@PhillyLass: They caught him. I think he was really more of a "spree" killer. He shot five or six people in like a month including a sixteen year old girl.
Shit, yall, this is scary to me. I'm trying to decide where to buy my bus ticket to right now--I'm in New York, and my living situation has fallen through, and I've been unemployed for a month an unable to find anything.
My plan is to take my last $300 and get myself to someplace where it's cheap to live, find some sort of job, and get re-started there...and it has occurred to me that I may have to live in a marginal situation like these ladies for a little while, until I can build up enough capital to get a place.
Rocky Mount wasn't not on my list--it's right off 95.
@lucyzero: FWIW, I heard on NPR that there is an abundance of jobs in North Dakota. I've never been there and I don't know what kind of jobs they are, but I imagine cost of living is pretty low. Good luck!
Does anybody think that if prostitution and drugs were decriminalized in the U.S. the situation of neglecting to investigate this type of crime would be less likely to occur?
I'm thinking that if society could view these lifestyles as a little more acceptable - not as something that deems a person's life worthless - there might be a little more compassion, and therefore a little more action on behalf of the police.
@palebluepixie: Oh hells yes.Considering that peoples COULD be making legal bank off of drugs and prostitution, one has to wonder why, in this capitalist society, we haven't legalized/decriminalized these things already.
I believe that the war on drugs is a powerful tool for the elites to maintain political power. It is a handy identifier: this subsection of people is undeserving of compassion or legal protection, so we can break down their doors and shoot them at will. Likewise with prostitutes: they are different, they are other, they are not fully human. Extending legal protection to them would give the lie to much of the religious right's frothing hysteria about sin and moral decay destroying this country. This would undermine their ability to lather their base into a frenzy and send them off to the voting booths to elect the likes of Bush, Palin, and other political crazies.
Robert Lee Yates Jr.
Aluminum plant worker and Army Reserve helicopter pilot, Spokane
Killed a string of prostitutes in Spokane and Pierce County since 1996. Admitted to 16 murders, convicted of 15. Typically would pick up prostitutes, shoot them and engage in post-mortem sex. Grew up on Whidbey Island and lived in several Washington cities.
Status: On death row in Washington.
@reynwrap582: No shit. Wesley Alan Dodd was slinking around my hometown when I was a kid, and although most people associate Ted Bundy with Florida, he definitely picked off a few women at the University of Washington first.
I remember reading a true crime novel about a case similar to this out on the west coast (Washington or Oregon, I can't quite recall). The serial killer targeted prostitutes and police were, at least at first, not very motivated to solve the crimes. I believe they did eventually get the guy. This was in the late 80s early 90s, I believe.
@Cherry Blossom Girl: I think you're thinking of the Green River Killer, in the Seattle area. He murdered prostitutes and it took ages for the police to catch him.
@Penny_Esq: Actually Penny, I think you're right. I was. Scarily when I googled "Washington serial killer of prostitutes" more than one man came up. How disturbing is that?
A southern thing? Would it were so. I just heard this story on the BBC this morning: [www.bloomberg.com]
Armed men burst into a sauna in Dagestan (near Georgia--the Russian one) and shot and killed seven women. The BBC anchor was interviewing a local reporter. He asked what the motivation for the killing was.
"Well," the local man replied, "These women, who spent most of their time in the saunas, were commonly, and in many cases correctly, thought to be prostitutes."
He stopped. Apparently, in his mind, that was all the explanation that was needed. The BBC anchor had to press him again to get him to explain that the killers were Islamists.
Then the discussion moved on. No further explanation needed--apparently, the combination of Islamists and prostitutes automatically results in mass murder.
I guess we haven't learned anything from the Robert Pikcton case in Vancouver. He killed 49 women and it took almost 20 years for the police to notice.
Prostitutes and other women on the fringes of society (i.e. runaways) have always and will always be the preferred victim of serial killers. It's because of accessibility and the lower chance of the crime being discovered/reported. And when the crime is finally discovered, crucial forensic evidence has already been lost (as is the case with these murders).
Also, despite what TV would have us believe, it takes a lot of time and effort to identify when a serial killer is at work.
