Palin's is completely crazy and she is only making this more and more clear. However, jumping to the Japanese internment seems hyperbolic to me. I don't think she suggested something like that and I do sincerely hope that as a country we have learned from that experience in our history
@RubyPenelope: The public backlash against Muslim and Arab Americans (and others perceived to look like them) does recall to me the WWII-era paranoia about Japanese-Americans. As does the US government's treatment of terrorism suspects and the encroachment on civil liberties that has occurred post-9/11. In both cases, it is rooted in racism and xenophobia, and justified by "national security."
@thesciencegirl: Some of the way we have treated me such as detainees certainly does draw that comparison. And the public backlash is paranoid and unfortunate but I don't think anyone today would actually recommend a government policy like internment for everyone of Arab backgrounds. I'm not denying that what was said is terrible and that people are being mistreated only that the direct comparison to actual internment is very harsh here (unless we are talking specifically about innocent detainees who were forced to spend years in gitmo)
@RubyPenelope:
I think the comparison is reasonable, even if the situations are not identical. I think people often point to historical atrocities and give lip service to "not forgetting" but are so loathe to make comparisons to current situations that the not forgetting rings false. It's like when people and governments continue to be slow to react to modern genocides, just because they aren't on the same level as the Holocaust of WWII. The principles, the human rights violations, the underlying issues are the same -- even if the consequences or the scope are not. There's also something to be said for making apt comparisons and speaking out before things reach the level of past wrongs.
Recent events make me very concerned for the rights, safety, and equality of Muslim and Arab residents and citizens of the US, even if they haven't all been rounded up camps.
@thesciencegirl: I agree with your Holocaust analogy when we are talking about it in the terms of actual genocide not like that guy is a soup nazi kind of way. My fear here isn't using the internments as a warning to what can happen when xenophobia and war paranoia get driven to crazy heights, it is a great example of that. My fear is that the comparison will simply make people dismissive of the real threats Arab and Muslim people face becuase it's obvious we aren't going to forcibly rounding up people in to camps. I just feel like liberals have a reputation for overreacting and I just don't want genuine points to be dismissed because of assumption that it really amounts to more liberal political correctness and overreaction instead of actually thoughtfully considering the implications of profiling people. Not that Palin would thoughtfully consider anything, but somewhere out there are generally conservative people who would.
This reminds me of the day that my sister tried to tell me that, "Muslims are just more violent. I mean, you don't hear about people killing for Jesus like that."
I started to say something about the inquisition, crusades and witch hunts but my head exploded so I didn't get the chance.
@willwriteforfood: If we do (and we should), say goodbye to at least 85% of the world's population, assuming that we take proactive steps in annihilating said stupidity.
And for those acts of domestic terrorism, you know, the kind that is grown right here in the US and committed by white people (like, say, Oklahoma City or the shooting of Dr. Tiller or the attack on the Holocaust muesuem in D.C. or every bombing commited by the Unibomber) - what profile do you suggest we use, Sarah?
@amowls: Last month's Rolling Stone (came out before the shootings at Ft. Hood) had a feature article about a few nice white boys who returned from active duty and starting murdering and assaulting random people on and around their base in TX (maybe Fort Bragg? it wasn't Hood). It was not a rampage but rather a calculated series of crimes over a period of several months. The article referenced other recent similar cases; apparently this type of crime spree is not uncommon.
Seriously, these cases have a lot more to do with military culture, never-ending war, lack of resources and support for vets, and PTSD than someone's religion.
I wonder how Glenn Beck would react if some talking head suggested that we should profile men. I'd say pretty much every mass shooting/terrorist act in the U.S. has been carried out by a male. I'm quite sure that he would be very upset about the ridiculousness of that statement, he would say that there are many good men out there, and cry about how can we paint all men with such a broad stroke. There would be a blackboard and flow charts involved, I'm sure.
...If you don't like being lumped into a category with a killer just because of who you are, then maybe you should think about how you classify and treat others.
i saw 2012 last night and i feel like a more terrifying way to depict the apocalypse would have been to explore the possibility of Sarah Palin becoming president that year.
@AtelierCeleste: this just reminds me of my favorite saying: "Those who don't study history are doomed to repeat it. Those who do study history are doomed to know it's repeating."
I see it repeating.
