insurance - Jezebel

posts about #insurance more →
More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
How Do You Balance Your Health And Your Checkbook?
Making It Legal
Dying To Be Thin
Emotionally Retarded Hubbies Are Nothing New

Your version of Internet Explorer is not supported. Please upgrade to the most recent version in order to view comments.

Dsmvwl Admin Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×

sydbarrettsaves, emissary of hell
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
Go Patty Murray! She's from my state.
Reply

msAnthrope
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
doesn't anybody understand? the goal of insurance companies is to find a way to prove everybody has something that can be categorized as a "pre-existing condition."

honestly i'd love if everybody in the u.s. just cancelled their insurance policies on the same day. now let's negotiate.
Reply

Edited by msAnthrope at 10/05/09 4:22 PM msAnthrope was starred msAnthrope was unstarred

steph3280
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
My insurance handler told me I would be denied insurance because I was in treatment for substance abuse last year. He basically advised me to lie on my application, telling me that they wouldn't check up on it unless I had some sort of relapse. If that happened, my policy would just be voided for lying--no restitution or anything.

The really screwed up part is that if I hadn't sought treatment, I would be insured...but I would probably be almost dead.
Reply

Lymed promoted this comment steph3280 was starred steph3280 was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@steph3280: Your broker makes money when you enroll. Him telling you to lie insurance fraud. I know there have been legislators looking to stop restitution, but even if there is a law against it, if you knowingly commit fraud they could probably still go after you to pay past claims.

I'd contact your state or county and see if there are any local programs for people with pre-existing conditions. Some states have insurance pools for people with pre-ex conditions but they are often very expensive.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

traumamama
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
Sigh. I just KNEW Oklahoma would be on this list....

As a paramedic and RN, I was required to ask patients, especially female, specific questions about domestic violence when I was doing direct patient care. Now, I see I probably just fucked up their insurance coverage forever. Nice.
Reply

Crackers In Bed promoted this comment traumamama was starred traumamama was unstarred

kittenlove
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
I read an article about this subject over the weekend. There are actually 8 states, according to the article, which allow this to happen. One of them happens to be the state I live in, Wyoming, which has a fairly high domestic violence rate. I don't understand the insurance companies' position and think this is utterly appalling. And I can't believe I live in a state that does that.
Reply

Crackers In Bed promoted this comment kittenlove was starred kittenlove was unstarred

Schrodinger's Cat
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
I knew this would happen! I knew it as soon as you told me that a computer model had been developed to determine how likely it is that abuse is to blame for what ails you.

Now, they'll start classifying weird injuries/ailments inside of categories in this "map."

"I have a migraine headache... can you honestly call that paranoid schizophrenia? I'm not the victim of domestic violence!!!"
Reply

Lymed promoted this comment Schrodinger's Cat was starred

Lymed
10/05/09

@Schrodinger's Cat: This isn't new. I found a study referencing insurance companies having these policies in 1994.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

Maulleigh
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
With that logic (bear with me here), ski accidents are a "pre-existing" condition. I have to let the insurance company know that I leave the house and engage in dangerous pursuits. I use knives to cook, too.
Reply

Maulleigh was starred Maulleigh was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@Maulleigh: If you injured yourself in a ski accident then it is a pre-existing condition.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

Aesop's Foibles. YES.
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
*goes back to bed*
Reply

shorty63136
10/05/09

@Aesop's Foibles. YES.: Seriously. I can't even...

Just...

No.
Reply

shorty63136 was starred shorty63136 was unstarred

LaComtesse
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
My mom sent me this news item weeks ago under the subject line "What the fuckity fuck?"
Reply

LaComtesse was starred LaComtesse was unstarred

BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit)
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
The road to hell is paved with insurance executives.
Reply

OneBigPear
10/05/09

@BrutallyHonestBabes (aka Mrs. Sarah.of.a.Lesser.Hobbit): They do seem to be the new evil (see previous evil: lawyers).
Reply

Lymed promoted this comment OneBigPear was starred OneBigPear was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@OneBigPear: Want to understand the true evil of insurance executives? Lawyers were never evil. The insurance companies just convinced you they were so they could blame malpractice cases for increasing medical costs.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

OneBigPear
10/05/09

@Lymed: Oooooh! That IS evil.
Reply

OneBigPear was starred OneBigPear was unstarred

morninggloria
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
Insurance is ass-cancer of capitalism.
Reply

morninggloria was starred morninggloria was unstarred

OldEnough2BYourMama
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
There have been a series of articles in the Chicago Tribune on pre-existing conditions nightmares which basically detailed how insurance companies will comb through your medical files and find something/anything they can use as a basis to deny coverage for a high cost treatment. Even if that something is unrelated to the condition for which you are seeking coverage. (A youg girl who was diagnosed with celiac disease was denied coverage for all of the testing required to diagnose her because they found she had a history of headaches.) Anyone who thinks this country doesn't need healthcare reform is in denial.
Reply

onestrawplz promoted this comment

hilikusopus
10/05/09

@OldEnough2BYourMama: Denial is a symptom of depression, and depression is a preexisting condition. Nothing we can do here, move along.
Reply

