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She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves

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Lizawithazee
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
This is all well and good until the contact improv students start trying to split atoms.
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Mafalda para Presidente
11/30/08

@Lizawithazee: Oh boy. Hopefully they won't get near that particle reactor in the physics lab, because even physics students can't figure that one out.
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Ratinski
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
The closest thing we had in library school was the bookcart drill team. No, I am not kidding. I never got to participate because it was an ALA (American Library Association, heavily used by librarians on the public/academic/school library tracks) and I was in SLA (Special Libraries Association, for the weirdos in the private sector), but it was awesome.

I miss school sometimes.
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ellaesther
11/30/08

@Ratinski: Every year, Fourth of July, the only good thing in my town's parade (other than the general cuteness of wee children) is the library's crack bookcart drill team.
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spikenard
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
I am doing my PhD in law... I could do an amazing interpretive dance.. my topic is torture. But is this only for scientists? :(
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sisepuede is the femmiest femme of them all
11/30/08

@spikenard: dude, where are you doing your PhD?
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thesciencegirl
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
I made up an interpretive dance about the process of applying to MD/PhD programs.... it never occurred to me to create one about my thesis project. As my icon depicts, I study cholera. Hmmm... how to dance out "watery diarrhea" ... ? lol
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ladeedah
11/30/08

@thesciencegirl: I imagine you could do some cool do-si-doing thing. "Epithelial cells, swing your partner! Now get expelled from your host's body! Yee-haw!"
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HereComesMyBaby
11/30/08

@thesciencegirl: I seriously thought your icon was a tampon.
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thesciencegirl
11/30/08

@ladeedah: ha ha... I was thinking of a salsa routine, since it's the only dance style I've been trained in. I have a whole routine in my mind; I might need to enter next year. hmmmm....
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thesciencegirl
11/30/08

@HereComesMyBaby: fluorescent tampon! Yes! haha It does look like a tampon, doesn't it?
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kelsium
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
Are all of these posted online somewhere? This could potentially entertain me all afternoon.

On a side note I think this is stellar! My city does an annual festival that features combinations of art and science including plays about Einstein, workshops on the physics of dance or the chemistry of painting, etc. I've been stage managing for it for the last several years and I get to see something different every year! So much fun!
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PilgrimSoul
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
This post has inflamed my already boiling envy of graduate students, so much so that I'm searching for other metaphors to mix so that I too can dance about architecture.
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ellaesther
11/30/08

@PilgrimSoul: Man, me too. I loved getting my Masters. I wish I could be a graduate student for the rest of my life. Not a creepy, "finish school already, grandma!" one, but a nerdy-cool one, who always has something interesting to research and intellectual people to discuss it with, in ivied halls. That would put me on Cloud Nine, gathering no moss.
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PilgrimSoul
11/30/08

@ellaesther: mostly I would be in it to get out of the get-up-and-go-straight-to-office... grind, or, you know, actually feel like getting up in the morning.

but I am another year out, I think.

also, see this exchange I recently had with a friend:

Me: "I realized I should probably go back to grad school around the time I began to obsessively comment on this website, and one night even stooped to debating Camille Paglia."

Friend: "Grad school might not be that different."
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ellaesther
11/30/08

@PilgrimSoul: Oh, totally. Grad school is precisely the same. But if you keep your wits about you, you figure out when it's time to stop debating and get a beer. And then you keep talking the geek talk, but it sounds even better.

(One of the highlights of my getting my Masters Degree in Middle Eastern Studies was walking into my department's student lounge and finding my friends in the midst of a dead-serious argument about Star Wars. Oh graduate school, I miss you!)
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HereComesMyBaby
11/30/08

@PilgrimSoul: But graduate students are the worst people.
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dontbogartthewine
11/30/08

@PilgrimSoul: Oh my god I love that movie. 'Talking about love is like dancing about architecture.' Sigh.
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PhDork
12/01/08

@dontbogartthewine: I thought she was referening Elvis Costello's comment about "writing about music." Eh, either way. What movie is that from?
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ellaesther
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
It's kismet! I just watched a Steven Colbert video on YouTube and thought "Damn, I can't wait to have an excuse to post this on Jezebel!" (Admittedly, it's kind of a stretch, as the clip has nothing to do with getting one's PhD. But Stephen *does* have a doctorate -- in STEALING MY HEART!)

Oh my God. So many, many moments of utter awesome.
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My Name Is Sycamore
11/30/08

@ellaesther: Yes! I watch this video sometimes when I need a little pick-me-up. (that sounds really sad now that I've typed it out...)

Dr. Stephen T. Colbert is too awesome.
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ellaesther
11/30/08

@My Name Is Sycamore: Oh dude, not sad at all! I just watched it twice in a row, and will keep it on metaphorical speed dial from now on. If that's sad, I don't wanna be happy.

