At least some of the resentment must stem from the sense many people have that Giuliano's success is disproportionate to her success. Her books are fine, but simple. Plenty of people could have written them -- the conversational tone, the common sense advice, the dash of Francophile. But Giuliano actually did write them (and was helped, no doubt, but access to publishers not exactly available to your average Jane), and she's made tons of money off of them and had the opportunity to write yet more bestsellers.
It's Dan Brown syndrome. It's easier to hate on someone who seems no more talented than you are. #mireilleguiliano
The "Skinny Bitch" authors deserve more ire here, for 1. Writing a book with "bitch" on the title solely for the gratuitous-titillation factor, 2. Promoting the idea that it's cool to be a nasty, obnoxious, self-centered diva, especially if you're thin.
@ihateyourescalade: I HATE those books. My sister came home from college with all of them and I didn't even bother to mask my utter contempt. First of all, the lingo that they use in the books is incredibly grating. (Example: kitch=kitchen). Secondly, their entire pitch is, as you said, that vanity is a good thing and that anything with fat in it is "gross" and therefore, will make you "ugly." The entire series reads like an ED handbook because it combines fucked-up eating philosophies with crackpot science and psychology. Ugh, I could go on for days... #mireilleguiliano
@femme-bot: Not sure if this will help or hurt my rant, but I've never read them either. I am already skinny and I work really hard NOT to be a bitch. #mireilleguiliano
@ihateyourescalade: I never read them, either. I just remember them saying something along the lines of "yes, we're bitches, but we're skinny bitches."
Now, it's one thing to co-opt the word "bitch" if you're describing a woman who doesn't subject herself to the patriarchal standards of what a nice girl should be. That's very different than conforming to most of society's rules (torturing yourself and others in order to stay thin is very, very conventional), and just being a bad person while doing it. If someone is only destructive to themselves, they have my sympathy. But when they start being destructive to others, and doing it proudly, there needs to be some negative reinforcement from the world at large. NOT a book deal. #mireilleguiliano
This is the first I've heard of this movie and I'm already insulted by it. I'm sure it will be a weight loss journey to a handsome man! With champagne and shoes! And a kiss under the Eiffel Tower! And all because she lost fifteen pounds! By living fabulously in the 7th arrondissement! #mireilleguiliano
I will never trust a woman who tells me to eat small portions of high quality, non-diet, non-ersatz food and then tells me to make an apple tart out of cabbage leaves instead of pastry.
There should be a special circle of hell for that. Maybe it's circle 5.5 (between wrath and heresy). #mireilleguiliano
Huh. When you put it that way, she has every single trait I resent, yet I loved FWDGF. I'm not one to buy weight loss books, but I not only read this one but actually enjoyed it. But whatever. Go ahead and hate her; sounds like there are some good reasons to. #mireilleguiliano
@RedLantern: The one piece of advice from FWDGF that I absolutely loved was the part where she mocks American women for carrying around water bottles "like peasants." That made me laugh out loud--and I no longer bring water with me on the street. #mireilleguiliano
Not trying to say nobody would ever hate a man for being smug, but I'm saying that she faced certain criticisms that men do not.
I was going on the reasons sadie gave for people disliking her based on "smugness," etc rather than a substantial reason which is much of the criticism hillary faced and faces. So i think the comparison still stands. #mireilleguiliano
@chinaplate: It stuck out with flashing lights as "Moms vs. Non-moms." Urgh. Yes, if you don't have children, your life is full of wild single activities, but you won't get the best gift in the world, parenthood. And if you choose to have children, you are completing the circle of life, yet are tied down to an orchid-less life, yadda yadda yadda. I wish this would die. #mireilleguiliano
@midwestdesigner: I totally read that as "Moms vs Noms," which I thought was rather unfair because just because you like cookies and maybe your Mom tells you that you can only have two, that is no reason to pit them against one another. #mireilleguiliano
@AndPreciousLittleofThat: its just an extra thing to hate about french women, they're big eyes and short hair and adorable accents... and the fact that men find them irresistable. If their only steriotypical trait was skinniness maybe i wouldn't have such an irrational hatred. :-) #mireilleguiliano
What don't French women get about fat? It's a semi-solid lipid composed of glycerol and carboxylic acid that frequently serves as an energy source when converted into glucose and also is necessary to metabolize several vitamins.