@SevenNationArmy has truth tourettes: I am heavily invested in one side of this conflict and I must say that I encounter people all the time who say incredulously, 'So do they just show up at these people's houses with bulldozers and evict them into the street with impunity?'
and to this I reply: Absolutely. No one does anything, no one cares.
And when I see idiots like this Sarah Palin character speak with such insouciance about the issue, my blood pressure hits the roof.
At least in Europe, there is no sugar-coating or blatant pandering to the side of this conflict that has everything. The stench of American hypocrisy has made me ill, I came home for a bit because of renewed hope at Obama's election. I leave in utter defeat.
This is what's become of the Republican party. Regan bought the loons in, but he only paid lip service to their social agenda for the most part. In the years since however they have become entrenched in the party, and they are setting their agenda. The results are Palin, Huckabee, and the party's Goebbels, Glen Beck. Dazzle the public with a sea of waving flags, and grand speeches exalting the value of the "American way of life" all the while masking their true agenda.
@bluebears: Funny you should mention that book, it's been on my to read list for some time. Maybe when the kids are in college and I'm retired I'll barricade myself in a bookstore and get through my list.
@Pogue Mahone: An aside: I love your user name. I used to use that as a radio sign-off before someone pointed out it sounded like I was saying "Poke my hole." Yeah. Not so much.
Profiling is U.S. foreign policy. This is not something that happened only in WWII. AFRICOM is the result of profiling an entire continent, and U.S. congressmen have called Africa the next Afghanistan and front in the war on terror. Why? Brown skin + Muslim population = security threat.
"any possibility of her running for President in 2012 will, most likely, be shot to smithereens"
Yes, as Ana Marie Cox said on Rachel Maddow last night, when you consider most of her book is about backstabbing and blaming the McCain campaign staff, who the hell would ever want to work for her?
Sarah Palin, Glen Beck, rally your hate-filled followers and have a seat. Sit right here. Now listen very closely:
You may try and continue to profile and speculate, ignorantly lumping decent people in with terrorists, while spreading nasty lies about a faith you know nothing of. You may try to judge a man by his skin color and not by his worth and expect the American people to follow your lead. You may try to rile up the nasty extremist groups that line the fringes of your terrible movement for your own personal gain. You can continue spewing forth this disgusting vitriol to your ignorant followers in the hopes of gaining political ground.
You can try your hardest because in the end--this will not work. Sarah, you're not going to win this round and you're not going to win this fight. You can try as hard as you like, but despite your best efforts you will not drag this country back into the dark ages of civil rights. People far more intelligent and compassionate have worked and struggled for too many years for you to even gain an inch, and the American people will not be drug into your mud-pit of hate.
So go ahead--spit your bigotry upon us liberals, we communist, unpatriotic, stupid, loony, dissidents to your movement. We can take it, because we know how this will end.
@Little Green Frog (Wise Latina): Actually, Beck is really just a "zany-morning-show-DJ" with a bigger audience - it's how he got his start in the 80's at Phoenix's Y95.
The difference between him, Imus, Stern, and George Carlin is that Carlin evolved into a real comedian and social commentator, the others are just loudmouth class-clowns. Too bad he's dead, he opened a lot of eyes to the hypocrisy in everyday America.
Her argument doesn't make sense. (I'm shocked.) This guy's communication WAS examined by different government agencies, and yet he still blew away his colleagues. The government already profiles to a certain extent. What else does Palin want to see happen? I have a family member stationed at a large base readying for redeployment, and a part of me feared for his safety when we didn't have much info. Could it be a coordinated attack was coming or was Ft. Hood isolated? Never once did I think, gee, we need to round up all the Muslims. All those fear-mongers including Sarah Palin need to go take a walk in Section 60 of Arlington to be reminded of the Muslims (and soldiers of every faith including those without a faith) who've given their lives in these wars. As I walked through Section 60 on Veterans Day last year, I recognized crosses, stars of David, and crescent moons. There are so many other symbols I didn't even recognize, too. Looking out over the sea of grave markers with different symbols is powerful. I felt stupid to assume the military is mostly Christian with the rare Jewish soldier, proud of my family's history of service and sad to see so many fresh graves. Hasan is the exception, not the rule.
@msmoneypenny: "What else does Palin want to see happen?"
