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PaintedTrollop
04:54 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
This kid needs to do some work on his diction.
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The HZA.
03:42 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
I have this weird love for Levi. I want to buy him a rack of PBR and some Doritos and be like "sugarbear, you gotta dish!"
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KittyKittyCat
03:52 PM

@The HZA.: Me too! He seems very believable in comparison to Sarah Palin and just comes off as a guy who doesn't take himself too seriously.

Also, I thought it was VERY classy he wouldn't discuss where he had sex with Bristol. The things he says seem factual because they are almost too banal to be made up.
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limber
03:21 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
The flight thing drives me nuts.

Am I wrong in thinking that it's hugely irresponsible for a 44 year old woman carrying a special needs child in what is by definition a high-risk pregnancy to board a cross-country, high-altitude flight? And then to assume that she is absolutely insane if she repeats that journey, only this time leaking amniotic fluid and feeling contractions?

I'll admit, I've never had a kid, but the friends and relatives who have all stopped flying around 6 months in. The ones who were older mothers went straight to the hospital as soon as labour started in any way.

I don't care about the Mysterious Trig Origin story, but am I missing something about what I'd had as received wisdom long before I ever heard of Palin: that women should not fly late in pregnancy because it can put mother and child in danger if labour progresses, what with flight attendants not being medical professionals if things go badly wrong. I mean, Trig could have had a hole in his heart. This is not something the dermatologist onboard can handle with crossover medical skills.

Seriously, don't care about the conspiracy theory. But the decision-making in that suggested chain of events chills me, and makes me wonder why ANYONE would trust a person with those decision-making instincts to be President.
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SlayBelle
03:39 PM

@limber: My mother had to get doctor's permission to fly into her 8th month for a family vacation and most will tell you to hold off on any long trips by that point. I, myself, by 8 months would have been nervous, not to mention highly uncomfortable.

At the same time, I am not a politician, and I would assume that there might be reasons that one would need to travel late into pregnancy. However, once water breaks? That means labor is going to start toot sweet (if it hasn't already -- some women's water breaks before labor begins) and in that case, yes, I would suggest its irresponsible to board a plane for a cross country trip. So even if there's nothing else to the story, you're correct -- this highlights very questionable decision making behavior.
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AndPreciousLittleofThat
02:01 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
Mr. Johnston provides a unique and very valuable service to Americans everywhere, for which we should thank him.

He is, from what I can tell, the only thorn to have permanently embedded itself in Sarah Palin's side.

Shine on, you crazy diamond!
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nolongerinacubiclestillawhore
02:03 PM

@AndPreciousLittleofThat: That's the only reason I love this kid. Any time someone mentions his name to Sarah Palin you can totally see the flames in her eyes. Best thing ever.
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Tchotchke
01:56 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
They're really going crazy at the Ramrod right now!

Oh Joy, don't ever change! Somewhere, Elisabeth is having a stroke.
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sassyredhead
01:51 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
He's got a nice enough body but I have a big thing for guy's hands. Seeing those hockey gloves just made me wince.
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kookla
02:09 PM

@sassyredhead: After all the hype, I was thinking Levi needed bigger gloves than that. Such a pity.
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sportz.star
01:49 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
Levi doesn't need facts. He needs "facts" and therefore, needs no diary.
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bluebears
01:49 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
Ok. Andrew Sullivan needs to cool it about her pregnancy. It's not his business. I dislike Palin as much as the next person but it leaves a very bad taste in my mouth that this MAN is insisting that a woman can't give a speech while having contractions? In the early stages of her labor my friend was DELIVERING another baby (she's an ob-gyn) so...Give it a rest. It doesn't change the fact that Palin is hateful and bigoted. Talk about that. Leave her uterus alone.
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otherginger
01:52 PM

