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Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns

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sangmo
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Someone should demand the resignation of all the white male supreme court judges resign from ALL their exclusive white male clubs - which probably includes various social and recreational clubs.
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lolacat
06/21/09

@sangmo: Sitting Justices and most Federal judges have lifetime tenure- they don't give a shit what you think. And, they police themselves. Which usually means they are rarely reprimanded unless their actions have caused a great deal of embarrassment to the judiciary and the profession- like they are about to be indicted for racketeering or such.
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Neopatra
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
The entire Republican party can just shut the fuck up.

For eight years they held absolute control over this country: a majority in the House, a majority in the Senate, and a Republican Administration that had no qualms about running this country as a dictatorship. If they had lived up to their own delusional line of PR, they would have turned this country into the most perfect Utopia the earth has ever seen. But they didn't. Far from it. They turned the USA into a big sucking black hole of corruption and economic collapse so severe that it took a big chunk of the rest of the world with it.

The right wing had it's chance and they screwed it up to an historically unsurpassed degree. They can all just shut the fuck up and slink away in shame.
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Jenloveshercurves
06/21/09

@Neopatra: A protestant might want to take communion if they are a part of a Catholic service and are a part of the community of believers in Christ at the service. As someone who is not Catholic but went to seven years of Catholic higher education and was a cantor in the chapel choir for three of those years, it was fairly sad to not be able to be in full "community" with my religious "community" at the time. I believe in Jesus' death on the cross, I'm good enough to Protestant up the place with my Protestant vocal cords, but having to constantly explain to people why I wasn't taking communion was pretty sad, especially when you tell that to the Archbishop after he talks to you about what a wonderful gift you have vocally for the church and then ask why you didn't take communion. Blech. I feel better in Protestant churches where I'm not asked to selectively exclude myself, usually.
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Sister Toldja
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Very sad, but I respect that Sotomayor is willing to make this shit happen. Sorry she had to leave what sounds like a dope club.

On behalf of ACTUAL bohemians, I am ashamed that there is a old boys club using our name! Do you burn incense, listen to indie music and wear thrift store clothes? THEN YOU ARE NOT A BOHO, HO!

I would like to be the sort of woman who gets asked to be in the Belizian Club when I am of age.
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GreySunsh
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
I have to imagine that previous justices have belonged to a sorority or fraternity -- can someone explain how that's different from this?
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lolacat
06/20/09

@GreySunsh: Because I am an idiot, I replied about two posts up?
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samethingwedoeverynightpinky
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
So I assume no republican in government was ever a member of a fraternity?
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ihateyourescalade
06/20/09

@samethingwedoeverynightpinky: My guess is that there's a difference between an organization one belonged to in college and an organization one currently belongs to as an adult.
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Sister Toldja
06/20/09

@ihateyourescalade: Fraternities and sororites are often times membership orgs. Whether you are active or not is one thing. All of the major Black Greek letter orgs have grad chapters and people may join after college. And I think PKA and "Tri-Delt" have alumni chapters.

Many Black politicans are Greek and I know a lot of White male ones are Pikes.
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Sister Toldja
06/20/09

@Sister Toldja: Meant to say "lifetime membership orgs".
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foodandshoes
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
What about all those MEN who were in organizations like Skull and Bones, and all manner of secret societies that helped their members out? That's not Affirmative Action at all.

Fuck you, dudes.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@foodandshoes: I think Skull & Bones has more to do with inherited wealth and position, nepotism, and generally "seeing to their own kind". It is hard to keep people like the Bush's out of office when they have the means to run campaigns the way the American citizenry expects a campaign to be run. With money and influence.
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foodandshoes
06/20/09

@lolacat: That's my point. It's not AA when it's the old boys club. It's just the way things "should be." Those guys are assholes.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@GreySunsh: One, a fraternity or a sorority was a past membership. Much like the Girl Scouts and the Boy Scouts. A group that is more about socialization of the young and, presumably, good works. If we took it to its lowest denominator, you could object on the basis of playing sports that do not allow the opposite sex.