PS How much do you think that he's wonderful in bed? I mean both great in the traditional sense, and wonderful, in the oh-so-sweet sense?

Ok, now I'm just being creepy. Sorry Mrs. Dr. Stephen T. Colbert (and, um, Mr. ellaesther).
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squeakel
11/30/08

@ellaesther:

Why aren't we allowed to make fun of art or an art form? Especially (I'm sorry) a very silly one...
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ellaesther
11/30/08

@squeakel: Did you mean to reply to someone else? Because the only thing I'm making fun of here is my own geeky adoration of Stephen Colbert.

Though, of course, said adoration is perfectly reasonable. (And yes lickittysplitz, I sure do wish I could be his friend...! If not, you know, his luvah).
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prettycool
12/01/08

@ellaesther: did i just see stephen colbert, steve carell, and jon stewart topless? with my own eyes?

m'am, you have made. my. day.
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whatsername
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
You know what'd be awesome? If the wildly smart and charming professor at work I'm crushing on had to explain his dissertation in this way, 'cos it might just help me realise that he's just a dude, after all, not superhuman. Plus it'd be good for a laugh, especially if he wore tights.
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PhDork
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
As a person who studies performance, this makes my skin crawl off my body and into a test tube of acid. No.
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kelsium
11/30/08

@PhDork: Eh, I have been working in the arts my whole life, and while this kind of hurts my brain I think that anything that exposes more people to dance and performing arts is a good thing.
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PhDork
11/30/08

@kelsium: I guess the question is: *does* this expose more people to dance and PA, or is it just gross, self-indulgent and/or jokey riffing on artsy-fartsy-ness (the opposite of "serious," meaningful Science? I'm leaning toward the latter.
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t-yo3
11/30/08

@kelsium: @PhDork: Or maybe it's just fun?
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spoolingthreads
11/30/08

@PhDork: Oh let 'em have some fun. Art is often way too serious anyway.
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Stabby McStabberson
11/30/08

@hellojane: you just proved phdork's point.
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PhDork
11/30/08

@titilayo: Ah, yes: FUN. The ultimate get-out-of-jail-free card, when it comes to making meaning.
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spoolingthreads
11/30/08

@PhDork: Whoa. Seriously? I didn't realize art had rules.
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kelsium
11/30/08

@PhDork: I've was thinking about your point the entire time I was making dinner, and while I think it is a good one--there does seem to be a weird self-congratulatory air to all this--I do stand by my earlier thought. I think that there will always be people who don't understand that art is work just like anything, but everyone I know who works in art as a profession initially got into it because it was fun for them. I think even if they're doing it for the wrong reasons, they're doing it. Some of them might never do it again, or see a modern dance performance, or even think about dance any more, but some of them will be like "Hey! This is kind of awesome, maybe I should learn more about it." Maybe that's wishful thinking on my part. I guess what I really wish is that they would do more stuff like this in elementary schools and such. If you can make the connection early that performance art is a viable and incredibly valuable form of expression then more people will get it.
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Penny
11/30/08

@PhDork: I can very much see where you are coming from. However, speaking personally as someone who loves performance art and the physical sciences, I look at this a bit differently. I mean, the physical sciences are rife with stereotypes as well, and every geologist/chemist/physicist I've met (not so much with the engineers and MDs) are wildly imaginative.

I totally understand the way that, say, physical and social sciences are pitted against each other. But something that's so appealing about the arts in general is that it's democratizing and far-reaching, in my view, at least.

Anyhow, the point being that I DO see your perspective, but I wouldn't be so quick to assume that everyone views PA in the same fashion.
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kelsium
11/30/08

@hellojane: Your attitude suggests that you think art is ONLY fun and NO art should be taken seriously. Maybe I am interpreting you wrong, but I believe that PhDork is expressing her frustration that there is an organization that goes out of its way to congratulate scientists who danced around a stage, when professional performing artists get very little funding and respect. Art is work; performing artists are some of the hardest and least externally rewarded people I know.
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Penny
11/30/08

@kelsium: I get frustrated in the same way about fashion. When people belittle fashion, it makes me see red. When, things like adornment, the arts and literature a wonderful window into the past. I've always enjoyed exploring history through the lens of these things.

But, I am also a huge physics geek so I am also quick to stand up for the physical sciences :-)
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Penny
11/30/08

@kelsium: I didn't really interpret the comment in that way. I think she (he?) has a point that the arts ARE available to everyone, which is part of what makes it such an interesting discipline.

This is entirely separate from the point you and PhD are making, which is extremely valid.

I think they ARE just having fun, but you're right that there is an air of self-congratulation about it. But, it could also just be a way to get out of the lab and express themselves in a different way.

