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Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
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happymisanthrope
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
If you're a bartender and serve someone who might have had too much and then that person gets into an accident and someone else dies -- that family can sue you, the bartender because you gave that drunk one last drink... so, I can understand why the bartender gets to decide when you've had enough.
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badmutha
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
Damn, there was nothing i wanted LESS than alcohol when I was preggers. In fact, when Mr. Badmutha came home one night stinking of cigars and scotch, I just about threw up.
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littlemisslondon
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I am finally showing at 22 weeks pregnant, and I got nasty looks for BEING IN A LIQUOR STORE with my husband while he bought beer for a gathering we were having that evening. Not drinking. Not even buying the beer myself. Just being in a store where alcohol is sold.

My grand total of drinking during this pregnancy is one tiny sip of icewine a few weeks ago, because I don't really like alcohol very much anyway and I don't see the point of taking the risk. But apparently I am a Bad Mother because I dared to be in close proximity to alcohol. Because drinking is done by osmosis.

Sigh.
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badmutha
04/30/09

@littlemisslondon: Are you saying there is something wrong with being a badmutha?
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MissyMcCLung
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I had a discussion about this stuff with my doctor recently. There is a great anti-nausea medication available for early pregnancy, but you can't get it in most of the states (if any). Because of the way science works, they can't ever prove that it is safe, so if a woman takes this, and has birth defects, she could conceivably sue saying that the medication caused it. If there was no other cause evident (genetic defects...) as sometimes happens, she might win.

The problem with all this is not that pregnancy is such a precious time, but the fucked up litigious society, where people refuse to accept and understand risk and blame.
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purpleshoes reminds everyone to take typing breaks and stretch, ow
04/30/09

@MissyMcCLung: I am sure you are aware that poorly-tested anti-nausea medications for pregnant women in particular have a couple of really horrible histories. That's one of those things where I could understand everyone being jumpy as hell, more than alcohol, actually. Though if I turn out to be a woman who gets morning sickness one day I'm probably going to be all FUCK IT GIVE ME WHAT THEY TAKE IN FRANCE, because I hear 1) it isn't just the morning 2) it sucks.
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MissyMcCLung
04/30/09

@purpleshoes: I agree about the touchiness - which is why I was super cautious about taking this one. But it's been on the market in Canada for 6 years, and tested extensively, and comprised of vitamins and amino acids and STILL not available in the States.
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HoldMyBackpack
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
Granted, I'm a man, but I feel that if you're making a decision to go through with the pregnancy then there's an implied acceptance of obligation to do everything possible to make sure the baby is healthy. There are many things that can go wrong with a pregnancy and many of them are beyond our control; why take unnecessary risks?
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HuckleberryFriend
04/30/09

@HoldMyBackpack: I see what you're saying, but realistically women can't live in a vacuum-sealed box for the whole 9 months. They have to work, socialize and go on with their lives.
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clevernamehere
04/30/09

@HoldMyBackpack: Would you give up drinking for 9 months if your partner was pregnant?
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slowpoke.r
04/30/09

@HoldMyBackpack: How about this: if a pregnant woman is super stressed and a glass of wine will help her relax, then which is the greater risk to the fetus, a little alcohol or a lot of stress?
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MissyMcCLung
04/30/09

@HoldMyBackpack: I agree, but I don't as well. The thing is, there isn't actually much evidence to support the idea that a drink every now and then is that bad for the baby. So how much of a risk is it, 1/1,000, 1/1,000,000...? you get the point. I don't drink when pregnant - personally I'm not comfortable with the risk level, but I do drink coffee, eat soft cheese and deli meats, bike and so on. What's really necessary for each individual is so unique, which is where the paternalism and making other people's choices becomes an issue.
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defmid6
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
As a bartender, when I cut off a patron, it's less me being bad mommy, but me not wanting to be arrested. If the person I let get insanely tanked goes, gets in a car and kills someone, the police are going to come after me. So like the doctors who don't want to pay for medical malpractice, bartenders will cut you off to save their own skin. And I feel no guilt about that at all.
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taranwanderer
04/30/09

@defmid6: As well you shouldn't.
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mysterygirl
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
Isn't this similar to the Plan B debate? If something is legal, and your job is to distribute that thing, then you or someone else in your establishment has to distribute it regardless of your own feelings on the matter.
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Kaehoku
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I've never been refused alcohol while pregnant, but one night my husband and I were out when I was about 8 months pregnant, and I ordered a glass of wine. The waiter took my order then said under his breath "oh, drinking for two?". To which I calmly replied: "I'm sorry, are you trying to suggest I'm pregnant, because I'm not!!" My wine was free, and he apologized profusely. Asshole.
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Maritsa
04/30/09

@Kaehoku: AWESOME. What an asshole.
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Little Time Bomb
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I hate the level of guilt that the medical profession is willing to inject into the process of prenatal care. There is so much well if you don't do as we say you might hurt your baby and then you'd be sorry. It doesn't seem to matter what the actual risk is, or at what amount something becomes a danger. You're treated as if you have no common sense or ability to digest actual information. It's all about worst case scenario.

Thank goodness I was blessed by a common sense former military doc. He was quick to offer that his own wife gave up everything and lived like a monk for their first baby, but by her third she just did whatever she felt was right, which meant a cup of tea with honey if he wanted it or an occasional glass of wine of beer. He even said "If I were legally allowed to I would say should have a stiff drink before coming to the hospital when you go into labor. Believe me it would make your life easier, but this isn't Europe so I can not legally suggest that to you."
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Maritsa
04/30/09

@Little Time Bomb: My doctors were pretty normal too. I asked if the hot dog/coldcut thing was really true and she said "Weeeelllll, if the choice is between a greasy cheeseburger and a turkey sandwich, the sandwich is healthier, just try not to have a lot of it because sometimes there are recalls and you don't want to have eaten tainted meat."

