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"Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
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shewar
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I imagine most people that get married withhold some information from their spouse. She was probably more embarrassed by her failed marriages than anything, and didn't want them to get in the way of a potentially great one. The situation just snowballed. I really don't think there was much deception happening here. Just a girl who has commitment issues.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@shewar got laid off, more time for jez: So why not get a divorce? All she had to do to avoid this mess was GET A DIVORCE.

And then why change your name? Why all the lying and deception?
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Penny
06/24/09

@shewar got laid off, more time for jez: I am in between this and the "deeply disturbed" argument. I think she has bigger problems than commitment issues, but I agree about the snowballing. And as I said about, she seems to be in deep denial about her past.
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stacyinbean
06/24/09

@shewar got laid off, more time for jez: The solution to the embarassment would have been to actually obtain a divorce. She would never have had to tell any of them that she was divorced. NOT getting the divorces is what caused all the issues. This is HUGELY deceptive! Imagine what you'd be saying if this were a man?!
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shewar
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: @stacyinbean: I'm wondering if it was a money issue. "Glamour modeling" doesn't sound like something you'd do if you were financially stable.

Obviously I'm speculating, it just seems ridiculous to lock someone up for these.

Then again I have little respect for the institution of marriage so my argument is a bit biased.
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stacyinbean
06/24/09

@shewar got laid off, more time for jez: I'm pretty sure 'glamour models' are some of the most famous people in England though, look at Katie 'Jordan' Price. That's where she got her start. I'd say it's more likely something you'd do if you are less than emotionally stable, but maybe that's my bias showing! I DO agree it seems ridiculous to imprison this woman, I just think what she did is disgusting and clearly on the side of sociopath/pathological liar. The only main qualifier for being a 'sociopath' is a disregard for the feelings of others.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@shewar got laid off, more time for jez: BIGAMY IS ILLEGAL. You can't marry two people at the same time.

CHRIST. We DEFINITLY wouldn't be having this dicussion if she was a man. The hypocrisy...
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shewar
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: Probably not, I guess it just seems less like bigamy when she's not fucking 2 of them at the same time.
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Our Lady of the Massacre
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Oh whatever, Sadie. If it was a guy marrying a string of women, you wouldn't hesitate to call him a predator. Feminism doesn't mean double standards.
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PilgrimSoul
06/24/09

@Our Lady of the Massacre: Charming.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I really don't understand how anyone could question how disturbed and predatory this woman is. If this was a story about a man, this thread would be full of "He just thinks he can subjugate women! We're not all submissive! These are the gender stereotypes manifested into sick and disturbing behavior!"

These poor guys. They thought they had met someone they loved, and who loved them back, when really they were just in grips of a sociopath.
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Penny
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: If this thread were about a man, I'd think, "man, he's a nutter," and I would feel bad for those impacted. Which is basically how I feel about this.
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RollsRoyceRevenge
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Who the fuck is she marrying? Tim Burton?
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vamusical
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Something about accusing her of "trickery" reminded me of this:

The Witch: I'm not a witch I'm not a witch!

Sir Bedevere: But you are dressed as one

The Witch: *They* dressed me up like this!

Crowd: We didn't! We didn't...

The Witch: And this isn't my nose. It's a false one.

Sir Bedevere: [lifts up her false nose] Well?

Peasant 1: Well, we did do the nose.

Sir Bedevere: The nose?

Peasant 1: And the hat, but she is a witch!

Crowd: Yeah! Burn her! Burn her!
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hatepaperdoll
06/24/09

@vamusical: "...so, if she weighs as much as duck, she's made of wood...?"
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TheUptightMidwesterner
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I think I have problems, because I am reading about her and all I really care about is how she got that owie on her arm. Is is "bicep cancer"?
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save jinger
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
If she likes marriage so much, why doesn't she marry it?
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Penny
06/24/09

@save jinger: Oh.....you.
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vamusical
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I hear fairly frequently of men who attempt to get married again without having completely settled a past divorce. Funny how the didn't have to "trick" anyone or "prey" on anyone to swing that!
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@vamusical: Do they marry FIVE TIMES without obtaining a single divorce?
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vamusical
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: I see you haven't met my Uncle.

But seriously, she obviously has issues and has clearly screwed people over, but the use of the word "trickery" is a bit sensationalist. But then it IS the Daily Mail.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@vamusical: She NEVER obtained a divorce. I know people marry a lot of times, but USUALLY they get divorced first.

I don't know, man. She changed her name to obtain marriages. She lied about her past. She served time for her crimes and went ahead and did it again anyway. That sounds like "trickery" to me.
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Zombie Ms. Skittles
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
"Womb cancer?" What, is that kind of like "butt cancer?"
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hatepaperdoll
06/24/09

@Zombie MissSkittles is not your kind of lady: I think it's in the same family as "funnybone cancer", "hair cancer", and, "snot cancer".
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dangerface!
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I am moving to England next month, so I really need to know- WTF is a "glamour model",really, and why do I always hear about women either doing it or wanting that as a career?
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Beat Girl
06/24/09

@dangerface!: It's like a playboy bunny, basically.

