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LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word

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AtomiClash: humanitarian misanthrope
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
LDS - hoist by their own petard.

I relish it, especially such an organization that posthumously baptizes Holocaust victims. (WTF?!)
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GoldenRatioφ (aka -girl11)
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
I briefly considered threatening the LDS by telling them that for every gay marriage that dies because of them, I will sleep with a woman. Then I realized that was pretty immature, offensive to gay people and I'd probably have to stop at Tina Fey and Angelina Jolie anyway. But still...could be a secret weapon against the LDS?

Just putting that out there, Angelina, call me!
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Feminist Whore
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
It's all about breeding. Gay people don't breed. That makes them bad. In the minds of, what I like to call, the Bible-Based-Breeding-Brigade - the B4 for short.

The gay community should fight fire with fire, and call the fundies on thier fundie-ness. In AZ the prop 102 commercials used the phrasing "Marriage should be one man, one woman, for the purpose of bringing life to the new generation"... I thought, gee what next, no marriage unless you plan to procreate...
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

@alphafemale: I refuse to accept that reasoning, or the other smokescreen about religion, until someone comes after my childless-by-choice, atheist marriage to a dude. We could have been cousins, for all the county clerk knew. They didn't check..
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GoldenRatioφ (aka -girl11)
11/11/08

@alphafemale: That's the reasoning my Grandma gave me! Then I asked her what about couples who couldn't conceive; oh, apparently God doesn't WANT them to, and furthermore, they should get the adoptable babies, not gay people. Right.

And then I asked her about hetero couples who didn't want to have kids, but still wanted to get married and she looked at me and said, "oh, you'll change your mind." Gahhh.
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

@goldengirl11: Now, when parents tell me that I'll change my mind for sure about having kids I say "What if I have kids and then change my mind again?"
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SarahMC
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
Obviously I really hate the LDS church, and am extremely disappointed and angry that so. much. energy. was invested in passing Prop 8. The Prop 8 folks blatantly lied in their campaign. But you know what? Churches are protected from being *forced* to perform marriage ceremonies they don't want to, and it takes very little effort to figure that out. Prop 8 lied, but the lies were easily refutable!!
The jerks who voted yes are either hateful or willfully ignorant - about our constitutinal rights, constitutional protections of religious groups, the very way government functions, what is taught in public schools, etc. I can't feel bad for them; they shouldn't be voting in the first place when they are so clueless about civics.
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LaComtesse
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
I am currently re-reading "To Kill A Mockingbird" for the first time since freshman year of high school. I have cried SO MANY times because civil rights, sadly, haven't come very far for a LOT of people. Every time I read about Prop 8 I just picture Scout saying "There's only one type of folks. Folks."
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GoldenRatioφ (aka -girl11)
11/11/08

@LaComtesse: I'm taking Constitutional Law right now, and last week, swear to God, we were reading Virginia v. Loving (the 1967 SCOTUS biracial marriage case) and I lost it. Especially with all the other Equal Protection cases we've been reading.
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
There is a petition to revoke their tax free status. Please check it out.

[www.mormonsstoleourrights.com]
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

@HanaMaru: You can also file a formal complaint to the IRS with this form:

[lds501c3.files.wordpress.com]
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Alexis
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
I don't get it. Why do people care to take away the rights of others? Most of these people don't even KNOW any homosexuals, so how does this fucking justify?
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MegSpencer
11/11/08

@Evlsushi: The worst is the ones who do, like Dick Cheney, and manage to compartmentalize so that they can get away with being a dick anyhow.
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

@Evlsushi: Oh, yes they do!
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flashingJ
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
I tried to open up a dialogue with my fundamentalist relatives about this (looking for common ground related to fairness and compassion), and discovered that they do NOT believe in separation of church and state, and they claim that this is a myth that has been invented by liberal heathens like myself.

