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Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
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EsmereldaFitzmonster
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
Did they consider the fact that high-anxiety women might overstate their happiness? If someone's being negative to her boyfriend in an attempt to complete the task on time, they might also be the type to create an illusion of perfection that isn't necessarily there. Just a thought.
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clevernamehere
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
One idea keeps popping up on this thread that really bothers me. Its the idea that if a woman is borderline emotional abusive to a man, it is his fault for not being enough of a challenge.

Obviously, everyone has the responsibility to look out for themselves but just because someone is more passive doesn't mean that its okay to treat them badly. If the genders were reversed I doubt so many Jezebels would be saying it is a woman's fault that her boyfriend is a bit of a dick because she doesn't challenge him enough.

Some people do need someone who is always ready to keep them in check, its a personality thing. A relationship with someone who isn't ever ready to call out their bullshit just isn't going to work. I think this is really a blameless situation where two personalities don't mesh well, but if we have to blame someone I think the blame belongs more to the person who needs to be stopped from treating others badly.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@clevernamehere: mmmm I disagree. The passive, martyr role is also a very powerful one, it's jut the the holder of that position usually seeks to deny that they have the power -- passive aggressive instead of naggy-aggressive. It IS our responsibility to show up in our own relationships and to set personal boundaries and to tell partners when they are doing something that is hurtful. It's definitely a dance of two personalities, and I don't think the passive one gets off the hook.

Of course, abuse -- emotional or otherwise, is never acceptable and this is in no way mean to insinuate that people who are abused deserve it. But bickering, nagging, picking fights, criticizing... it can definitely wear you down but (outside of particular contexts) I wouldn't call it abuse in a serious way.
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clevernamehere
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: There is a big difference between "John was passive aggressive so I had to break up with him" and "John didn't challenge me or tell me off when I needed to be told off so I broke up with him."
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SylvanSylph
07/06/09

@clevernamehere: I'm with you. I don't get it. Why would you be mean to your significant other in the first place? I'm pretty sure I heard "you just need to stand up for yourself" from my seriously abusive boyfriend.
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clevernamehere
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
I used to administer a task like this to mothers and children and was pretty interesting to watch. A lot of the mothers would totally steamroll over the children because they were so focused on the task we gave them. But we weren't looking at the task, we were looking at how they worked together.

I was never convinced that how the mothers acted on the task was always how they acted in daily life, but I think a lot of them would have been shocked to watch the tape.
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Erda
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
But you know, a lot of high-anxiety women do the exact opposite. I feel like this was implied in the study but not really explicitly stated. (because it's better if the woman is the submissive one, right? but if the guy is, that's a problem)

For example, I had major insecurity issues when I was in high school, and as a result I would let guys walk all over me. It never got abusive, thankfully, but I put up with a lot of shitty behavior that I shouldn't have.

It wasn't until I was in college and, after hitting a particular low point, got through it and gained some self-respect, that I stopped being so willing to do anything for a guy, and became a bit more picky. However, I wouldn't say that I'm controlling either.

The point is that confident women (not just women, PEOPLE) neither slap their bfs around nor let their boyfriends do that to them. They don't feel the need to keep them on a *short* leash, but there is still a leash there.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@Erda: I prefer to think of the relationship as leashless, like that great dog who will just walk beside you just because they are bonded to you (I'll avoid the word "trained") and not because you have them in a collar.
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sciencerules
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
It would be really, really interesting to see a study like this repeated, say, five or ten years later. But this is an interesting concept, good study design, and most of all, great analysis by Megan.
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bleedingmouths
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
I have been in the high-anxiety - kind-boyfriend situation before. He was a very sweet, very nice guy and took everything I threw at him. He didn't challenge or stimulate me. I trusted completely that he wouldn't break up with me, so I was securely snappy and angry. Yukyukyukyukyukyuk. I broke up with him because us together = me being a bitch. He's still a great guy, just ain't the one for me.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@bleedingmouths: it seems unfair to call a guy like this "nice," though, when the problem wasn't that he was nice, the problem was that he had no self respect and didn't take responsibility for himself in the relationship. It seems to besmirch nice guys with spines to compare them to these types.
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clevernamehere
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: There is a type of person who is kind of a doormat, but that usually comes with some passive aggressive tendencies. There are also people who are so ridiculously mellow that very little bothers them. He really could have been either.

I think its mature of bleedingmouths to say he wasn't the guy for her rather than making his niceness a flaw.
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suck_it_monkeys
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
The scientists speculated that the highly anxious women in good relationships felt freer to treat their boyfriends badly when they weren't stressed about the relationship than when they were, since they weren't concerned with the boyfriend leaving.

Ouch.

My face honestly turned bright red when I read this part because it rings so true for me.
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sequined
07/06/09

@suck_it_monkeys: But I think this is true in general. I pout in front of my parents and sister and best friends; sometimes I get snippy with them in a way I never would with a casual acquaintance or a first date; I let them see me at my worst, so to speak. Same with a dude I'm in a secure relationship with.

Maybe that makes me a toolbag. I dunno.
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lalaland13
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
Also, there are different types of anxiety. If I were part of this study, I might just apologize a lot to the boyfriend for being so stupid and not being able to do this on my own, as I clearly do not deserve to be loved, damnit, so why do you love me?
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@lalaland13: maybe you would, but it seems like this study suggests that if you had a really nice partner you would take out your aggression on him or her because it is the only relief from your stress, or because it is a new script that requires emotional vulnerability and it's easier to have a fight, or whatever.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: no scratch that, i misunderstood the study i think. ignore me. or be nice to me, if you want me to be bitchy back.
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morninggloria
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
If this were me, I would tell Boyfriend to just let me do the project myself, so that I do not yell at him.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@morninggloria: this would be called sanity.
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PreposterousHypothesis
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
I haz a confused, but let me see if I have this straight:

High-anxiety women with nice boyfriends are bitchy to them, and everyone else.