Whizzer White played foootball and was an asshole, okay-not a good example. (kidding)

Anyway, the point is to ensure that we have Justices who are capable of being able to judge a case fresh upon its merits. Thus, current membership plays a larger role than former membership. The depth of that membership- are we talking a sorority 40 years ago or a club they resigned yesterday. And finally, what kind of membership are we talking about? A sorority that may have been more about peer acceptance and blood drives (and perhaps some general bitchery) or youth klansmember. There is a difference, as anyone with common sense can tell, between a club that betrays a real belief and one joined for the extra-curriculars and/or booze.

While it seems stupid to decry a club about women and for women, the polar oppsite cannot be abided. Just like someone said earlier, we can't have clubs for the promotion and advancement of white men. That is why she had to resign.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@lolacat: Whoops! I reliped in the wrong place. Sorry.
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foodandshoes
06/20/09

@lolacat: That's why I focused on eating clubs and secret societies. They're not like fraternities in that their main focus is for the alumni. They exist to help the members along in their life and until very recently have been extremely exclusionary.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@foodandshoes: I agree with you on Skull & Bones. Those clubs have a way of being divisive and having less than acceptable motives. They are more about social advancement for those already blessed with wealth and agenda. It's just impossible to say that W. was advanced by his membership in any way when his birth pretty much put him in a position of power. It reminds me of the "reverse discrimination" brou-haha that Sotomayor already stirred up. It's only wrong (or as Carrie Prejean would call it- opposite)when you are discriminating against the great white male and his harpoon.
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samethingwedoeverynightpinky
06/20/09

@foodandshoes: But most people remain active in their fraternities and sororities as adults, attending annual events, organizing community activities, heading the national boards, networking, etc etc. I am more familiar with black and latina sororities, but those are lifetime memberships for a lot of people, even if you join in college. There are a lot of grown women walking around DC greeting eachother as soror and rocking their pink and green or whatever.
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Brigit
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Well, obviously an all-female social group is always planning to take over the world, subjugating teh poor menz, and making them do house chores.
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Snowbunny
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Today in dbags ruining people's days news:
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lolacat
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Y'all it is about the "appearance of impropriety". It does not matter if her organization actually is sexist (in that it only accepts one gender) or that there should be a carve-out for organizations for women (there should not- not for Supreme Court Justices).

She must not belong to any organization which makes her appear biased. Granted, Antonin Scalia has been a crappy example for the last several years but an incoming Supreme Court Justice should be put to this standard- male or female.
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Trulymadlyme
06/20/09

@lolacat: Yep. Kennedy had to do the same exact thing during his confirmation process. So, I'm not surprised in the least that she quit.

An interesting thing is the mere existence of this and its male equivalent. I wonder the whole collective of powerful people actually meeting and somehow coordinating their group think is a good or bad thing. I need a tell all!
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mama_t
06/20/09

@lolacat: Not disagreeing with you, but on a slightly related topic, did you ever see the Boston Legal with the Supreme Court? From the transcript:

"Alan Shore: Let's consider your respective Senate confirmations. You all testified under oath that you never actually considered how you would rule on abortion. You must be kidding me! Never gave it a thought? No perjury there? Justice Scalia? You went duck hunting with Vice President Cheney while he was a named defendant in a case before this court. Congratulations on not getting shot, by the way, but you didn't exactly avoid the appearance of impropriety there? Justice Alito? You were caught hearing a case involving a company you'd invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in. Ha! No conflict of interest there? You also don't recuse yourself in terrorism cases even though your best friend is Michael Chernov, head of Homeland Security? Seems to me the Supreme Court of the United States should be made of sterner stuff. Am I right? Justice Thomas? At least put down the magazine!"

I know it's just TV... but I wish that we were more worried about the real biases and less worried about the perception of artificial ones. Also, this was a good episode :)
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lolacat
06/20/09

@mama_t: As a point of pendantic education (ignore this if you like), Scalia's real problem (aside from being an issues-douchebag, of course) is his willingness to discuss his personal views. Sitting Justices and smart judges do not take a lot of speaking engagements and when they do they tend to refrain from commenting upon current legal and political issues. Scalia, on the other hand, feels justified running around the world telling everyone that he believes Roe v. Wade was decided wrongly and that the pledge of allegiance is a prayer (or whatever he feels at at a moment) That is his appearance of impropriety- that he has biases and has pre-judged legal cases. It takes years for a case to hit the Supremes and not a lot of brains to know what cases will likely be before the court in ten years. So everyone has a fair idea of what is headed uphill for decision. His "pre-judging" is his way of telling the world he will not judge a case upon its merits because he has already reviewed the actual case or similar cases and decided his judgment.

