trauma, abuse, ridicule.
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@FrannyR: That's why I wanted as much information as possible before I made my decision. I appreciate HRT may increase the risk of breast cancer in some women but I make an informed decision on what I think is best for me.
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@GGobsessed: You have made an important point: the rates of breast cancer even on HRT are actually relatively low. That would automatically rule it out for some people. Not for me. I am prepared to take that risk until such a time as the risk suddenly increases dramatically.
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GGobsessed
12/14/09

@run_sunshine: But isn't that a bit irrelevent, if the treatment is all the same? If the treatment works, does it matter why?
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@blahblog: I am sorry to hear about your mother. My own mother started taking HRT in her 30s and died of non smoking related lung cancer in her 50s. I suffer from heart disease. Earlier this century the scare story was that HRT INCREASED the risk of heart disease. As a result millions of women came off the drug and my own doctor wanted me to come off. I stood my ground. NOW scientists believe HRT might actually protect against heart disease. That is why I intend to remain on HRT for the long term based on my current assessment of the risk. Everyone should make the decision for themselves based on their personal circumstances and medical history.
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labeled
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
That's all fine and well to say when it's not you dealing with it.
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BearDownCBears
12/14/09

@labeled: Cheers. Can't really conceptualize menopause, but I can imagine PE, and both people involved would be pretty bummed on a regular basis. These aren't wrinkle treatments; these drugs reportedly alleviate uncomfortable conditions. Hell, why not get rid of Advil? Pain is natural!
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Edited by BearDownCBears at 12/14/09 2:08 PM BearDownCBears was starred BearDownCBears was unstarred

Anna N.
12/14/09

@labeled: To be clear, I totally support people getting treatment for menopause symptoms or sexual dissatisfaction if they feel they need it. In a way I'm a lot more distressed by the PE drug than I am by menopause drugs, because it seems like there's this subtext about guys not being "man enough" -- not a good reason to take a drug.
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labeled
12/14/09

@BearDownCBears: Well, and what's with the birth control? Just get more imaginative with your hands, fingers, lube & anal, and the rhythm method. And of course, just accept that sex is what makes babies - and if you don't want babies, don't have sex. You'd buy a lot less shit - including the hormones that girls are taking now (wait, how's that different again?)...
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labeled
12/14/09

@Anna N.: I do get that, I honestly do. But this just might be a "mile in their shoes" sort of thing that supersedes the man-enough marketing.

ETA: I'm still miffed over the last paragraph, also.
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Edited by labeled at 12/14/09 2:17 PM labeled was starred labeled was unstarred

purpleshoes reminds everyone to take typing breaks and stretch, ow
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
See, here is my problem: maybe by the time I'm forty-seven I won't care, but in the meantime, I keep thinking about how menopause is beautiful and natural and then I hit the term "vaginal atrophy".

But I don't want my genitalia to atrophy! Please god, someone make some medication that will keep my ladyjunk from atrophying.
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@purpleshoes reminds everyone to take typing breaks and stretch, : It does not happen to all women and countries like Finland take such issues far more seriously than most and ensure women have access to treatment to help alleviate the condition.
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Zombie Ms. Skittles
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Okay, so story time, children.

I read the first half of "She Comes First" before my boyfriend/fiance became so embarrassed that I'd a) bought it and b) was reading it when he couldn't that he stole it and read it on his own. In the intro, the author explains that he honed his cunnilingus skills as a reaction to his PE. He was embarrassed about his inability to "last" in college, so he started doing oral sex as a kind of next-best-thing so women wouldn't think he sucked. What he found out was that women ended up thinking he was really good in bed because they preferred the oral sex to long sessions of penis in vagina sex.
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run_sunshine
12/14/09

@Zombie Ms. Skittles: Same experience here. By far totally made up for the PE. I always suspected he honed it for that exact reason, but I could not care less, as it was absolutely wonderful.
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la.donna.pietra
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Hormone replacement therapy, by whatever name, scares the everlovin' crap out of me. My mom went on it about 10 years ago to deal with major mood swings as the result of menopause; she was on it for at least a couple of years before the data about breast cancer came out. My dad's mother was also on some variation of it; she died of breast cancer when I was about 8. My dad always assumed that it was her "fault" for going on HRT, which pisses me off to no end.
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spiraloflife
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
I suffer from the disease called "being a human." 100% fatality rate. A terrible, terrible plight. Where's my drug?
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Rare Affinity
12/14/09

@spiraloflife: I am afraid the prognosis is not very good. There is a very good chance you will die within the next 100 years. Sorry.
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pantsless economist...access RESTORED
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
Tiefer's words highlight a contradiction in Sciele Pharma's marketing: if one in three men really has PE, couldn't it be considered a normal variation, rather than a disease?

I'm always a little reluctant to say someone doesn't have a real disorder or a real problem. I'd never say depression isn't a real disease (and people do, all the time), for example, so I try to avoid going down that slope since I'm not a doctor.

So I suppose, do what works for you. If medicine works, use it. If there's a better way, then by all means, pursue that. And if you choose to do nothing, and that works for you, then, more power to you.
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Edited by pantsless economist...access RESTORED at 12/14/09 1:56 PM

LazyHippo
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
As a hetero man, I'm curious to hear what gay male and straight female Jezzies have to say about the suggestion that 1/3 of men suffer from 'PE', especially if that is defined as being unable to last more than 60 seconds. Please share!
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Zombie Ms. Skittles
12/14/09

@LazyHippo: I've never had sex with someone who ACTUALLY had "PE" but every guy I've ever come close to having sex with or had sex with was convinced he had it. I blame the porn industry for making dudes think that women want to be piledrived for 20 minutes per session.
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Grim Reaper of the Forest
12/14/09

@Zombie Ms. Skittles: It seems like all guys think longer = better. On the up side, they are actually concerned about their partner's pleasure. On the down side, they don't seem to realize that pleasure is not necessarily about how long you can last.

And no, I've never been with someone with actual PE.
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leedevious
12/14/09

@Zombie Ms. Skittles:

Word. If anything, I think all the dudes I've ever been with lasted WAY TOO LONG. I'd be like, "OMG are you done yet? I'm getting sore."
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Zombie Ms. Skittles
12/14/09

@leedevious: I've told guys that before. I like to think having someone go, "You know, I can't feel my vagina anymore soooo you can finish whenever you want" is hopefully a game plan changer.
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la.donna.pietra
12/14/09

@LazyHippo: In my experience, the more common problem is an inability to ejaculate after commencing sex. I suspect this has more to do with the quantity of alcohol consumed beforehand than anything else.

I have dated one guy who took about 2 seconds (not exaggerating), but he was 18 at the time. He also did not seem to be suffering tremendously.
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Pizza!Pizza!Pizza!
12/14/09

In reply to There's A Drug For That: P.E., Menopause, And The Medicalization Of Sex
'Dr. Wayne Hellstrom tells Singer that somewhere between 20% and 30% of men have PE at some point — but he doesn't say how many of these cases clear up on their own when, say, the guys hit nineteen or so.'

Add in horny teens and I'll bet the number's closer to 99%. It doesn't help that most of them are probably wanking furtively and quick to finish. Here's hoping most of them get a clue and practice 'edging' before they get a long-term partner.
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