@Our Lady of the Massacre: While I won't discount the effect race has or may have played in the crime, investigation, or reporting thereof, I co-sign all your other points. I hope that the killer is caught very soon.
stark contrast to the response to the craigslist killer, indeed - who had white victims. i guess there is a hierarchy even in prejudice against sex workers.
@sharkie792: While I don't doubt race is a factor here - the Craiglist killer murdered a woman in a hotel room and left her there. Much higher chance of people reacting quickly because the body was discovered quickly. Unlike with the north carolina murders, the killer left his victims on the side of the road. If it's not a well traveled road or a road with a lot of vegatation, it may have taken a lot longer for these women to be found.
Police neglect is easier when there aren't family members desperate to find a person. Sadly, if these women were on the margins of society, its likely they have little or no family fighting for them (or they may not have been where they were in the first place) or the family/friends are similarly on the margins of society, distrusted or dismissed by the police, and action may be slow. This isn't a Southern thing. It's an American criminal justice system thing.
Wow, 2 of 5 comments already suggesting that the police neglect is due to it being in the south. I'm almost certain that I recall similar stories throughout the US. Tragically, crimes against minority and marginalized women are often ignored, regardless of geographic location.
@Rabbitty: It is easy to slam the South in many ways because the racism is out in the open there. here in the North we hide it. The main issue is the fact no one cares about these women moreso due to their profession and lifestyle. Why are their lives less important than mine? Who decided and where are the Right Wingers and their anger about the treatment of these impoverished few??
@MissFiFi: I agree that it's easier but that doesn't make it right.
I feel that when we say it's due to southern racism or bible belt attitudes, it does a disservice to those working for social justice (including eradicating the racism and classism that leads to these murders being ignored). Because, as you point out, racism does exist in the north and when we label it as a southern problem we can forget that it is something we should be aware of in every state.
Of course, I agree with you that we fail as people when we don't value these women's lives because of their socioeconomic status and I would love to see the right wing give a shit, but I'm not holding my breath.
This is pretty scary, considering I live in Raleigh, NC (the capital) and read the News & Observer every day and haven't heard of this yet. It's disturbing how the media coverage really and truly differs based on the perceived class/race of the victim.
Raleigh's about 30 minutes from Rocky Mount, close enough to commute to, which my dad did for a long time. I SHOULD have heard about this.
@gennie.catastrophe: I live in Raleigh also, and the only reason I know about this is because I work with law enforcement in that area. There's people in the community who have been saying this for months/years, and people are just now paying any attention. It's frickin sad.
Not the first story they've done about it. Your main point about biased coverage, I agree with, but I want to give credit where credit is due, and I think the lack of coverage in this case has more to do with Rocky Mount police not giving a shit for so long than slacking by the N/O.
@dreamweave: Well with coverage like this who needs the police? "They spent their nights jumping in and out of strange cars, trolling otherwise empty streets lined with decaying storefronts and boarded-up homes. Many sold sex to support drug habits or children left in the care of worried, hardworking grandmothers."
That's not exactly helpful, informative news (at least in my book).
@gennie.catastrophe: uh-oh - please don't mistake my earlier comment as a testament to N/O's star-reporting! It's gone way downhill in recent years - much more sensationalist.
@gennie.catastrophe: That reeks of victim-blame, doesn't it? The implication being that if these women worked in office building during daylight hours, or just stayed home doing the laundry, they might still be alive... Was that written by the PR team of the Stamford Marriot, I wonder?
@JerseyGrrrl: Exactly. And that's the first line of the article. This is, unfortunately, not unusual for the N&O. (Had to Google the Stamford Marriott, but yes, it does seem very similar. More blame for the victim all around!)
@labeled: Now that you say that, I can see why it could be read it that way. Maybe I'm too quick to see victim blame against women.
I just feel like an article about a local serial killer who's still on the loose while more women are missing shouldn't need gratuitous editorializing to sell itself to readers.
@JerseyGrrrl: Well, also bear in mind that I'm a Pollyanna, and tend to jump to sympathy for a person, rather than disdain. And I am not the norm. Many people would read that quote and immediately think less of the women and the situation they've brought upon themselves. (Not saying that's what you're doing, obvs.)
