rules - Jezebel

posts about #rules more →
Dos And Don'ts
Fish Forks, Conformity And Inner Peace: The Emily Post Legacy
The One Thing (Besides Take A Dump) You Never Do In Front Of Dudes

Your version of Internet Explorer is not supported. Please upgrade to the most recent version in order to view comments.

Dsmvwl Admin Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×

ImperfectLit.Woman
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
When I see and read articles like this about women's oppression in certain countries,I can't help but think of this quote I have heard from NCIS from Ducky the medical examiner-"women are only equal in death and nothing more." Sad but true.

I just wish people realized that Saudi Arabia's rules and restrictions on women are due to cultural reasons and NOT religious. Nowhere in the Quran does it allow blatant discriminations like this.

It's just men misreading and misconstruing certain verses and hadiths to further their own misogynistic, puritanical and hateful views. Nothing else.
Reply

ImperfectLit.Woman was starred

Haystacks
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
I assume they are allowed to die and be buried.
Reply

Haystacks was starred Haystacks was unstarred

ellaesther
12/16/08

@Haystacks: Sadly occasionally at the hands of their own family members.
Reply

ellaesther was starred ellaesther was unstarred

umamimama
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
A Pakistani blogger reports that the reported reason for the graveyard prohibition is "the dead can see you naked."

Maybe the reason women can't drive is that the dead are desperately trying to carjack a ride out of their Chippendale's-like cemeteries: all-male, all-nude, for all of eternity.
Reply

umamimama was starred umamimama was unstarred

RainbowBrite
12/16/08

@umamimama: HAHA The dead can see you naked. That is actually really hilarious!
Reply

RainbowBrite was starred RainbowBrite was unstarred

Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.
12/16/08

@umamimama: Bestie. TOTALLY!
Reply

ellaesther
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
I just want to throw out there that the Islam practiced in Saudi is a particularly restrictive version (Wahabism), based in the harshest school of legal jurisprudence (Hanbali). The level of darkness that is perpetuated in the name of some twisted version of piety over there makes me ill (from the misogyny to the anti-Semitism, just to name two problems), but the Saudi version of Islam is really not representative of Islam as practiced by the majority of Muslims.

Just sayin'.
Reply

ellaesther was starred ellaesther was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@ellaesther: So very very very true. And the scary part (to me anyway) is that we count them as one of our only 'friends' in the region.
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

ellaesther
12/16/08

@stacyinbean: I know. The use of the word "moderate" makes my head implode. Apparently, in State Department speak, all "moderate" means is "will work with us without too much fuss."

Because according to my dictionary, the Saudis ain't moderate.
Reply

ellaesther was starred ellaesther was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@ellaesther: Also - "has oil and is willing to share it." It's so frustrating.
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

pmarble
12/16/08

@ellaesther: Your "just sayin" was very eloquent.
Reply

pmarble was starred pmarble was unstarred

Jack_Burton
12/16/08

@ellaesther: It's a very unusual relationship that they have w/ the West as well; The Saudi Royal Family invests quite a bit of money in the US, yet some members are so violently opposed to US and Israel that they print fundamentalist Quran and set up mosques all over the world preaching the destruction of the West.

There is overwhelming evidence that Osama Bin Laden is merely one of many Saudi Royals that ideologically and financially support the spread of restrictive Sharia law, and the Taliban.
Reply

Jack_Burton was starred Jack_Burton was unstarred

ellaesther
12/16/08

@pmarble: Thank you for sayin' so! (Now, I suppose you don't have a job for me?)
Reply

ellaesther was starred ellaesther was unstarred

pmarble
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
Reason number 4,762 to never go to Saudi Arabia. Ever.