Generally fake boobs and tan, though not always. Glamour modelling is just a term for topless modelling for men's mags.
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

@dangerface!: Glamour modelling is done by women whose breasts, real or implants, are far too large to be deemed acceptable for high fashion.They show their naked derriers and breasts (rather like Kate Moss) but not their genitalia, thus distinguishing themselves from soft porn models. The success of the likes of Jordan/ Katie Price has led a host of young teenage and sadly even younger females to say they want to have breasts implants, bleached hair and extensions, fake tans and become glamour models too.
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PilgrimSoul
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Again, wasn't it Andrea Dworkin who said something like, "The argument between wives and prostitutes is age old, each convinced that whatever she may be, she is not the other"?
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Penny
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Also, I thought "black widows" killed their husbands?
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
I cannot see the point in jailing this woman as it seems she has not carried out any fianncail fraud on the men she got involved with. The injustice is that if she were a Muslim man she would legally be able to claim state benefits for more than one concurrent spouse.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@Rare Affinity: In England? Really? I've never heard of that exception, and I've never met a Muslim Brit with more than one spouse.
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: The guy below got off a speeding rap because he claimed he was speeding to have sex with ONE of his two wives. He was NOT prosecuted as a bigamist.It is also a matter of record that Muslim men can claim benefits for their wives in the UK.

[www.thisislondon.co.uk]
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JohanPaladin
06/24/09

It's not just England/the UK. My mom is a native Nederlander and I had been hearing about this anti-Muslim sentiment in the Netherlands which surprised me and I asked her about it. She said this is a huge reason, the claiming of multiple wives in their native territory is a huge drain on resources.
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

@JohanPaladin: Why cannot the women claim in their own right? However it should be noted that single women in the UK can be jailed for benefit fraud if they are claiming on their own and the authorities can prove they are in fact cohabiting. Operating a two tier legal system fosters the kind of resentment that allows far right groups to be voted into power, as happened only recently in the UK.
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gherkinfiend
06/24/09

@Rare Affinity: Well if you are co-habiting then you aren't single and that would in fact be benefit fraud...so I really don't understand your point.
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

@gherkinfiend: My point is that under English law only one marriage at a time is deemed legal. Yet the authorities deliberately turn a blind eye to Muslim men flouting the law of the land by having more than one wife and even rewards them for deliberately breaking the law by allowing them to claim for more than one wife. Single women are threaten with jail if they claim benefits whilst actually cohabiting. If the Muslim second wedding is not recognised under English law then the man must be cohabiting with the other wives. As they are cohabiting with him they cannot claim benefit in their own right (which is the rhetorical asnwer I made earlier). In short the law is a nonsense and this is the inevitable consequence of making concessions to some groups as opposed to treating EVERYONE as being equal under the law.
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Penny
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Womb cancer?

This may just be my ambivalence toward the institution, but this doesn't seem like the biggest deal. Yes, she obviously has some psychological issues. But, a sociopath? Deeply disturbed? I'm not so sure about that.
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DinaRonson : Elizabeth Cady Stanton
06/24/09

@Penny: Yeah. She's guilty of not telling the truth sure, but if you are in a relationship that has moved to marriage, certainly one would hope both parties have been honest & upfront. To whom, at that stage, would it occur to ask "BTW, you aren't already married are you"?
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@Penny: @DinaRonson : Elizabeth Cady Stanton: Anyone who repeats deviant behavior consistently, without acknowledging the wrongness of it, and who manipulate their life and the lives of those around them (ie - changing your name to facilitate another marriage) for their own personal gain with complete disregard for the feelings of those they are manipulating, and the inherent wrongness of their actions, is a textbook sociopath.

This woman is a sociopath. The men she was involved with are lucky that she wasn't a violent sociopath.
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Penny
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: What was the personal gain? I'm still not convinced. Like I said, psychological problems, definitely. But calling her a sociopath still seems like a stretch. I mean, what if she was in deep denial and simply convinced herself that she was no longer married to the other men, for whatever reason?

Certainly not defending her actions here, of course.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@Penny: The personal gain is emotional, not financial in this case. She manipulated and deceived these men to have security, love, and emotional support. That's as potent a motivation as money, sex, or murder.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@Penny: Also, being able to put yourself into that deep a state of denial is one of the characteristics of sociopathic behavior.
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Penny
06/24/09

@stoprobbers: Well, perhaps I am having trouble distinguishing between violent and non-violent sociopaths, then. I suppose it's more of a loaded term outside of the field -- in the sense that when someone is called a sociopath in the media, they are usually violent. In any case, it's obvious she needs some help.
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stoprobbers
06/24/09

@Penny: Right. That's why I said it's lucky for her husbands that she isn't violent sociopath. And non-violent sociopaths tend to escalate into violent sociopaths the longer that they are able to get away with their behavior. But you most certainly do not have to be violent to be a sociopath, and she seems to demostrate all the calling cards.
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JessicaLovejoy: Laughing, riding, cornholing!
06/24/09

In reply to "Brazen Bigamist" Beguiles Britain!
Hmmm. Amileannya Comes By Night just doesn't have the same ring to it. . .
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