endangered species

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Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Baby Snow Leopard Born In Japan
Happy Hump Day!
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Adora Belle Dearheart
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
I think it's interesting that this man (actually, humans in general) feel like humans are important enough to decide the existence of an entire species. By interesting, I mean sad.
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Kitty
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
I don't think people realize how normal extinction is. People seem to think that something cataclysmic must occur for a species to die out (dinosaurs with a meteor for example, mammoths with the Ice Age).

But honestly it's a very normal thing.

Am I saying that we should let the pandas die out? Hardly.

But I don't think we can even save ourselves from eventually going extinct, so I doubt in the long run we'll be able to keep these lovable balls of black and white fluff in tact.
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whynotshesaid promoted this comment Edited by Kitty at 09/25/09 5:31 PM Kitty was starred Kitty was unstarred

whynotshesaid
09/25/09

@Kitty: I get what you are saying, but I know for me, the issue isn't so much that extinction happens as much as it is that a lot of extinction happens directly as a result of human activity - development, energy extraction, food production, pest eradication.

Humans exercise a disproportionate amount of influence over the world, and as a result, things have gotten terribly out of whack.
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l'américaine française
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
"if we're the shepherds of the planet"

well, we're more like the sheep. the sooner we become more humble as the animal species that we are, the better.

the truth is that even if we made every effort to save these very cute animals, if nature wants them gone, then it's only a matter of time before they're gone.
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治 promoted this comment Edited by l'américaine française at 09/25/09 3:51 PM

KATE!
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
its pretty ridiculous that we destroy an animals natural environment and poach the shit out of them and then claim that the reason there are so few of them living is because of their evolutionary failings. it seems like a pretty disingenuous attitude. they're an evolutionary dead end because they happen to live in the most populous country on the planet? is that really what he's saying? thats just social darwinism re-imagined as natural selection!

SORRY PANDA, YOU DIDN'T INVENT GUNS AND START SHOOTING US FIRST SO WE WIN.
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whynotshesaid promoted this comment KATE! was starred KATE! was unstarred

whynotshesaid
09/25/09

@KATE!: Yes, exactly.
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Yahtzii
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out

I'm not so much for conservation of cute animals so much as I am for extinction of ugly ones. Like this guy. Who needs it? If it's out of place on a Hallmark card, I say "Bombs away!"
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PreposterousHypothesis
09/25/09

@Yahtzii: See, pandas are beneficiaries of Cute Privilege. The cute-riarchy ensures it's perpetuated through WWF logos, LOLCats, and CuteOverload.com. And somehow LOLAnglerfish never caught on. I WONDER WHY.
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Edited by PreposterousHypothesis at 09/25/09 2:58 PM

Yahtzii
09/25/09

@PreposterousHypothesis: WTF, are you some kind of anti-cuteist now? Where the hell do you think you would be today if it wasn't for cute?
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chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
But if we let them ALL die out, I'd have to find something else to be the centerpiece of Panda Luau '09! California Condor is so damn stringy, and everyone's tired of manatee cheeks by now.

Hmmm... perhaps the most dangerous game...??
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治
09/25/09

@chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish:

OH SNAP
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chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish
09/25/09

@MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治: Yeah, I know, first world problems.... :-/
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Edited by chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish at 09/25/09 2:52 PM

Ipomoea
09/25/09

@chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish: Why not pull an Andre Leon Talley and go for snow leopard?
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greengrey
09/25/09

@chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish: I suggest dolphin. It's QUITE delicious. Have you tried whale?
I lurve seafood.
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chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish
09/25/09

@Ipomoea: Mmmm... deep-fried spotty kitty.... *drools*
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Edited by chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish at 09/25/09 3:01 PM

PreposterousHypothesis
09/25/09

@chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish: I hear the '05 Chateau Beauséjour-Duffau-Lagarrosse pairs excellently with Siberian Tiger.
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治
09/25/09

@greengrey: Whale isn't all that good, actually. Seal's a little better, but still meh.
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greengrey
09/25/09

@MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治: I prefer wearing seal. The eyes are great to use on charm bracelets.
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birminghamdrunk
09/25/09

@all: LOLBASEMENTTHREAD
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chritter is a nocturnal feminist mancatfish
09/25/09

@PreposterousHypothesis: That sounds like a much better choice than the tiger-penis wine we usually serve. Thanks for the tip!
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Kilotwat
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Being able to appeal to human sentimentality is every bit an evolutionary edge as anything else. Some animals have speed, others deadly venom, the giant panda has adorableness. Underestimate that quality at your peril. Their ability to reproduce atrophied, their ability to find food sucks, but being so fucking cute alone wins them the evolutionary lottery.

Now as to whether there's intrinsic value to the survival of the species. I'd argue that absolutely, yes. Pandas make most people go "d'awwww". They elicit the warm fuzzies in people. That's a completely worthwhile service.
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Edited by Kilotwat at 09/25/09 2:30 PM Kilotwat was starred Kilotwat was unstarred

o-line
09/25/09

@Kilotwat: Also, where would we be without Sexual Harassment Panda?
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LaComtesse
09/25/09

@o-line: Or the Sad Panda of Battery Park City...