@Spoiledheathenpunk: In all fairness, it actually happened several years ago in Albuquerque. Authorities are only now finding bodies on the West Mesa. Still damn creepy.
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My plan is to take my last $300 and get myself to someplace where it's cheap to live, find some sort of job, and get re-started there...and it has occurred to me that I may have to live in a marginal situation like these ladies for a little while, until I can build up enough capital to get a place.
Rocky Mount wasn't not on my list--it's right off 95.
Anyone have any other suggestions?
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You don't get shit for selling jewelry in midtown these days, btw.
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I would try this list of cities with the lowest unemployment and pick one you have a friend in already so you can crash for a week or two.
[jobs.aol.com]
You can always sell old belongings, right?
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I'm thinking that if society could view these lifestyles as a little more acceptable - not as something that deems a person's life worthless - there might be a little more compassion, and therefore a little more action on behalf of the police.
Just a thought.
08/14/09
I believe that the war on drugs is a powerful tool for the elites to maintain political power. It is a handy identifier: this subsection of people is undeserving of compassion or legal protection, so we can break down their doors and shoot them at will. Likewise with prostitutes: they are different, they are other, they are not fully human. Extending legal protection to them would give the lie to much of the religious right's frothing hysteria about sin and moral decay destroying this country. This would undermine their ability to lather their base into a frenzy and send them off to the voting booths to elect the likes of Bush, Palin, and other political crazies.
08/14/09
Robert Lee Yates Jr.
Aluminum plant worker and Army Reserve helicopter pilot, Spokane
Killed a string of prostitutes in Spokane and Pierce County since 1996. Admitted to 16 murders, convicted of 15. Typically would pick up prostitutes, shoot them and engage in post-mortem sex. Grew up on Whidbey Island and lived in several Washington cities.
Status: On death row in Washington.
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Armed men burst into a sauna in Dagestan (near Georgia--the Russian one) and shot and killed seven women. The BBC anchor was interviewing a local reporter. He asked what the motivation for the killing was.
"Well," the local man replied, "These women, who spent most of their time in the saunas, were commonly, and in many cases correctly, thought to be prostitutes."
He stopped. Apparently, in his mind, that was all the explanation that was needed. The BBC anchor had to press him again to get him to explain that the killers were Islamists.
Then the discussion moved on. No further explanation needed--apparently, the combination of Islamists and prostitutes automatically results in mass murder.
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ETA: Ugh, they think he fed some of the bodies to the pigs...
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Prostitutes and other women on the fringes of society (i.e. runaways) have always and will always be the preferred victim of serial killers. It's because of accessibility and the lower chance of the crime being discovered/reported. And when the crime is finally discovered, crucial forensic evidence has already been lost (as is the case with these murders).
Also, despite what TV would have us believe, it takes a lot of time and effort to identify when a serial killer is at work.
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I feel that when we say it's due to southern racism or bible belt attitudes, it does a disservice to those working for social justice (including eradicating the racism and classism that leads to these murders being ignored). Because, as you point out, racism does exist in the north and when we label it as a southern problem we can forget that it is something we should be aware of in every state.
Of course, I agree with you that we fail as people when we don't value these women's lives because of their socioeconomic status and I would love to see the right wing give a shit, but I'm not holding my breath.
08/14/09
Raleigh's about 30 minutes from Rocky Mount, close enough to commute to, which my dad did for a long time. I SHOULD have heard about this.
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Not the first story they've done about it. Your main point about biased coverage, I agree with, but I want to give credit where credit is due, and I think the lack of coverage in this case has more to do with Rocky Mount police not giving a shit for so long than slacking by the N/O.
08/14/09
"They spent their nights jumping in and out of strange cars, trolling otherwise empty streets lined with decaying storefronts and boarded-up homes. Many sold sex to support drug habits or children left in the care of worried, hardworking grandmothers."
That's not exactly helpful, informative news (at least in my book).
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I just feel like an article about a local serial killer who's still on the loose while more women are missing shouldn't need gratuitous editorializing to sell itself to readers.
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