@bluebears: I think it was the broken water more than the contractions that had him so flabbergasted. My understanding is that it can be very hazardous to the baby if you don't get to the hospital a.s.a.p. after the waters break, so he had a point (albeit a much belabored - Ha! Aha! Ha! Ha! - one). I find Levi attractive, which in turn makes me feel dirty.
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bluebears promoted this comment Edited by otherginger at 12/08/09 1:52 PM otherginger was starred otherginger was unstarred

bluebears
01:55 PM

@otherginger: well he didn't specify when her water broke, it was separate from the contractions comment. be that as it may, not.his.uterus. and yeah there are all sort of pregnancy suggestions to insure optimal safety for the mother and child and it doesn't sound like she cared about following them (shocker) but again, why is this anyone's business?
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Edited by bluebears at 12/08/09 2:00 PM bluebears was starred bluebears was unstarred

hovy
02:02 PM

@bluebears: Any time Sullivan writes about Palin, you can see the misogyny bubbling beneath the surface. His obsession and hatred of her is scary.
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bluebears
02:04 PM

@hovy: It irritates me no end to listen to him go on and on about this topic. He is such a misogynist.
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WagaMama
02:05 PM

@otherginger: While most doctors would say they like to deliver within 24 hours after the water breaks because of the risk of infection, I've talked with midwifes who say you can wait longer. The risk of infection only really starts once you've started doing pelvic exams. (I say this as a woman who hightailed it to the hospital when her water broke, though.)

But the real point is ... so what? Unless Andrew Sullivan was that baby's father (and the idea of that just amuses me) it's really none of his damn business. Enough with the conspiracy theories. It's almost as annoying as those birther people.
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Raised-byHeathens
02:08 PM

@bluebears: Yeah, totes not his uterus, but I did think it was dangerous( like seriously stroke out dangerous) to be flying when you were seven or eight months pregnant. When looked at in that context, it does seem fishy to be in an airplane when you are delivering. But I don't have kids, and I don't know and it is her uterus, so who knows?
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likepenguins
02:11 PM

@bluebears: i drove my own damn self to the hospital, which included parking, and walking down the stairwells, across the street, and into the ER when I was 7 cm dialated.

Andrew Sullivan, don't presume to think that you understand what women can and cannot do while in labor.
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pmarble
02:18 PM

@bluebears: If she's going to support the birthers.... Also, the time line is in fact weird. I really don't care one way or the other whether this is her child, but I don't see his position as sexist.
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bluebears
02:23 PM

@pmarble: I just don't agree that because she's a racist who supports conspiracy theories it is then ok to go after her for this pregnancy bullshit. Like I said, there is PLENTY of on-topic issues to take her to task on. PLENTY. So the fact that this man is fixated on the state of her uterus and goes around insinuating her child is not in fact hers (which, whatever that means since she's raising it like its hers) IS sexist and misogynist. When he could go after her for anything and chooses to after her for issues that pertain to her reproductive health? I don't know what other conclusion anyone could reach.
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EndangeredRed
02:40 PM

@bluebears: I'm torn on this. On the one hand, Sullivan has apparently abandoned all useful political commentary to live inside his Sarah Palin obsession. And his methods are questionable. However, if there is reasonable doubt that it is her baby, I do think it is fair game to investigate that for the same reason I think it is fair to expose Carrie Prejean's hypocrisies. If Palin is going to promote herself, make money and potentially run for office on family values and abstinence and no abortions even for little girls who are raped, then I have no problem with someone exposing that she covered up or faked a pregnancy.
At this point, though, Sullivan's claims don't seem to hold much water. It's pure speculation.
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bluebears
02:45 PM

@EndangeredRed: Yeah, but the thing is I don't think that raising someone's baby as your own means that you're anti-family values (or whatever) and it STILL seems to veer off onto the not our business track. I mean if it isn't (and I personally think it IS) her kid for all we know she is being honest inside the family or whatever about it and if she's not its wrong and maybe not the best idea but still...not relevant. I have no problem calling her out on actual hypocrisies (ie Prejeans sex tape contrasted with her "christian values") but...this doesn't seem to be one.
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yeahisaidit
02:50 PM

@bluebears: Well, actually, Sullivan goes after her for a lot of things. I followed his blog (among many others) during the time this issue broke and, as pmarble said, the timeline is very, very weird. It's not about one particular thing or another (like giving a speech or flying on an airplane), it's about the sum total that doesn't add up. And Sullivan has said asking these questions is not really about is-it-hers-or-not as it is about documenting her overall pattern of lying and hypocrisy, especially when it comes to matters of sexuality -- which, of course, is very relevant to him, a strong advocate for marriage equality.