[mjhstaff.blogspot.com]
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mbot says Spock yeah!
09/25/09

@Kilotwat: Absolutely. There's a reason the World Wildlife Fund has a panda as its logo! And just knowing that something as cute as a panda (let alone a wittle baby panda!) exists in the world makes my life a little brighter every day. The fact that they're kind of useless and dopey on their own only endears them to me further.
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Wow, someone actually had the stones to come out and say it. I agree, although I don't exactly relish the notion of any species going extinct. Still, I've been "WTF pandas, you suck at life!" for a few years now. Cute does not equal worthy from any biological or evolutionary standpoint. It's sad that we're hastening their exit, and should stop. They don't need our help to die out. But we ought not to preserve them for the sake of sentimentality, either.
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kquaker
09/25/09

@MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治: Well yea Pandas fail at life, but does that mean we should just take warning signs off and let the stupid people and/or handicapped people die off too? Because you know evolution would take them out.
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治 promoted this comment kquaker was starred kquaker was unstarred

MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治
09/25/09

@kquaker: You don't want to get me started on stupid people. My short answer: YES. Let them dive into the shallows and set themselves on fire by deep frying frozen turkeys to their hearts' content. But the debate is about the ability of a wild species to survive on its own evolutionary merits, not the role of human society in insuring the survival of the less fortunate. That's a huge logical jump you made there.

Also, deep fried turkey is amazing, but don't forget to thaw it first!
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KATE!
09/25/09

@MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治: but didn't the problem with pandas begin by loss of habitat due to human encroachment combined with poaching? i don't really think thats an evolutionary failure on their part, but ours.
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Liz11685 promoted this comment KATE! was starred KATE! was unstarred

MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治
09/25/09

@KATE!: The problem with pandas began when they changed their diets to bamboo, which they can't efficiently digest, and have to spend every waking moment eating in order to survive. Yes we're encroaching on their environment, yes they've been poached. And like I mentioned above, that has unfortunately sped up the process of their extinction. Still, they've been on borrowed time since their dietary "requirements" were coupled with their reproductive inefficiency. "Requirements" is in quotes because while they can eat things other than bamboo, they don't unless in captivity. So while we've certainly failed the pandas, the crucial failure here is their own, or one of evolution if you don't want to put too sharp a "you suck, panda" point on it. They've been doomed regardless of human interaction.
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KATE!
09/25/09

@MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治: i don't buy that. there are a lot of species on this planet that have very specific needs based on their evolutionary history and environment and and despite their small populations or remote locations continue to breed generation after generation. the difference between them and the panda is that pandas exists in places that humans do also.

pandas may not have ever been able to flourished and overrun humans or cockroaches in their numbers (obviously), but we have absolutely NO WAY to know what would have happened to their population without human interference because the type of human interference was so drastic and devastating. its not that they ARE unable to adapt, but that they were unable to adapt QUICKLY enough to combat the strains that human interaction posed. biological timescales are not the same as human ones. it takes a lot longer to change an animal's digestive system than it does to shoot them.

if we want to be callous make a cost-benefit analysis, the continuing conservation of the giant panda's existence might actually not be in the economic interest of humanity (well, not alive anyway: sup poachers?), but we should not labor under any disillusion that the inevitable extinction of the panda anyones fault but our own.
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Edited by KATE! at 09/26/09 12:04 AM KATE! was starred KATE! was unstarred

Valkyrie607
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
1. Pandas themselves are not essential. Strictly speaking, humans shouldn't have any vested interest in their survival. But their continued survival hinges on the continued existence of their habitat, with all its attendant biodiversity. The panda is an indicator of the overall health of the landscape.

2. Preserving biodiversity is always, from an ecological standpoint, worthwhile. The analogy frequently used by ecologists is that of our ecology to an airplane in which we are all riding. All the species are the rivets and its component parts. Removing one or two rivets doesn't necessarily cause the plane to crash. This doesn't mean we don't need those rivets, or that it's a great idea to continue removing rivets...
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MeganGlass 就是一个古代的三明治 promoted this comment Valkyrie607 was starred Valkyrie607 was unstarred

andBegorrah
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Plus, Buttersticks are really high in fat.
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Dodgergirl
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Stephen Colbert is behind this.
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jigglyball
09/25/09

@Dodgergirl: Bunch of vegetarian commies!
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heliotrollop
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
OK, I'll say it: I don't like pandas. And I agree with the BBC Naure guy.

Now I'll await death by bamboo beating.
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Residentdrunkgirl promoted this comment heliotrollop was starred heliotrollop was unstarred

Residentdrunkgirl
09/25/09

@heliotrollop ... (fka phoebe.caulfield): I have a Panda bear looking cat and bamboo outside. Where do you live?
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erinna
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
I think this is Sarah Palin's take on Polar Bears, wolves, and pretty much every other non-human life form
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Gumbina80
09/25/09

@erinna: "If God wanted them to survive, he would have given them guns."
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Aluminum Falcon
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
It's true that they don't reproduce quickly or well, but the climate change that is hastening their species' death is partially our fault. Therefore it's our responsibility to make sure they survive for as longas we can make them. Also, something that cuddly (looking) and fuzzy and cute should never die out!
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atomic
09/25/09

@scarletsidhe: I would think that the climate change is actually MOSTLY our fault. In fact, I venture to say humans are the #1 cause for the majority of endangered species today. You cannot destroy habitats, push wild animals into corners, kill creatures, pillage natural resources and THEN CLAIM "oh, natural selection."
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Liz11685 promoted this comment atomic was starred atomic was unstarred

Red-headed bookworm
09/25/09

@scarletsidhe: Well, the deforestation that has spread out the pandas into unconnected areas is definitely man's fault.
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whothewhatnow
09/25/09

In reply to Conservationist Argues We Should Let Pandas Die Out
Follow-up headline: PANDAS WILL DRAFT ANGRY RESPONSE RIGHT AFTER THEY FINISH THIS NAP
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