The concept of freedom of religion is also irrelevant to them, because they think their Church is the only correct one.
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disco2000
11/11/08

@flashingJ: I still don't understand how the fundamentalists refuse to protect their fundamentalism by fighting for separation of church and state. Why would you want prayers in school, when you would be having all the mormons, muslims, catholics, jews, protestants, and athiests all praying together? Wouldn't it cheapen their prayers by forcing non-believers to hypocritically pray along with them? I guess the answer is to only have one religion, and burn at the stake everyone who doesn't agree for being witches.

What I really hate is when said fundamentalists claim to be so patriotic as well. This country is founded on the freedom of religion, you're being profoundly anti-american when you force your ideas onto others.
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ChristieLove
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
Between the pro-Prop 8 work and the fact that they are STILL posthumously baptizing Jews who died in the Holocaust, despite a 1995 agreement to the contrary, the LDS church is really pissing me off.
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MegSpencer
11/11/08

@ChristieLove: I was talking to a friend of mine this morning about a really moving thing on facebook recently about how her mom is gay, and was saying that while I really don't want to just hate the LDS church, I really kind of do. This makes me sad.
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Jessi Ramsey
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word

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angelheadedhipster
11/11/08

@Jessi Ramsey: Brilliant.
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everfade
11/11/08

@Jessi Ramsey: I love that.
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LadySoprano is a Fat-Fighting Superwoman
11/11/08

@Jessi Ramsey: Beautiful!
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angelheadedhipster
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
Ugh . . . at his point I just want no one to get married, in fact I want marriage to be done away with all together. Let's all just live in communes or totally alone.
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angelheadedhipster
11/11/08

@angelheadedhipster: That was meant to sound snarky but it came out kind of depressing. Whoops.
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kierabs
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
I went to the rally/march on Temple Square in Salt Lake City on Friday. It was amazing, 2000-3000 people showed up, they only expected 1000. People held signs alluding to polygamy, saying "I only want ONE husband" and "Can I have 27 wives instead?" as well as shouting "Separate Church and State" and "Tax the Church."
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pantsless economist...access RESTORED
11/11/08

@kierabs: yeah, see, I know LDS doesn't practice or condone polygamy any longer, but they used to and I'm sure they must have felt persecuted by the government for not allowing it. sound familiar?
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Sukie in the Graveyard
11/11/08

@kierabs: those signs sound awesome.
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morninggloria
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
Someone should push for the revocation of LDS's tax-exempt status.
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Hana Maru
11/11/08

@morninggloria: They did break the tax law. Here is the petition to revoke their tax free status:

[www.mormonsstoleourrights.com]
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MissNormaDesmond
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
You know what? As painful as it was to wake up on Wednesday morning and see that Prop. 8 had passed, I'm more and more believing that this has provoked a crisis in the gay rights movement that will prove to be beneficial. People are galvanized in a way they haven't been before, both by that defeat and by the hope for ultimate success that Obama's election has given us. People are recognizing that we could be employing smarter, more effective methods of getting our message across and achieving our goals. We will learn from this, and we will keep moving, and we shall and will overcome.
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JennaW
11/11/08

@MissNormaDesmond: I agree -- I know I'm fired up, and I, like Olbermann proclaimed, have no vested interest in this.

I just can't sit on the sidelines while this stupidity goes on right here, right now, in this moment after all we've been through as a nation.
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wedropscience
11/11/08

In reply to LGBT Advocates In Utah Take The LDS At Its Word
i don't understand how what i do in my bedroom with a consenting adult is any of the government's business.

all these laws that prevent gay couples from doing what straight couples can are like a huge discouragement, it's like the government is saying, "don't be gay or we will inconvenience you."
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Laulau
11/11/08

@wedropscience: I was talking about this once with a friend and he was like, as long as no one is hurting anyone, the government should butt out. And I told him that I knew what he meant, and that it was coming from the best place, but screw "not hurting anyone". When two gay people love each other so much that they want to commit publicly to a life together, that isn't just "not hurting anyone", that is one of the most beautiful things two human beings can do, and it takes a special kind of smallness to want to stop them from doing that. And it was that sentiment that I loved about Olbermann's bit.
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