There, if French women read that (translated, naturellement), they'll get fat. #mireilleguiliano
I read this book because when I was in high school I had a Frenchwoman as my dorm mother, and the tone reminded me so much of her. So I never link this book with Mme. Guiliano, only with Mme. Stanton.
That being said, I like her writing style, and most of what she says is sound - don't eat when you're bored, take a half-hour walk everyday, etc. - but I'm still a little baffled that she's managed to construct an empire around what strikes me as little more than common sense. #mireilleguiliano
@sableized (just like starting over): Common sense that won't make you thin unless you happen to be blessed with the "right" genes, stay away from the many medications that cause weight gain, and don't have any problems with your endocrine system.
I'm thinking of writing a whole series of books based on the awesomesness that is Canadian women.
Hmmm. What kind of BS would sell? Canadian Women Don't Get Bored? Canadian Women Don't Wear Uggs? #mireilleguiliano
Given the fashion industry's generally overwhelming insensitivity with regards to racial issues (among many, many others), I'm NOT going to give French Vogue the benefit of the doubt. I remember an American Vogue spread from the mid-to-late '90s that featured a model of Euro descent covered in bronzer and wearing 'tribal'-inspired clothing (fringed leggings, feathered headdresses, etc.) This feels like a slightly subtler version of that.
And I don't think the "But we're French!" excuse flies anymore. It's not like France is hermetically sealed off from the rest of the world or doesn't have its own racial problems. I'm sorry to say that from my perspective, Europeans seem to be behind Americans in terms of racial sensitivity. I still clearly remember the slanty eyes pictures of the Spanish Olympic basketball team and the repeated, lame Berlusconi jokes about the Obamas being "tanned." Both of those were excused as instances of cultural ignorance, usually accompanied by a "hey, it was a joke you PC Americans. Lighten up!"
@lodown: I totally agree. I think it's safe to say that the problem isn't Americans being too PC (as if) but that many Europeans are quite comfortable with their racism because it's still the status quo in many parts of Europe. A head of state makes racist comments on a regular basis and there doesn't seem to be much condemnation from the European community.
@topsy: Right, because Europeans are automatically more enlightened than we prudish, Bible-thumping Americans. It's kinda like how some lefty men feel their liberal social views gives them the license to say/do the most sexist things.
I don't think it's fair to judge people when it comes to this sort of thing as racist when you don't know how certain things are or aren't perceived in another continent. I am european and I never know what might offend an american. Most things one notices when others react to them. Things that an american might find offensive aren't always offensive to other cultures. These pics to me look like what Lady Gaga did maybe a couple of months ago, when she did that photoshoot for ID magazine, sort of like a negative of a photograph. Plus, the model is completely painted in one colour, does that still qualify as black face? It doesn't look like it's done with the intention to be racist and to mock someone.
@ninles: I'm sorry, but I'm European too, and from quite a monoracial place that is fairly racist. When I first moved away I iwas incredibly ignorant and said all kinds of accidentally racist stuff. It took my friends firmly pointing out that to me to make me start educating myself. Ignorance is not an excuse, it doesn't make stuff not racist. Some French people might find racist stuff ok (like some Americans do), but that doesn't excuse them. And instead of suggesting that you 'never know what might offend an American, putting yourself in the place of the other culture.
@ninles: I'm from Europe, and I find this offensive. Just sayin'. Sure, not knowing what others find offensive is not in itself bad...but it is bad if we don't choose to educate ourselves about why they might object.
The shoot is apparently intended to be arty, to be edgy; fine. But it feels cheap and attention-seeking, and the lack of non-white models in the rest of the issue suggests that the editors are actually the opposite of edgy - they are just lazy and conservative.
This is pitiful and sad. Interestingly, Miss France 2009, Chloe Mortaud, is a biracial black woman born and raised in France. However, many of her white countrynmen felt she didn't adquately represent the country, despite the many peoples of color living there (especially those from former French colonies). She's been called Miss Obama and mongrel among other names. (sigh)
@MyEyesSee: Why am I not surprised? Europe could teach the US a lot about racism; they've been at it longer. This is the New Face of Europe folks, so get used to it. My black children will be able to claim that they are of European descent because their Mummy is European. And has the passport to prove it!