Scalito's problem is mainly his past judicial record. Which has a lot of less than sterling behavior and captured.

Thomas. Poor Thomas. Appearing on the cover of People Magazine will forever haunt him. My law professor used to call him Scalia's butt-boy.

As for being friends with Washington politico's.... well, that is a harder decision. The goold old days where a Justice willingly became a hermit is in the past and I have yet to blame them for friendships they hold outside of the court. Scalia's shame was that he accepted a free duck-hunting trip paid for by special interests at a time when Dick Cheney's administration was before the Court.
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ihateyourescalade
06/20/09

@lolacat: I agree with you. And yet, that the Republicans are the ones questioning whether she appears improper is the height of hypocrisy.
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bluewine
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
The GOP is just absurd. I wish we didn't have to pretend that every little thing they have a fit over is legitimate, and I wish we didn't have to justify those fits with stuff like this.
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ihateyourescalade
06/20/09

@bluewine: Hearted.
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pssshwhatever
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
This continues to baffle me. So, are there no members of the federal judiciary that are also members of Augusta National Golf Club? Because I find that hard to believe. Or any number of similarly snooty Good Ol' Boy organizations that actively deny Teh Wimmins. Lord knows, Republican man are SO AGAINST things like that.
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BowlingForDollars
06/20/09

@pssshwhatever: I was just gonna say that.

Sometimes I wish Dems would get as nasty as Republicans and call out those muthafuckers on their hypocrisy.
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MizJenkins
06/20/09

In reply to Sotomayor Formally Resigns From Women's Club Due To Republican Concerns
Presumably the ethics code has a carve-out for actual established religions right?
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lolacat
06/20/09

@MizJenkins: Not so much a "carve-out" but a freedom of religion. So a member of the Court may belong to a Temple or a parish church - which would be exclusive to members of the same religion. Not so much about exclusivity rather than worshipping together.
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vamusical
06/20/09

@MizJenkins: Which makes me think, Catholicism denies communion based on beliefs, why wouldn't belonging to a Catholic church mean you belong to an organization that discrimnates based on religion? Not to pick on Catholics, I'm sure plenty of faiths have catches like this, this was just the first I thought of.
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drinkyrose
06/20/09

@vamusical: Well, every church (Catholic or otherwise) I've ever been to was happy to have guests, so it isn't like they bar the door if you don't meet some sort of qualification. Certain sacraments, etc, are reserved for members of the religion. In a Catholic mass, when you get communion, the priest doesn't ask you, "Are you Catholic? Have you been to confession? Are you in a state of grace?" They use the honor system and don't turn anyone away, so a non-Catholic *could* get away with taking communion. (Why they'd want to, I don't know. But they could.)

What any of this has to do with Miz Jenkins' question, I'm not sure. Either way, religions enjoy a special status here in the States. If it were a religious group that isn't recognized by the gov. (didn't have tax exempt status, etc), it would probably be an issue.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@drinkyrose: Also, how could you receive "communion" if you didn't believe in communion? Eat some bread, drink some wine - it wouldn't be communion.

Anyway, holding a church as an example of why membership should bar you from government employment would be a violation of the Establishment Clause.
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vamusical
06/20/09

@drinkyrose: Well yes, it's not quite the same level in terms of denying membership, but the fact that it's so unquestionable shows, as you said, the special status religion gets here.

@lolacat: The beliefs I was referring to were not whether or not you "believe in communion", but what communion represents, i.e. as a Protestant I would be denied communion because I don't believe in transubstantiation.
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lolacat
06/20/09

@vamusical: I wasn't trying to be overly picky here just showing that Church, in this country, does have a unique status in this country. Yes, Church has a "special status" but it is one based upon genuine belief (my point with the communion remark) rather than simple membership. Ideally, church membership represented all sorts of factors outside the membership. I assume it would be a jerkwad move to do the full history lesson but the exclusion of church membership from government scrutiny was actually a bold and spectacular move that is a dynamic element in this country and helped it become better than it would be otherwise.
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