Could they be happy in their relationships because they have someone who is willing to put up with their asshole ways, and will placate them? Because to me, this DOES sound like an ego issue. I know people who get off on their perceived control of their "nice" SO.
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lalaland13
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
If someone likes you and you don't like yourself, it's hard to reconcile the two. You think, "Why does this person like me? What's wrong with them?" and that makes you more anxious and perhaps prone to lash out. You want them to see you as you think you really are: a bad person.
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Dita Dimoné
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
So did they test men too? I don't know any men I've dated who wouldn't get pissy in such a situation.

Funny, you never hear about a male nag.
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Penny
07/06/09

@Dita Dimoné: If the roles were reversed in this study, it would be said that men are comfortable voicing their emotions or some shit like that.

Men can totally be nags.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@Penny: "Men delegate tasks to avoid becoming overwhelmed." "Women nag their partners because they don't know how to appreciate a good man."
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HarpMadness
07/06/09

@Dita Dimoné: Yeah, I was wondering why gender was even the focus of this. I'm hoping it's not just the "nag" stereotype. I've known both men and women who act this way.
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Devonna
07/06/09

@Penny: I tend to think of those types as "controlling assholes." But 'nag' works, too.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@HarpMadness: I ALWAYS wonder that about these supposed gender studies. Did the researchers set out to determine gender differences? (Seems biased). Or were they just being gender-conscious and through their gender analysis this is what they noticed? (Seems appropriate). Sometimes it just does feel like everything is cut up unnecessarily by gender, but then if people ignore gender it just slides back into patriarchy.
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thegogglesdonothing
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: As someone who's done a fair bit of psychological research, I'd guess that the focus on women exclusively is because of the different social expectations for men and women in relationships - if there were male subjects getting help from girlfriends, it would likely be difficult to compare them to the female subjects because it would be impossible to tell if differences were due to anxiety/relationship satisfaction or to prevailing social norms for relationship behavior.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@thegogglesdonothing: but... isn't that true for women too?
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: by which i mean, you can't tell if how we are acting is because of anxiety or because of social roles... i mean isn't that always an issue? I'm not saying that no studies should be gendered -- at all! Just sometimes when you can't see all the steps that went into planning the experiment it starts to feel like just another game of Men are from Mars Women are from Venus.
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clevernamehere
07/06/09

@Dita Dimoné: I don't think they were studying nagging, that's just the spin the media put on it. I think what they were actually studying was anxiety in women.
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HarpMadness
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: Yes, exactly. I mean, I doubt any of us would read this site if we didn't realize that women and men are set up to react differently to things, but it just seems like SO MANY of these studies are unnecessarily gendered. I am just afraid it's because everybody is coming from the "Men/Mars, Women/Venus" perspective instead of taking a fresh look at things.
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HarpMadness
07/06/09

@HarpMadness: My point being more along the lines of ... ignoring gender differences is bad, but over doing it doesn't really get us anywhere, either. Eh, I don't know if that's any clearer, either!
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vlvtjones
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
Some people can't be happy unless they make other people miserable.

It's not right, but there it is.
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Penny
07/06/09

@vlvtjones: Sure, but that's not really what this study is talking about...
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Penny
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
The one thing I CAN say is that it's probably not a great idea to conduct this kind of study on college-aged women. I know very few men who were mature in their relationships during that time....
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SomeAuthorGirl
07/06/09

@Penny: I will say that I like that Megan accurately represented what the study was far better than the original article. The title of the original article says "women," with a broad brush. Discerning that this study was done with college-aged subjects is important.

I don't think that many people are mature in their relationships at 18-19 years old. Hell, I am 31 and the ratio is still not what I expected (including me!).
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@SomeAuthorGirl: good point. At 19 I wasn't just nagging, I was wailing, and I didn't even know what about.
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SomeAuthorGirl
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: Yeah, me too. With another decade of aging, my nagging has become refined and potent. Like wine.
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Devonna
07/06/09

In reply to Scientists Study Social Stress, Romance & Bad Behavior In College-Age Relationships
I wonder how much of the boyfriend interaction (in the high anxiety/"supportive response") scenario falls under enabling. My anecdote on this that I have a highly critical mother. The more I call her out on it (exactly the opposite of what my father does) the less blaming/shaming she acts.
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J.D.Regent
07/06/09

@Devonna: really? calling her out works? fascinating. my highly critical mother shuts down and tells me i am a child (I'm almost thirty) and couldn't possibly understand the trials she lives through.

I do think there is an element of enabling but I feel like I have felt those feelings before, you put up with shit all day long with a smile on your face and get back to the place that is safe and let all the bitch out. Not taking it for granted and treating your partner as nicely as you would your best friend are key I think. Maybe it's just too much to ask parents to do that for their kids.
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Devonna
07/06/09

@J.D.Regent: My stock responses with my overly aggressive/critical mother are, "I am happy to do what you ask, but your aggression is unnecessary." and "did you mean to be hurtful when you said that?" It's much better than walking away in a huff, which is what I used to do.

It caught her off guard the first few times, and now she doesn't really behave that way with me anymore.
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