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checkyaself
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
What saddens me is that for many blacks Egypt is the only country in Africa they know and they connect Africa with being black and lay claim to a ancestry and culture they are not really apart of (probably because it is the only country in Africa whose history is throughly researched) and their are so many interesting cultures in Africa outside of Egypt that they don't know about and if they did they could probably successfully trace their ancestry.
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amoureuse is a second class citizen
12/16/08

@checkyaself: Egypt's history is well preserved & documented. The hieroglyphs and temples have kept Egyptian history alive.

Most African nations have an oral culture (griots)and their histories did not get written or stand the test of time.
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checkyaself
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
To me Cleopatra probably looked like a modern day Egyptian, and modern day Egyptians don't consider themselves African they consider themselves Egyptian. It's just like people from Sicily considering themselves Sicilian instead of Italian. Just because Egypt is in Africa doesn't mean the people themselves are black. Would anyone hear be okay with Charlize Theron calling herself African American? In fact most blacks ancestors do not come from Egyptian ancestry.

In my opinion she probably wasn't 100% Caucasian but she definitely wasn't black. The Romans looked down upon interracial mixing so it is highly unlikely Julius Caesar and Marc Anthony would've hooked up with her and been so public about their love for her.
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amoureuse is a second class citizen
12/16/08

@checkyaself: Just because they looked down on it doesn't mean that they didn't partake in it-- see Thomas Jefferson & most plantation owners.
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checkyaself
12/16/08

@amoureuse is a second class citizen:

But they would not have been so public with her. TJ kept SH in the background. Ceasar and Marc Anthony declared their love for Cleo and parade her around the streets of Rome, you don't do that if you're against interracial mixing. So that to me is at least one good reason she was probably more Caucasian than Egyptian.
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amoureuse is a second class citizen
12/16/08

@checkyaself: Keep in mind that she also wasn't your average black woman. She had power, riches and could serve as a formidable ally.
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CrossWord
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Her people were not Nordic.
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RiotGrrrl
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
I was kinda in love with Elizabeth Taylor's Cleopatra when I was little. So I have a question, would it be offensive/racist to dress up like her for Halloween next year? I already have a dress that would fit the role...Or would this be too similar to the geisha?
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
12/16/08

@RiotGrrrl: If you have to ask ...
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morninggloria
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
You guys, it could be an idealized portrait. Maybe she looked like this:

[sportswrap.berecruited.com]

but just wanted to be drawn pretty.
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bowleserised
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
The comments on the Daily Heil's article on this story were full of outrage from people who seemed to think that *they* knew exactly what Cleopatra looked like, and there was no way this stupid scientist did. Also, lots of thinly veiled racism...
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Beat Girl
12/16/08

@bowleserised: I'm surprised they bothered with the veiling.

It makes me vomit, that paper. Even worse, it is absolutely REQUIRED of me to purchase at least once per year as part of my journalism degree. I kicked up a stink once... it didn't fly.
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amoureuse is a second class citizen
12/16/08

@bowleserised: It's both sad and funny that people are not ok with the idea of a powerful, intelligent and beautiful black woman. These same people are probably not down with the swirl (interracial dating) either. If it wasn't for the bible, I have a feeling that people would have claimed that Queen Sheba (Makeda) was also white and would have tried to deny the biblical swirl between her and King Solomon.
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Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
And, what is a hook nose??

I've def heard and read about it before, but what is it and why hook?
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ceejeemcbeegee is not here
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Great... now if we can just get them to admit the Ancient Moors were of African decent, then I be happy.
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
12/16/08

@ceejeemcbeegee: Heh. Good luck with that.

And please text me when it happens. I wanna see.
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amoureuse is a second class citizen
12/16/08

@ceejeemcbeegee: I did not know that people claimed that the Moors were not African. Damn!
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PhillyLass
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Who the fuck thought she looked European?
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ceejeemcbeegee is not here
12/16/08

@PhillyLass: Hollywood...The Powers That Be... Egyptians...
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Evie Havok
12/16/08

@PhillyLass: White people? Also: look at Jesus. He's blonde, blue eyed, and tall.
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BuffySummers
12/16/08

@I_Love_AFI: all white people, totally. Or just everyone who knew she was Greek...
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
12/16/08

@I_Love_AFI: Jesus looks like Leon.

Madonna says so.
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Evie Havok
12/16/08

@BuffySummers: @Rooo sez BISH PLZ: Dude's, it's a joke. You know, haha?
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Rooo sez BISH PLZ
12/16/08

@I_Love_AFI: Dude. Did you miss the whole "Like a Prayer" vid?

(Or never hear of the phrase "half in jest wholly in earnest"?)

Haha.
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hatepaperdoll
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Oh my god, how many times to I have to say it? I'm Cleo-frikin-patra!

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Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka
12/16/08

@hatepaperdoll: And who did you end up picking in High School? Abe or JFK?

I never caught the ending before MTV yanked you all away ...
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hatepaperdoll
12/16/08

@Miss Smith Drank Your Vodka: Well I picked Abe but he seems to have a thing for that Joan...
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Rasselas
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
One would think that the lessons of history counterindicate placing too much faith in the Ptolemies.
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zapatosnuevos
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
There are many descriptions of her as well, aside from composites on coins. She was later made to be "beautiful" by Western standards. Originally she was revered for her raw sexual power, her vernacular, intelligence and her cunning.
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shorty63136
12/16/08

@zapatosnuevos: I can haz original Cleo attributes, plez? Thanx.

And if she looked anything like Hoda Kotb (who is Egyptian, from what I understand), she's freakin gorgeous.
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YourScreenplaySucks
12/16/08

@zapatosnuevos: I want that last sentence for my epitaph.
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Evie Havok
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Going by the comments here a few of you seem upset she isn't completely white. What the hell is that?
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ceejeemcbeegee is not here
12/16/08

@I_Love_AFI: Sarcasm.
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a virgin who can't drive...says שלום
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
Oh please, Jeebus, Ala, Deity of choice, make Cleopatra brown and beautiful. I have grappled with a society that will never, ever find my looks acceptable because I am half black (not ethnically black, very, very dark skinned Arab) The result of something like Cleopatra here. And the thing is, she has LONG been fetishized as the ideal of how a woman should look like and take care of herself. Which Elizabeth Taylor then proceeded to shit all over. Heh.

Make her of color, Ala, and make Rosario Dawson play her next time. Or better yet, Stacy Dash (just because)
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shorty63136
12/16/08

@woomanizah: Ooh, yes. Stacy Dash.
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Sandicomm
12/16/08

In reply to Portrait Of A Lady
I saw this last night, and I will repeat my original comment: just because Egyptians valued enormous eyes and portrayed people as such, doesn't mean that Cleopatra had eyes too big for her head.

Not to belittle the scientists' work, but it's the truth. I mean, does that look like a human to you? No? Exactly.
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taranwanderer
12/16/08

@Sandicomm: Hold the phone! So Cleopatra was an alien? You mean the movie Stargate was based on a true story??

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