lesenfantsdeboches

posts about #lesenfantsdeboches more →
Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure

Your version of Internet Explorer is not supported. Please upgrade to the most recent version in order to view comments.

Dsmvwl Admin Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×

bowleserised
07/11/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
Le Silence de la Mere
Reply

bowleserised was starred bowleserised was unstarred

LikeALady
07/10/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
Shorn Women by Fabrice Virgili is a great historical treatment on the topic of how women were treated after Liberation. I did my thesis on a similar topic and I found that "female collaboration" was seen as a mostly sexual thing, as few women were in a position to participate in political or ideological collaboration so they were judged on a sexual basis, regardless of whether or not they actually had sexual relations with a German soldier. The official definitions of collaboration had been limited to actions that were often pursued in masculine realms (politics, for example) yet women were also punished on gendered terms by society and even by the law. By "fraternizing" with the enemy while their own country was being occupied, while their men were in POW or labor camps, was demeaning to French male honor and Les Tondues, as the shorn women were called, represented the re-establishment of male authority and hierarchy.

Yeah, disgusting. I know I'm supposed to maintain a historian's unbiased analysis of historical events but whatever- a spade is a spade.
Reply

LikeALady was starred LikeALady was unstarred

midwestdesigner
07/10/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
It never ceases to amaze me how narrow humans' views can be. Right after a war where classes of people were blamed for being traitors and "bad" Germans, where they were ostracized by having their appearance altered (stars, etc.) and being publicly shamed, the French ... do the exact same thing. Those who forget history ...
Reply

midwestdesigner was starred midwestdesigner was unstarred

BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit)
07/10/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
This is so sad. And the public shaving/shaming of the women? Terrible. It's not as if these were equal partnerships by any stretch of the imagination, even if genuine feelings were involved.
Reply

Laulau
07/10/09

@BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs....: Who is that poem by - Louis Aragon? I tried to find it. I thought it was so beautiful because, even as a French man who lived through the war, he was ashamed of the way the German soldiers' French lovers were treated afterwards.
Reply

Laulau was starred Laulau was unstarred

RubberBiscuit
07/10/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
Oooh watched something similar by the BBC but about Norway's Nazi Secrets... which are essentially that there is a large population of Norwegian with German Nazi fathers. In fact, the brunette from ABBA is one of these children (but she was smuggled out to Sweden before the wrath really came down). The documentary shocked me... the women that had birthed these children were abused and assaulted. The children were taken from their mothers and declared mentally handicapped and placed in mental institutions. I can hardly imagine anything more traumatizing than all that. They sued the government and lost, but that was back in the 90s. Not sure what the situation is now.
Reply

RubberBiscuit was starred RubberBiscuit was unstarred

eri401
07/10/09

In reply to Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure
This is extremely common in any war situation, especially if it is cross-racial. There is a wealth of scholarship on American GI's Mme Butterflying scores of women in Japan, Vietnam and Korea where their biracial children were quite visibly rejected. Even "war brides" of GIs were typically shunned by other immigrant communities because they are/were perceived to be traitorous and of low class (and assumed to be prostitutes). I didn't realize this carried on for so long between European countries too. Aside from being told that you are half-French and half-German, would anyone know? Forgive my ignorance but it is not like it is readable on your skin to the degree it is for bi-racial children, no?
Reply

eri401 was starred eri401 was unstarred

Bohoinparadise
07/10/09

@eri401: What you wrote about war brides reminds me of my middle school math teacher. He served during the Korean War and married a Korean woman when he got back to US. He used to tell my class that his marriage was considered invaild is some states. I don't remember all of them but him and his wife were not welcomed in some of the southern states.
Reply

Bohoinparadise was starred Bohoinparadise was unstarred

eri401
07/10/09

@Bohoinparadise:

That is very sad...and a common story it seems around the world.

My father told me that when he was a new immigrant to the US, his Korean church had a number of "war brides" in the congregations. My father said their situation was very sad because many of the other Korean-Americans did not want to associate with them and the women could not return to Korea due to even WORSE stigma. My father-in-law joined the US army after he immigrated and my mother-in-law remembers that there were so many Asian wives married to the American GIs and there WAS a class/racial tension between those women and herself.

Reply

eri401 was starred eri401 was unstarred

Earlier discussions Other discussions Show all discussions Show featured discussions only Start a new discussion

#lesenfantsdeboches

Jezebel

SUBSCRIBE TO Jezebel

Enfants Terribles: French Children Of German Soldiers Seek Closure

Login

Reset Password

Register

Submit Your Comment