Regarding the term "blackface", I think there's a real difference between a white person putting dark makeup on, and blackface. Traditional blackface was intended to parody African Americans. I don't think that playing with identity in this way is the same thing. The same goes for men who dress up as women. When it's a parody of women I despise it, but when the intention is to parody social norms or to portray real characters I'm ok with it. Consider when Robert Downey Jr.'s character played an African American in Tropic Thunder. There the intention was to make fun of acting, and it worked even though the character was clearly racist. In the Vogue spread there are images where the model is painted black, painted white, and painted a combination of the two. For this reason, it seems that the intention was to acknowledge race in a provocative way. Whether it was effective or just offensive is another matter. What's more telling to me, is the fact that neither in this spread or anywhere else are models other than standard sized, white women featured - even though it's supposedly a tribute to models.
@topsy: Well of course if the group disagrees the comments must be wrong. Ironic that you are touting the group mentality in a story that involves the French. I believe they had an issue with mob rule a while back.
As I mentioned in the first story about this, racism does not exist on its own. It is an intent. There is no way there was intent here. Brown paint on white skin is not in and of itself a minstrel show, and it does not inherently make the pictures racist. So by the logic of the detractors on the board, no one is ever allowed to wear white robes anymore just because the Klan does? Or is it the pointy hats that make them racists? The people involved in this are not racists. So the pics cant be either.
The most disturbing thing about this is that if they had used a black model wearing white paint in the spread, this article and these discussions would not even exist. Everyone here that is offended by this would be appeased by that simple tit for tat. And for anyone to think that actual racism could be resolved so easily is dangerous. If your resolution to "racism" can be resolved that simply, then it wasn't real in the first place. And please spare me the forth coming "I didn't say that would appease me" line. Its the truth, and if you're being honest with us and yourself you know it is.
@ohayou_kun: I thought 'White Chicks' was VERY offensive. Of course, I'm going by what I saw in the trailer, since I nor any other black person I know has never seen it. Now what?
@cainemarko: I think it is spectacularly reductive to bring complex discussions of how images are embedded in a network and a history of racial stereotyping down to 'the people involved in this are not racists. So the pic can't be either'. A: how on earth would you know what their private beliefs are? B: Racism, or any other ideological position, doesn't function overtly. Most of us are unaware of our own prejudices. C: Nobody has suggested that the editors of Vogue 'are racists'. You are setting that up as a straw man. To adopt the Tom Cruise debating style you seem to favour: you can't handle the truth.
@DexterHaven: It's easier to set up a straw man when you don't have a leg to stand on. It's supposed to be a distraction but I don't think it's working.
@DexterHaven: The same can be asked of you. You are applying racial claims to these people and this incident.
A: how on earth would you know what their private beliefs are?
The same way you do apparently. Your assumption that they are racists is as valid as my assumption that they aren't.
B: Racism, or any other ideological position, doesn't function overtly. Most of us are unaware of our own prejudices.
Exactly. Real racists don't go around promoting it. Much less produce multipage photo shoots in international magazines touting that racism.
C: Nobody has suggested that the editors of Vogue 'are racists'.
Ok, lets say hypothetically that's true. So then what you are saying is that the the images are racist instead. No actual person is, just the pictures. Talk about a strawman argument.
You and others on this board will never concede any of my points as it gets in the way of you politically correct agenda. No one ever actually wants to discuss race. You just want to bludgeon the other side into submission in hopes of them just going away. That does nothing to actually help resolve the race issues in the world.
I can only assume you would have made equally as forceful an arguement for Tawana Brawley, or the Duke Lacrosse "victim", up to the point where they were both proven to be liars. You much like the professors at Duke who condemned the entire team immediately, see race first and no further discussion is warranted. And god help the person that does. They are obviously (moronic, deficient, dense, witless, dim, foolish, brainless, half-witted, idiotic, shortsighted, simple, slow, sluggish, thick, imbecilic, unintelligent, insert your own...) Although I have to admit being called Tom Cruise is a new one. Kudos for that. #vogueblackface
11/09/09
It's Dan Brown syndrome. It's easier to hate on someone who seems no more talented than you are. #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
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11/10/09
Now, it's one thing to co-opt the word "bitch" if you're describing a woman who doesn't subject herself to the patriarchal standards of what a nice girl should be. That's very different than conforming to most of society's rules (torturing yourself and others in order to stay thin is very, very conventional), and just being a bad person while doing it. If someone is only destructive to themselves, they have my sympathy. But when they start being destructive to others, and doing it proudly, there needs to be some negative reinforcement from the world at large. NOT a book deal. #mireilleguiliano
11/10/09
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11/09/09
There should be a special circle of hell for that. Maybe it's circle 5.5 (between wrath and heresy). #mireilleguiliano
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11/09/09
Sounds like Giuliano's got a case of the Hillary Clintons--hated for stupid reasons people would never hate a man for. #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
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11/09/09
And I swear I'm not a smug TV non-owner.