MissyMcCLung promoted this comment hilikusopus was starred hilikusopus was unstarred

sequined
10/05/09

@OldEnough2BYourMama: There's a segment on a recent-ish This American Life about that, too. The legislature is/was holding hearings with insurance execs because they think insurance companies deliberately make their forms too complicated for the average person to fill out properly, SO THAT when you need coverage they can find an "error" and deny your claims.
Reply

sequined was starred sequined was unstarred

remedios
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
The article said that states don't prohibit defining domestic violence as a pre-existing condition. I didn't see any indication that insurance companies are doing that.
Reply

mariamariamaria promoted this comment remedios was starred remedios was unstarred

mariamariamaria
10/05/09

@remedios: I would be curious to know if any company would do this. I've never seen it, but I've only ever administered employer sponsored plans which tend to be fair (and expensive). In any case, how would the insurance company know? There is no diagnosis code for domestic violence as far as I know.
Reply

mariamariamaria was starred mariamariamaria was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@remedios: I did a little search and it looks like some insurance companies do that. Although not recent, I saw references to studies in 1994 and 1998 that found specific insurance companies with such policies and at least one specific instance of denial of coverage.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: If there's a police report, there's a record of DV.
Reply

DutchessOfDork
10/05/09

@remedios: [politifact.com]
Reply

DutchessOfDork was starred DutchessOfDork was unstarred

DramaClub
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: There are some DX codes that can be related to domestic violence in the V61 series. They are related to family disruption. Also some counseling V-codes can indicate domestic violence in the medical record.
Reply

mariamariamaria promoted this comment DramaClub was starred DramaClub was unstarred

thePrototype
10/05/09

@remedios: I was just coming here to say the same thing. I would really like to see some statistics, or else this would be more like the 'well they didn't say there weren't going to be death panels' argument that conservatives like to drag out. That being said, as Lymed and DutchessofDork have pointed out it has happened and that is disgusting, but I don't think a handful of claims are going to sway any conservatives on how wonderful insurance companies are.
Reply

mariamariamaria promoted this comment thePrototype was starred thePrototype was unstarred

mariamariamaria
10/05/09

@Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat: True, but would the insurance company have access to it? They may once have, but since the implementation of HIPAA I would think that the insurance company couldn't access that kind of info. Not that I don't think insurance companies are shitty toward private policy owners, but breaking HIPAA laws is no joke.
Reply

Edited by mariamariamaria at 10/05/09 3:21 PM mariamariamaria was starred mariamariamaria was unstarred

mariamariamaria
10/05/09

@DramaClub: Well that sucks. I wonder if the companies who discriminated against victims of DV had the balls to spell it out in the Plan Document.
Reply

mariamariamaria was starred mariamariamaria was unstarred

DramaClub
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: Most likely they get caught in the umbrella of "pre-existing condition" during post-claim underwriting. There is so much information in the list of diagnoses and procedures. Most people would be shocked at how much of their dirty laundry can be encapsulated in an ICD-9 code.
Reply

DramaClub was starred DramaClub was unstarred

Penny_Esq
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: Even if there's not a diagnostic code, can the insurance company access your doctor's chart notes? Every time I've been to an ER or Urgency Care I've been asked whether I feel safe at home, which a nurse had to explain to me was a question about whether I was suffering abuse at home, because I was quite puzzled and thought she was maybe asking about whether I feared a home invasion because of the neighborhood I live in. All of which is to say, if I'd said "No, I don't feel safe at home," I think that would've gone into my chart notes.
Reply

Penny_Esq was starred Penny_Esq was unstarred

remedios
10/05/09

@DutchessOfDork: Thanks.

Consistent with what Lymed as well, some insurance companies were doing this in the 90s, but after legislation in many states, there hasn't been indication that they're currently doing it. But also, it's hard to get the reporting that would indicate this. I'm no HIPAA expert, but it seems that insurance companies should be required to report aggregate data. Are they prohibited by HIPAA from doing this? Still, it appears they stopped precisely because of state legislation. Perhaps the real evil are the state legislatures that haven't adopted similar laws.
Reply

remedios was starred remedios was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: HIPAA allows you to give people and institutions the right to see personal health information. You give the insurance company the right to access that information when you apply or enroll.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

DramaClub
10/05/09

@Penny_Esq: This would have triggered the provider to provide or offer counseling which would have one of those telling V-codes in your chart. The same thing happens when they ask you if you smoke. They usually offer smoking cessation counseling which adds one of the counseling V-codes and then they add "tobacco use disorder" to the list of your diagnoses.
Reply

mariamariamaria promoted this comment DramaClub was starred DramaClub was unstarred

mariamariamaria
10/05/09

@Lymed: True, however isn't the access limited to "need to know" information, i.e. private health information that is required to process the claim (doc's information, diagnosis codes, etc), but would that include a police report? I was wondering specifically about police reports that are tied to incidents that require medical attention. The report wouldn't be included in the medical record would it? And even if it was, is that info required to pay the claim? I suppose there must be diagnosis codes that must trigger further digging... sigh.
Reply

mariamariamaria was starred mariamariamaria was unstarred

Lymed
10/05/09

@mariamariamaria: Two things. When looking to get coverage, you may have to give your insurance company access to all past medical records or they may just guess and deny coverage because they believe you failed to disclose something. Individual insurance is very onerous compared to employer based.

The police report is not covered by HIPAA. I am guessing they don't find a police report, but somehow it comes up - whether it is suggested from past medical records or comes up in a conversation with the insurance company.
Reply

Lymed was starred Lymed was unstarred

thelastsara
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
Once more, with feeling: And people say there's nothing wrong with our health care system?!?!?
Reply

onestrawplz promoted this comment thelastsara was starred thelastsara was unstarred

redqueenmeg
10/05/09

In reply to More Proof Insurance Companies Are Evil
The great thing about this being a pre-existing condition is that abused women are already pre-conditioned not to push issues too far, so they'll probably just all accept it and we can increase shareholder value!

I felt dirty typing that.
Reply

redqueenmeg was starred redqueenmeg was unstarred

Earlier discussions Other discussions Show all discussions Show featured discussions only Start a new discussion