She wants to see all Muslims in the US, civilian and military, frog-marched out of town and herded into internment camps where she and her cohorts can stand at the barbed-wire fence and jeer and throw tomatoes. I guess now that she's not running for anything, she doesn't have to dance around her idiocy, she can give it full rein. Her thought processes are as simple-minded as they are reprehensible and racist.
Just when you think you spot a glimmer of something you can relate to in Sarah, BAM she outdoes herself with a new level of crazy. Geez she's scary. Hopefully the theory of fading into Dan Quayle oblivion holds true for her. #tips
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
#tips
11/18/09
I think the comparison is reasonable, even if the situations are not identical. I think people often point to historical atrocities and give lip service to "not forgetting" but are so loathe to make comparisons to current situations that the not forgetting rings false. It's like when people and governments continue to be slow to react to modern genocides, just because they aren't on the same level as the Holocaust of WWII. The principles, the human rights violations, the underlying issues are the same -- even if the consequences or the scope are not. There's also something to be said for making apt comparisons and speaking out before things reach the level of past wrongs.
Recent events make me very concerned for the rights, safety, and equality of Muslim and Arab residents and citizens of the US, even if they haven't all been rounded up camps.
11/18/09
#tips
11/18/09
I started to say something about the inquisition, crusades and witch hunts but my head exploded so I didn't get the chance.
11/18/09
11/18/09
Yes I second this type of profiling.
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
[en.wikipedia.org]
[en.wikipedia.org]
11/18/09
Seriously, these cases have a lot more to do with military culture, never-ending war, lack of resources and support for vets, and PTSD than someone's religion.
11/18/09
...If you don't like being lumped into a category with a killer just because of who you are, then maybe you should think about how you classify and treat others.
11/18/09
11/18/09
I have given up hope for this country. Looking forward to leaving in January.
11/18/09
11/18/09
I see it repeating.
11/18/09
and to this I reply: Absolutely. No one does anything, no one cares.
And when I see idiots like this Sarah Palin character speak with such insouciance about the issue, my blood pressure hits the roof.
At least in Europe, there is no sugar-coating or blatant pandering to the side of this conflict that has everything. The stench of American hypocrisy has made me ill, I came home for a bit because of renewed hope at Obama's election. I leave in utter defeat.
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
#tips
11/18/09
11/18/09
But go ahead and knock down the straw woman here.
11/18/09
11/18/09
Profiling people with brown skin because they have brown skin and might be terriers = good policy!
11/18/09
Yes, as Ana Marie Cox said on Rachel Maddow last night, when you consider most of her book is about backstabbing and blaming the McCain campaign staff, who the hell would ever want to work for her?
11/18/09
11/18/09
11/18/09
You may try and continue to profile and speculate, ignorantly lumping decent people in with terrorists, while spreading nasty lies about a faith you know nothing of. You may try to judge a man by his skin color and not by his worth and expect the American people to follow your lead. You may try to rile up the nasty extremist groups that line the fringes of your terrible movement for your own personal gain. You can continue spewing forth this disgusting vitriol to your ignorant followers in the hopes of gaining political ground.
You can try your hardest because in the end--this will not work. Sarah, you're not going to win this round and you're not going to win this fight. You can try as hard as you like, but despite your best efforts you will not drag this country back into the dark ages of civil rights. People far more intelligent and compassionate have worked and struggled for too many years for you to even gain an inch, and the American people will not be drug into your mud-pit of hate.
So go ahead--spit your bigotry upon us liberals, we communist, unpatriotic, stupid, loony, dissidents to your movement. We can take it, because we know how this will end.
11/18/09
11/18/09
(Even though he has a prime-time show on a national cable channel, a syndicated radio show, comedy tours and best-selling books).
11/18/09
The difference between him, Imus, Stern, and George Carlin is that Carlin evolved into a real comedian and social commentator, the others are just loudmouth class-clowns. Too bad he's dead, he opened a lot of eyes to the hypocrisy in everyday America.
11/18/09
11/18/09
She wants to see all Muslims in the US, civilian and military, frog-marched out of town and herded into internment camps where she and her cohorts can stand at the barbed-wire fence and jeer and throw tomatoes. I guess now that she's not running for anything, she doesn't have to dance around her idiocy, she can give it full rein. Her thought processes are as simple-minded as they are reprehensible and racist.
11/18/09