11/09/09
Not trying to say nobody would ever hate a man for being smug, but I'm saying that she faced certain criticisms that men do not.
I was going on the reasons sadie gave for people disliking her based on "smugness," etc rather than a substantial reason which is much of the criticism hillary faced and faces. So i think the comparison still stands. #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
Snark snark snark. Hate observations like this. #mireilleguiliano
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11/09/09
Americans don't like being unfavorably compared with the French, period. #mireilleguiliano
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11/09/09
There, if French women read that (translated, naturellement), they'll get fat. #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
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11/09/09
That being said, I like her writing style, and most of what she says is sound - don't eat when you're bored, take a half-hour walk everyday, etc. - but I'm still a little baffled that she's managed to construct an empire around what strikes me as little more than common sense. #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
I'm thinking of writing a whole series of books based on the awesomesness that is Canadian women.
Hmmm. What kind of BS would sell? Canadian Women Don't Get Bored? Canadian Women Don't Wear Uggs? #mireilleguiliano
11/09/09
11/09/09
10/14/09
And I don't think the "But we're French!" excuse flies anymore. It's not like France is hermetically sealed off from the rest of the world or doesn't have its own racial problems. I'm sorry to say that from my perspective, Europeans seem to be behind Americans in terms of racial sensitivity. I still clearly remember the slanty eyes pictures of the Spanish Olympic basketball team and the repeated, lame Berlusconi jokes about the Obamas being "tanned." Both of those were excused as instances of cultural ignorance, usually accompanied by a "hey, it was a joke you PC Americans. Lighten up!"
Ugh.
10/14/09
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10/14/09
The shoot is apparently intended to be arty, to be edgy; fine. But it feels cheap and attention-seeking, and the lack of non-white models in the rest of the issue suggests that the editors are actually the opposite of edgy - they are just lazy and conservative.
10/14/09
10/14/09
10/14/09
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10/14/09
As I mentioned in the first story about this, racism does not exist on its own. It is an intent. There is no way there was intent here. Brown paint on white skin is not in and of itself a minstrel show, and it does not inherently make the pictures racist. So by the logic of the detractors on the board, no one is ever allowed to wear white robes anymore just because the Klan does? Or is it the pointy hats that make them racists? The people involved in this are not racists. So the pics cant be either.
The most disturbing thing about this is that if they had used a black model wearing white paint in the spread, this article and these discussions would not even exist. Everyone here that is offended by this would be appeased by that simple tit for tat. And for anyone to think that actual racism could be resolved so easily is dangerous. If your resolution to "racism" can be resolved that simply, then it wasn't real in the first place. And please spare me the forth coming "I didn't say that would appease me" line. Its the truth, and if you're being honest with us and yourself you know it is.
10/14/09
10/14/09
10/14/09
10/14/09
10/15/09
A: how on earth would you know what their private beliefs are?
The same way you do apparently. Your assumption that they are racists is as valid as my assumption that they aren't.
B: Racism, or any other ideological position, doesn't function overtly. Most of us are unaware of our own prejudices.
Exactly. Real racists don't go around promoting it. Much less produce multipage photo shoots in international magazines touting that racism.
C: Nobody has suggested that the editors of Vogue 'are racists'.
Ok, lets say hypothetically that's true. So then what you are saying is that the the images are racist instead. No actual person is, just the pictures. Talk about a strawman argument.
You and others on this board will never concede any of my points as it gets in the way of you politically correct agenda. No one ever actually wants to discuss race. You just want to bludgeon the other side into submission in hopes of them just going away. That does nothing to actually help resolve the race issues in the world.
I can only assume you would have made equally as forceful an arguement for Tawana Brawley, or the Duke Lacrosse "victim", up to the point where they were both proven to be liars. You much like the professors at Duke who condemned the entire team immediately, see race first and no further discussion is warranted. And god help the person that does. They are obviously (moronic, deficient, dense, witless, dim, foolish, brainless, half-witted, idiotic, shortsighted, simple, slow, sluggish, thick, imbecilic, unintelligent, insert your own...) Although I have to admit being called Tom Cruise is a new one. Kudos for that. #vogueblackface