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Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work

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rhymeswithfeather
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
BAAAAAAHHHH MY ROOMMATE CALLS EVERYTHING 'GAY' IN A DEROGATORY WAY. She is 25 years old, and even has gay friends, but no matter HOW many times I pull out the "dude, NOT cool to say that" lecture, she just doesn't get it.

Sample conversation:

Roommate: Omg, I fucking hate my ex-boyfriend, he's so gay.

Heather: YOU CAN'T SAY THAT.

Roommate: Oops. I mean, he's such a FAG.

This conversation happened, word for work, and there was not even a trace of irony.
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Hiroine Protagonist
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
Oh dear, I watched that clip three times (missed it last night - wuz boning) and I am caught in a disconnect:

Marge: "Let's go on a family OUTING"
Bart: "Lisa is gay"

Isn't Bart therefore OUTING Lisa - although not really? Are they subtly joking about those who lecture people about using the term gay as a pejorative? I dunno.
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gobblegirl
03/09/09

@Hiroine Protagonist: No, I really don't think so. South Park would do that, Simpsons wouldn't. Yeah, Bart's not saying "oh, that's so gay," he is saying she's gay as a way to make fun of her. She's not lecturing him about using the word gay as a synonym for "not good." She's saying "so what if I were gay? It's not a bad thing."
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Hiroine Protagonist
03/09/09

@gobblegirl: No, I know, it's just that he says it right after Marge says "family outing."
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Maulleigh
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
That is pretty cool. I gotta say she's a better feminist than I am sometimes.

I like that she's a feminist and totally into Malibu Stacey as I am a feminist and was really into Barbie. I even joined the fan club in the fifth grade.
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erinoherin
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
i was walking down the hallway with a lesbian friend of mine in high school when we overheard two freshman boys talking about lacrosse tryouts and one of them called it gay.

so my friend is really intimidating...but especially so, i would imagine for these boys. she wheeled around and said "OH MY GOD. are they forcing you to have sex with the other boys at lacrosse tryouts?!" they were insanely flustered and didnt know what to say to this scary senior girl so they just stuttered and she said "oh okay, well i guess if thats what your into, thats cool. its pretty brave of you to be so open about it."

and walked away. it was BRILLIANT.
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Hana Maru, used up old slutbag on the pole
03/09/09

@erinoherin: That's awesome.
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ALEXANDRA_SUPERTRAMP
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
Wasn't Sappho not actually a lesbian, she just wrote poetry about lesbians? I thought she killed herself over a man, or something.

Still cool though.
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prestocaro fears the culling
03/09/09

@ALEXANDRA_SUPERTRAMP: She was from the isle of lesbos, so she's a lesbian, right?
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Cam/ron
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
It was a pretty cool scene in an episode that was timely in a very eerie way. Its deciption of how many foreclosures happened was dead-on.
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Artemisia999
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
I also hate the word "awesome" when used to describe EVERYTHING!!! Come on, expand your vocabulary!! You are NOT a teenage boy!!
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kimbert
03/09/09

@Artemisia999: Ummm... That was me, sorry. I describe everything as "awesome". I used to use "neat", but then I was accused of being stuck in a 1950's timewarp. So now I use awesome, because the eighties were way more awesome than the 00's.
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gobblegirl
03/09/09

@kimbertly1: Radical!
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CDarklock
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
I've always thought calling something "gay" was intended to be ironic - rather than displaying the actual homophobic attitudes of schoolchildren, you're deliberately mocking your own negative opinion as being a silly and childish thing to think.

Yeah, I know, that's gay.
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Beat Girl
03/09/09

@CDarklock: It usually isn't said be people who are genuinely homophobic, in my experience. I don't think anyone is saying that, but it's the connotations it carries and passes on by its usage in this form. Also, irony is fucking lazy hipster nonsense, imho.
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prestocaro fears the culling
03/09/09

@CDarklock: I started saying "gay" as a joke and now it's invaded my real pattern of speech. It is very hard to stop and I frequently have to correct myself, but think of it this way: if people used other pejorative terms ironically, do they still offend?

"I can call black people niggers because I'm not really racist, I mean it ironically"

"well, I know that person with Downs feels bad, but calling him/her a retard was tongue in cheek"

"I respect your culture; I'm just joking when I call you a wetback"

Doesn't really work for me. Maybe it works for you.
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Hana Maru, used up old slutbag on the pole
03/09/09

@CDarklock: Are you gay? Because that's the only way it's ironic when you say it. Otherwise you're just brandishing your straight privilege with no regard for the out and closeted gay people around you. It's not irony to take a lighthearted approach to denigrating language.
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Andalucía
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
Now, if they can do something for "girly" I'd be in heaven. I hate it.