And yes, yes, I know, I'm sure there's all sorts of lovely things about Saudi Arabia. I saw that No Reservations where Anthony Bourdain was shown around by a lovely lady who seemed really cool and didn't seem to mind being forced to wear a burka and sit in the "family" section of the Saudi version of KFC. I just have no interest in going to a place where woman are so completely subjugated to men. Ooh, I'm so mad now I have to go to the gym and work it off. I'd drive, but it's about 1 minute away from my loft. Which I own. Take THAT SA.
Reply

pmarble was starred pmarble was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@pmarble: Fortunately for most of us, we likely wouldn't even be allowed in the country unless we were the guest of someone! Just one more thing to love about Saudi Arabia!
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

taranwanderer
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
As someone who enjoys hanging out in cemeteries, the graveyard one is particularly distressing to me.

(Obviously it's not the worst, but still.)
Reply

taranwanderer was starred taranwanderer was unstarred

〇わ〜い〇
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
Women in Saudi Arabia also cannot attend mosque. Have you ever read Princess by Jean Sassoon? Very troubling--nothing but disappointment for women. Every day.

How are we supposed to respect their "rules"?
Reply

〇わ〜い〇 was starred 〇わ〜い〇 was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@vagtart: Great book, and the two that followed were good too. It's so hard to imagine being a woman over there and trying to change things to no avail.
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

Jack_Burton
12/16/08

@vagtart: If women went to mosque, they might - gasp - learn how to become community organizers!
Reply

Jack_Burton was starred Jack_Burton was unstarred

Mafalda para Presidente
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
That's funny, because I am allowed to drive a car but I am not able to actually BUY one.

SNIFF.
Reply

dirtybee
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
I was listening to NPR last night. Women protested back in 1990 against the driving law, and they paid the price for voicing their right. Fast forward to 18 years later, these women are still treated unfairly by those who remember them as protesters. Yet, one young woman was praised as a hero because she drove her extremely ill father to the hospital.

Hopefully, these barriers will come tumbling down soon, for their sake.
Reply

dirtybee was starred dirtybee was unstarred

morninggloria
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
What about if you cut out the floor of the car and run with it, Fred Flinstone style? Is that driving? How about if you have your kid hold the wheel while you Flinstone your way to the Jewel Osco? What if you visit a graveyard but your feet never touch the ground because you are on a pogo stick? Is graveyard pogo sticking allowed? How about riding around on a segway?
Reply

morninggloria was starred morninggloria was unstarred

BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit)
12/16/08

@morninggloria: I did read the pogo-stick clause in the Koran. Of course, I learned the Koran in clown college and wonder if Professor Bobo's interpretation might have been a little biased.
Reply

rocknrollunicorn
12/16/08

@morninggloria: I love that you mentioned Jewel Osco. But I'm not sure if you're allowed to come up with such schemes, as a woman.
Reply

rocknrollunicorn was starred rocknrollunicorn was unstarred

badmutha
12/16/08

@morninggloria: I take visit to mean "break the plane of intersection with the real world and earth" so even if you did the pogo stick, you'd probably still get in trouble. The Fred Flintstone thing would totally be ok though. And it would get rid of any callouses you had, in the beginning.
Reply

badmutha was starred badmutha was unstarred

BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit)
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
Oh, rules for the wimmens. I love that we can dirt nap in the cemetery but not visit there.
Reply

Kali Mama
12/16/08

@BrutallyHonestBabes: But you can get your dirty menses cooties all over the .... graves containing rotting corpses.
Reply

Kali Mama was starred Kali Mama was unstarred

rocknrollunicorn
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
The car thing is obviously awesome. I mean you buy a car and then someone has to drive you around! That someone being a hired woman or a male relative!

So even if you have a Geo, you get to feel rich and fancy.
Reply

rocknrollunicorn was starred rocknrollunicorn was unstarred

Mafalda para Presidente
12/16/08

@rocknrollunicorn: Well, all other wimmin's restrictions aside, I'd love to have someone to drive me around all the time. I just hate driving.
Reply

SarahMC
12/16/08

@rocknrollunicorn: It sucks to be dependent on another person to drive you around. Trust.
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

DangerMouse
12/16/08

@SarahMC: Well, if that's their only job, then they have to do it, no? I imagine having a chauffeur is different than asking my mom for a ride back in the day.
Reply