I used to loathe Sullivan -- I have never forgiven him for his pro-war stance in 2004 and he still clings to some crap economics. But I give him credit, he's come a long way in the last couple of years. I don't mind at all his role as a thorn in her side. This woman's bullshit needs to be called, vigilantly.
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bluebears
02:52 PM

@yeahisaidit: he needs to stop discussing her uterus. period. I don't care if he also talks about other things, he has no business talking about this. Unless she's claiming that people should elect her president because Trig is her natural born son then it simply is not a matter for public discourse.
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EndangeredRed
02:53 PM

@bluebears: True. I agree that it's probably her baby. I think she may have been considering an abortion and that's why she kept it all under wraps, but again, none of our business.
The hypocrisy would be in presenting her daughter as an example of abstinence by hiding the product of her sexual activity. Sort of a moot point by now, but especially troublesome if Bristol didn't have a choice at all. Which I wonder about. But again, that's Bristol, not Sarah, and I have no desire to drag her through the mud. As interesting a conspiracy as it may be, I've pretty much abandoned Andrew Sullivan's blog because of it.
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bluebears
02:56 PM

@EndangeredRed: well yeah, I could see more of an argument towards mentioning it if it was possibly Bristols (like people claim) and she was hiding it to promote some sort of abstinence agenda except like you said, this was a moot point by the time they got to the RNC Convention so even that goes out the window.
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sarah.rohn
02:59 PM

@bluebears: So it isn't the tiniest bit relevant if she's a LIAR? I get that the whole pregnancy-conspiracy is a bit far-fetched, but so is her tale and I think if she is lying about something, it is relevant to her ability to govern, ie: be transparent and forthright with her constituents.
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bluebears
03:08 PM

@sarah.rohn: I would feel the same if a male politician purposely was not honest about some personal medical issue (that would not have an effect on his ability to govern). Just because they're in the public sphere doesn't mean they can't keep some areas of their lives private.
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yeahisaidit
03:29 PM

@bluebears: I think that if someone makes their own uterus, and the uteruses of others, a campaign issue -- as she absolutely did -- then it's fair game. She claimed throughout the campaign, explicitly and implicitly, that what made her so electable despite her lack of requisite experience or knowledge was her moral superiority, her Christianness, her family (which she constantly trotted onstage), her hard line against reproductive choice and LGBT rights. She made the Trig story -- the moral of which was that she was so amazingly moral to have chosen to continue her pregnancy, and by the way no one else should have that choice -- a crucial narrative of her campaign. So, yes, she was claiming that people should elect her ticket because she gave birth to Trig. And Sullivan has a dog in this fight because she is out there trying to make his sexuality a political issue. If she's going to politicize his penis, well, turnabout's fair play.
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limber
03:32 PM

@bluebears: It's the decision-making that gets me. Sarah Palin apparently boarded a flight 8 months pregnant, and then her water broke (which is essentially what "amniotic leak" means, it's just not gone full-out yet). And she left Texas, with its many excellent hospitals and fast ground transport and doctors, to get in a tin tube and go way high up in the air, just blithely sure that the special-needs baby she knew she was carrying would ride it out.

Everything worked out, which is great! But if it hadn't, Sarah Palin would have been the factor that introduced totally needless danger into the equation. Put flatly, her son could've been born with a hole in his heart, and she chose to go on a long-haul flight where the nearest medical help would be a First Aider and whoever on the plane had taken pre-med.