Though, God, I can't imagine having a strong drink in labor. Just because of the way alcohol affects me, it would have made it much harder.
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Little Time Bomb
04/30/09

@Maritsa: I didn't test the stiff drink for labor idea either. I will say I am putting the "A glass of beer with dinner helps with milk production." idea to the test.
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roodles
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
When I worked at the cafe in Borders books I got in trouble for giving a pregnant woman a caffinated coffee. The manager was like "you should have given her a decaf! she's pregnant". I mean damn, I'm not that woman's mother. If she needs a cup of joe to get through the day I say go for it, being preggers looks uncomfortable enough WITHOUT going through caffeine withdrawal...
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Evie Havok
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I don't really care if pregnant women drink. I just wish there were more studies on this just to see how it affects the bodies of pregnant women. But (there's always a but) if the baby does come out jacked up while the mother was drinking who is to blame? The doctor for saying it was okay to do so? The mother for doing it? Or blaming it on some bad genetic luck?
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Leucadia
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
I would like to take this moment to announce that I gave birth to a baby boy not quite 3 weeks ago (24 hrs unmedicated labor + emergency c-section = long recovery time = absence from jezebel commenting). And I know anecdote is not evidence, but I had probably 4-5 glasses of wine, and probably 5-10 sips or shot glass-sized drinks of beer, during my pregnancy. Kid was 9 lbs at birth, healthy as a horse. I am currently breastfeeding and the first night I got home from the hospital, I had a Hoegarten and thoroughly enjoyed it, and I'm positive it helped my milk come in strong. I have no guarantees that the kid is going to grow up "perfect," but that would be the case whether or not I drank a drop.

(Incidentally, I thought it would be really hard not to drink, but honestly, just having sips was satisfying for the most part. I just wanted the flavor of beer or wine. Plus from not drinking at all, I was such a lightweight that a half glass of wine really made me feel buzzed. So drink-loving Jezzies, don't be afraid to get pregnant! Well, you should be afraid, but for other reasons. :)
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AuntieEm (robots from the year 2000 > zombies)
04/30/09

@Leucadia: congrats!!!
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HuckleberryFriend
04/30/09

@Leucadia: Congrats! If you don't mind I'm going to pass your story along to a friend who has been doing the no alcohol while breastfeeding thing for over a year- she is totally dying for a glass of wine.
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JaneBadall
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
Thing used to be VERY different. For example, in 1962 when my grandmother was pregnant with my father she was told to drink 2 shots of vodka before bed and to have a cigarette or two throughout the day.

Why? Because she was a tiny 4' 11", my grandfather was 6'3" and it was her first child. They were hoping the booze & the cigs would make the baby smaller so that there would be less complications. Problems with the baby's health? Well, those could be dealt with later. Kids are tough, right?
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CordeliaShirley
04/30/09

@JaneBadall: hah- well, that's one way to problem-solve!
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Notes from the underwhelmed
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
My mom didn't drink (at the time she didn't drink at all. She smoked pot. Drinking was for "the man."), but she did smoke like, three cigarettes a day (which was tough for her), and I came out fine.
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Beat Girl
04/30/09

@Notes from the underwhelmed: My boyfriend almost died in premature birth and went on to have E Coli as an underfed newborn, and his mother almost died while birthing too, all because she smoked. So, it's swings and roundabouts.
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taranwanderer
04/30/09

@Notes from the underwhelmed: My aunt was a smoker her whole life, even during her three pregnancies. Two of my cousins are just fine, but one has severe disabilities. I totally agree that it's sometimes a crapshoot.
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clevernamehere
04/30/09

In reply to Medical Expert Says Refusing Preggo Women Alcohol Is "Sexist"
A friend of mine realized she was pregnant after two weeks of HEAVY drinking and that led to the two of us calling various friends of friends who were experts in fetal alcohol syndrome.

The consensus is that there is no proof of a safe level of alcohol. None of the doctors thought she should worry about early drinking, but no one could say there was no chance she'd hurt the baby. The baby is fine, but I think she would have been heartbroken if something had been wrong and would have blamed herself.

The US is a little uptight about pregnant women drinking but in the last few years other countries have shifted towards a more uptight take on drinking during pregnancy. The French, Spanish, Dutch, and British governments all recommends women avoid drinking at all[63.134.214.153]

I would so expect the solidarity thing. I don't think it would be too hard for me to abstain if my partner wasn't drinking, but if he was I would total want to drink with him.
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Beat Girl
04/30/09

@clevernamehere: I live in Britain, and my sister's just had a baby (her first). When she asked, her doctor told her she could reasonably have a bottle of beer or a small glass of wine per day, but if she didn't have the desire/reason to then she probably shouldn't get into the habit just in case. That's why people are starting to advise against any drinking here - we have a poor culture whereby one drink means at least 3, so why tempt yourself into doing real harm?
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athenaswisdom
04/30/09

@clevernamehere: There's no proof because the kinds of tests needed to establish a conclusion are hard to conduct. What group of pregnant women would volunteer to be the "heavy drinkers" as part of study?
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taranwanderer
04/30/09

@clevernamehere: I'm with you on the solidarity thing. If I get pregnant and need to reduce or eliminate my drinking, my partner sure as fuck will be doing the same thing.
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clevernamehere
04/30/09

@athenaswisdom: I know. Really they already know heavy drinking is a cause from case-control studies they just can't tell where the line is.
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