DangerMouse was starred DangerMouse was unstarred

SarahMC
12/16/08

@DangerMouse (was ejc....): I imagine it is, too. But why do you assume every woman can afford to pay a personal driver? Furthermore, why does it matter? Women should be permitted to drive whether some individual woman feels like taking advantage of that privilege or not.
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

DangerMouse
12/16/08

@SarahMC: Oh, I was just thinking from Mafalda's perspective, not for all women everywhere.
Reply

DangerMouse was starred DangerMouse was unstarred

SarahMC
12/16/08

@DangerMouse (was ejc....): My bad.
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

prestocaro fears the culling
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
This post reminds me of Kathy Griffin saying she wanted to have her period all over Saddam's palace. I know they are two different countries, but the sentiment is priceless.
Reply

LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
The graveyard bit is bothersome as well. Wouldn't it be considered a good thing to pay respects to the dead? Can anyone offer some insight into this?
Reply

LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
12/16/08

@LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: Duh- sorry. I just read more carefully- they can make investments. Commence blushing.
Reply

SarahMC
12/16/08

@LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: I wonder if it's because the man-beasts hang out in graveyards waiting to attack the wimminz, so for their own protection women are forbidden to go there.
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
12/16/08

@SarahMC: The linked blog says it's cultural and religious. I'm curious for further explanation.
Reply

BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit)
12/16/08

@SarahMC: Well, Satan lurks in the woods waiting to tempt the women and cause them to make their neighbors' crops fail, so you may be on to something.
Reply

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@SarahMC: @LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: Oh dear, this one is a bit rough, it's because back in the day women were often quite hysterical at funerals and this was not pleasant for teh menz so the ladies can't go anymore. Also, I'm relatively certain this isn't written in the Qur'an, and was sort of made up over time. I don't think it is that widely practiced, but Saudi Arabia is known for being the asshole of all assholes.
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@stacyinbean: Sorry, funerals is a mistake, they CAN go to funerals, just not to the actual graveyard with the body...
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

YourScreenplaySucks
12/16/08

@LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: I remember that the Saudi 9-11 terrorists specifically requested in their wills that women not be permitted to attend their funerals or handle their dead bodies, like women were a polluting presence. Don't know if there's a connection. I must say, maggot-ridden corpses seem fairly polluted all on their own.
Reply

SarahMC
12/16/08

@stacyinbean: Oh my god, so women can't attend their own relatives' funerals?!?!
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

stacyinbean
12/16/08

@SarahMC: No no, they can go to the actual funeral prayer, just not to the actual grave. My mistake! Also, any sort of display of grief is highly advised against (which is surprising given what we are shown.) You aren't supposed to question the wisdom of God to give/take life, such as.
Reply

stacyinbean was starred stacyinbean was unstarred

SarahMC
12/16/08

@stacyinbean: Still, though, they can't go to the burials!? I'm surprised they even bury women and girls in S.A. You'd think they'd just toss female remains to the sharks. GRRRRRRR.
Reply

SarahMC was starred SarahMC was unstarred

cwisto moweina has got yer goat
12/16/08

@Your Screenplay Sucks: Why would handling their dead bodies be relevant? Did they really think there would be anything left to handle?
Reply

LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
12/16/08

In reply to Dos And Don'ts
Well, the car paradox is strange. Why can you own a car but not drive it? Why can you own a car (an investment, possibly) but not make cash investments?
Reply

Kivrin
12/16/08

@LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: Probably so that, if you get married, your husband will then take over those property rights. Or some such nonsense.
Reply

Kivrin was starred Kivrin was unstarred

DangerMouse
12/16/08

@LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues: My mom owned a car before she was old enough to drive, but I've never really gotten to the bottom of WHY.

Her brother totaled it anyway.
Reply

DangerMouse was starred DangerMouse was unstarred

Earlier discussions Other discussions Show all discussions Show featured discussions only Start a new discussion

#rules

Jezebel

SUBSCRIBE TO Jezebel

Dos And Don'ts

Fish Forks, Conformity And Inner Peace: The Emily Post Legacy

The One Thing (Besides Take A Dump) You Never Do In Front Of Dudes

Login

Reset Password

Register

Submit Your Comment