Of course, there's the flip side to this, which I find a lot more probable: she irresponsibly boarded a flight back to Alaska, but there was no sign of labour until she was almost on the ground. At which point they drove to the hospital and had the baby. And then she elaborated, as she tends to do, and created a Wilderness Woman story for herself -- only realizing too late that the other half of that take is Shockingly Irresponsible Mother.

In short: I'd prefer to think her a compulsive liar than so offhand about her child's survival. Neither quality makes me want her in office.
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bluebears
03:57 PM

@yeahisaidit: I just don't have the view that two rights make a wrong.

As to the other point (and egg creams point) I could sort of see it from that perspective but its still a pretty big stretch. I mean if she had had a previous abortion and lied about it that would be different but just to say I'm against abortion and I didn't abort my kid...I mean, I can see the ridiculousness and dishonesty if it wasn't her kid to begin with but she did have what 4? other kids that she didn't abort. I guess if it was glaringly untrue that would be one thing but its not and all this speculation about womens bodies by (primarily) men is tiresome.
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Penny
01:45 PM

In reply to Levi Johnston On Being A Gay Icon: "It's Great"
Well, that third frame came very close to turning me gay.
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badmutha
01:53 PM

@Penny: It's ok dear, just remember they don't all look that way.
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gold_gato
01:26 PM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
I love playing with makeup. It's doesn't dictate who I am, who whether or not I can leave the house looking this way or that. Same goes with clothes and hair - sometimes I feel like keeping it light, and other times I feel like having a little fun. But like chapstick, pants are essential FYI.
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LadyFabulous
11:53 AM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
As a former makeup artist, the makeup girl part definitely rings true. None of my friends really wear it (aside from mascara and "lippie") and if there is a special occassion they are crammed in my bathroom waiting for me to work my magic.
I love makeup and my bathroom looks like a MAC store, but there was never a time that wearing it or not wearing it went into consideration when making friends.
The best part of being the only "makeup girl" in my group? Being the makeup artist for their weddings. :)
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gherkinfiend
02:49 PM

@LadyFabulous: As a former make up artist too, your comment rings many bells!

I would certainly never judge someone for not wearing make up though like Shane Watson seems to think happens and I just hope no-one judges me for always wearing make up in return!
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samethingwedoeverynightpinky
11:15 AM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
This doesn't ring true for me. I love makeup, and enjoy full on wearing it for special or specialish occasions, or on days when I've woken up early and have enough time to really get ready in the morning. But on days when I'm in a rush, which is most days, I just don't have the time to worry about it, so I run out with a dash of lip gloss. Partly I got into makeup as a function of having really bad skin in high school-- if you have to start the day with foundation and concealer anyway, it's not hard to throw on some lipstick, eye shadow and bronzer. Now that my skin is better and I'm less self-conscious about it, it's just a fun thing to do.
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mishmisha
11:32 AM

@samethingwedoeverynightpinky: Same here. I had bad skin in high school that I felt I had to cover up, so I became very good at applying foundation and concealer, and more importantly, learning how to choose products that looked natural. Now, in my 30's my skin has calmed down (thanks accutane and pro-active, although not at the same time of course). Most days now, since I don't have the time to do the whole routine, I don't wear it unless I am going out. But, I never really feel put together or pretty unless I've done my full makeup ritual (foundation, under eye concealer, powder, blush, mascara and eye shadow).

Oh, and my mother never ever wore makeup and kind of looks like a weirdo when she does.
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gherkinfiend
02:54 PM

@mishmisha: I have just finished a course of Accutane and my skin looks fabulous for the first time ever, but I still can't shake my foundation habit. I just don't feel quite dressed without it...and from there it's a small step to eyeshadow, liner, mascara, powder and blush. And then I feel like me again!

I just love make up and the ritual of applying it, even though none of the women in my family wear more than lipstick. I've been wearing make up everyday since I was about 12 and I can't imagine changing now.
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mishmisha
03:10 PM

@gherkinfiend: I think if you're going to do foundation, you've got to do the whole face, otherwise it is kind of like an unfinished painting.