I was so pissed as a kid when I figured out that my very existence was an insult (e.g., "little girl").
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Hana Maru, used up old slutbag on the pole
03/09/09

@Andalucía: "Girly" "You're being a girl/woman" "You____ like a girl/woman" are everywhere. I once broke up with a guy after his friend teased him by calling him a woman and he was all "OMG worst insult ever!" right in front of me, and with no trace of irony. I start hating whomever says that shit.
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sunoftheskye
03/09/09

@HanaMaru: Reminds me of an episode of Judge Alex or maybe Judge Mathis about a dispute between two ex-roommates, and the defendant said his reasoning for leaving was that his roommate was too much like a woman.

I thought to myself...why would that be a bad thing? Aren't females typically cleaner, less rambunctious, and more responsible?
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Hana Maru, used up old slutbag on the pole
03/09/09

@sunoftheskye: OMG. The flip side of that is how men and woman can be complimented by being associated with manliness "You took it like a man" "Manned up and did the right thing" "You've got balls" "One of the boys"(another great reason to hate Katy Perry)
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Beat Girl
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
On a related note, why won't people own up to the fact that when they are saying this sort of thing, it's largely because they're afraid of homosexuality?

I can't begin to express my confusion about the fact that there are still people in the world afraid to catch THE GAY.
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Rocket Queen
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
List of gay heroes: FREDDIE MERCURY
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budholly101
03/09/09

@Rocket Queen: Oh Freddie Mercury! Anyone who knows me for any amount of time knows of my passion for Freddie. I will go to my grave regretting that I was too young to have ever seen him in concert. My dad did, and I'm so jealous.
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Beat Girl
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
I absolutely cannot stand this use of gay. It pains me to explain at length why it is offensive to me, and yet I have had to do it numerous times.

It shouldn't, but it pains me all the more to have done it to many young gay people too.
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yvanehtnioj
03/09/09

@Miss Carrie Nation: I used to work at a youth shelter. Every time a kid used "gay" or "retarded", I'd have to go through the whole thing.

"What, it's really happy? / Oh, it's developmentally disabled?"
"Oh, then why use that word?"
"Thanks, I think that's a better choice."

The kids generally thought I was a nice person, so they'd adjust their language around me. Honestly, I felt like my biggest accomplishment there was when a new kid used "retarded" on his first day and a kid that had been there longer said "We don't use that word here." Small victories.
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Beat Girl
03/09/09

@yvanehtnioj: Oh, that's lovely! I usually just say "Don't use that word, please. Or at least not around me to mean bad. Thanks". But it NEVER rests at that, they always need a reason. I think I'd feel better if it were kids, but it's always 20-somethings. Sigh!
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Liz11685
03/09/09

@yvanehtnioj: I use retarded, and blame it on my Boston upbringing, where "retahhhded" flows like water. I am trying to use these tactics on MYSELF. It really is a small victory when people stop using pejorative terms.
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ellaesther
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
...aaaannnnd cue lawsuit from the Schultz estate in 3... 2... 1....
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NefariousNewt
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
Remember when the word "gay" meant "happy?" Of course, back then women couldn't vote, Jim Crow laws were everywhere, and they banned liquor, but hey!!!
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kelsium
03/09/09

@NefariousNewt: Oh, and homosexuality was classified as a mental illness in the DSM.
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Liz11685
03/09/09

@NefariousNewt: I grew up on Gay Street, and we always said it meant happy!!
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prestocaro fears the culling
03/09/09

@Liz11685: There is a Gay car dealership in Dickenson, TX (near the town I live in). It's owned by an older lady, her last name is Gay.

[www.gaypontiacbuickgmc.com]

It makes me laugh because what if there were gay dealerships, like how there are gay bars?
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westvillagegirl (exiled in chicago)
03/09/09

In reply to Lisa Simpson On Why "Gay" As An Insult Doesn't Work
I'm know I might be failing as a feminazi bonerkiller, but who is pictured in the second photo? She looks like a badass. I can't listen to the video, and how does one google an image?
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Dadadarling
03/09/09

@westvillagegirl (exiled in chicago): Susan Sontag
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arodriguez.romero
03/09/09

@westvillagegirl (exiled in chicago): figure out how to google an image and you'll be richer than Bill Gates
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arodriguez.romero
03/09/09

@westvillagegirl (exiled in chicago):and it's Susan Sontag btw
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arodriguez.romero
03/09/09

@Dadadarling: whoops sorry dept. of redundancy dept.
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