I still love putting make-up on, and did it every day until I had my son. Unfortunately, now my priority is making sure he gets to daycare and that I get to work on time, no matter what state I am in. Once he is older and if he is ever potty trained, I will probably have a spare 3 minutes and will go back to my routine.
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emfish55
10:11 AM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
I hate the idea of ascribing qualities to a woman based on whether or not she wears makeup. For me, it's personal: I wear makeup everyday, because from my late teens to late twenties I struggled with acne. Even though my skin is clear now, I don't feel comfortable leaving the house without makeup.

And for years, I got the message (from other women, from men, from my mother) that girls who didn't wear makeup were more "natural" and less vain. That women who wore makeup were insecure or permiscuous. I was told by family members and strangers that my makeup caused my acne (note from my dermatologists - it did not). In other words, my decade of misery was my own damn fault for being so self-involved as to apply makeup in the morning.

My brother once told me he envied my ability to wear makeup, because he had no way of hiding his own skin problems.

Women (and men) are under so much pressure to be beautiful and desirable. Airbrushed images have elevated the standard of good skin or a pretty face. Some women feel comfortable leaving the house with a scrubbed face, and more power to them. But wearing makeup (or not) doesn't say anything about your character or what "kind" of woman you are, anymore than wearing a miniskirt does.
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msQwerty
10:58 AM

@emfish55: You took the words right out of my mouth. Except for me, my battle with acne began after college (you know, the fun "adult" kind that never goes away) and only got worse. And although I have it under control now (well, except for those months my hormones decide to really want to punish me), I can not imagine leaving my house without makeup. It's frustrating because I would love to be one of those women that look naturally amazing and just put on a touch of gloss. But I can't. And I too have to hear from "well-meaning" friends and sometimes random people that maybe my skin wouldn't break out if i didn't put so much make-up on. Or maybe if i ate a vegetarian diet, or cut dairy, or did this and this and this and this, I wouldn't have acne. It sucks being judged. It sucks being told that I'm vain. And it sucks when people assume that I haven't tried all the shit they're telling me to do, and then some.

But I guess to the outside world and to Watson, I'm just a vain girly-girl who spends my time primping and posing in mirrors to ensure I look the right amount of pretty. Afterall, it's my philosophy on life.
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emfish55 promoted this comment Edited by msQwerty at 12/08/09 10:59 AM msQwerty was starred msQwerty was unstarred

emfish55
01:02 PM

@msQwerty: Exactly. I would love to be a freshfaced Noxema girl. It is not a question of choice. This article is like saying, "Women all fall into two camps - attractive and unattractive. You fall in with one or the other in grade school and then you stick with them the rest of your life."

Sigh. And ugh, I too get all the recommended lifestyle changes. Which again, just serve to make the recommendor feel good about her own choices. I have clear skin because I eat better than you! I have clear skin because I exercise more! I have clear skin because I'm smarter or more careful or more conscientious!

They have clear skin because their genes said so. It's like bragging because you're tall.
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msQwerty
04:55 PM

@emfish55: Yes! Thank you! That was really well put: "I have clear skin because I eat better than you"--It's utterly maddening. (It also wreaks of having class connotations too, no? "I can afford to take better care of my body/face, so therefore I am better" --maybe that's for another discusssion though!)
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i'm a bottle
08:51 AM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
Someone needs to do a study on this, attempting to find a correlation between make-up use and political sympathies. By "someone needs to" I mean "someone please."
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Grim Reaper of the Forest
08:50 AM

In reply to Are You "A Make-Up Kind Of Girl?"
I've never been a makeup girl except briefly in junior high, when I experimented with frosted pink lipstick and blue eyeshadow. My mom never wore makeup except to parties, and I guess her approach wore off on me. Also, working in the nonprofit, environmental field, wearing makeup to work is optional and I mostly work from home. However, since my skin got really bad in my 20s, I started wearing mineral foundation every day to take out the redness.
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