I don't know, while I understand that frustration, I also can't seem to get angry about it, I guess.
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PhDork
11/30/08

@kelsium: @Archetype: I'm fine with scientists "having fun" with performance. I've done some work on the intersection of science and theatre, and, generally speaking, there is seriously patronizing attitude taken by those on the science side towards theatre and performance: it's a useful tool for "selling" science-y ideas, and it's sexy and fun and so touchy-feely and goofy to do! Whee! Lab coats-n-leotards, aren't we special? Making art is (can be/should be) fun. But yes, as kelsium notes, it's also a lot of hard work.

This may be my snobbery, but I don't believe for a second that "Dance your Ph.D" is anything other than a bunch of lab-dorks (NB: I count myself among dorks) noodlin' around, feelin' good about themselves for their creatin'!

They are well within their rights to do so, and I am well within mine to call it out for crap. Everyone is free to create art; but everyone's art is worthwhile.
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PhDork
11/30/08

@PhDork: Oh, lawd, that last sentence. Try: Everyone is free to create art; but everyone's art is NOT EQUALLY worthwhile. How did I manage that?
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Penny
11/30/08

@PhDork: Well, I simply look at this as expressing their study through another means of communication. If they were people who had no respect for the arts in general, I doubt they would have participated.

What this comes down for me, though, is.....is this art? The eternal question, I guess.

For me, PA is not always "art," but a means of expressing oneself. The former is not always the latter and visa versa. They could have written a synopsis, given a talk (as most do) but instead they laid out their thesis via performance art.

I am not ignoring the fact that the arts are sometimes belittled or patronized (are you speaking specifically to theater?). But, so are many other disciplines and areas of study.

I don't know, like I said, I can't get too worked up over this, but I respect your perspective and of course you are within your rights to call out what you feel to be patronizing. Just as others are free to argue that they feel it is not.
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t-yo3
11/30/08

@PhDork: "This may be my snobbery, but I don't believe for a second that "Dance your Ph.D" is anything other than a bunch of lab-dorks (NB: I count myself among dorks) noodlin' around, feelin' good about themselves for their creatin'!. Everyone is free to create art; but everyone's art is NOT EQUALLY worthwhile."

I agree with you fully here; this is actually sort of what I was trying to say in my earlier comment (but I have no talent for brevity). I suspect that many of the Ph.D. dancers see it that way too. I don't think they have any illusions/delusions that what they're doing is comparable makes them Performing Artists, just like I didn't imagine that building a butter-tub and plastic bag boat to carry Timbits (my first year engineering project) made me a naval architect/marine engineer.
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kelsium
11/30/08

@PhDork: This is to everyone on this thread (I am too lazy to click reply on everyone) but I LOVE this discussion. I think it's really interesting and you all are pretty spectacular. I have to go do work type things now, but I wanted to say it before I go. Also, to hellojane I totally feel you, and I'm sorry if I somewhat bitchily misinterpreted your comments. To slightlyflawed, I am not sorry. G'night, all!
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Mafalda para Presidente
11/30/08

@PhDork: Well, let's remind ourselves that these scientists are just creating something in a different area from their usual laboratories. I think there is an assumption here that science requires no creativity or imagination. So I smell snobbery on the other side as well.
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putchie
11/30/08

@PhDork: w-w-w-wait. i think it's okay to make art inspired by science. but this dance performance ergs me as well. there's a reason this person is studying vitamin D and not modern dance. uh. i think it would be really great to see some real dance inspired by science concepts, tho. there's a lot of beauty in the things we study... there's a pattern and movement to the way that systems work in biology, the way that stars interact, and the way atoms collide. what we really need is an artist and a scientist who are in love with each other or something, who can collaborate successfully to give us the art that is missing in the clip above.
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Mafalda para Presidente
11/30/08

@putchie: To be fair, this wasn't advertised to be any type of professional dancer, so I don't see the point. Should we stop every person from trying anything they're not experts on? Perhaps people without PhDs in evolutionary biology shouldn't discuss evolution. Perhaps people who aren't film majors shouldn't use video cameras.

I mean, come on.
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rah29
12/01/08

@PhDork: I'm late to this party and probably no one will respond, but the annoying social scientist in me has to ask, how do you know that these 'lab-dorks' lack what you consider to be the appropriate level of respect for performance art? Many of the dorkiest lab dorks I know are accomplished dancers, musicians and artists as well, including my sister who only very narrowly chose an MD over a career in ballet, a thespian biochemist, and two close friends working towards PhDs in geosciences who are both in awesome bands (into which they put enormous amounts of energy and hard, slogging work). One of them is such a lab dork that he once sent an email update to friends in the form of a scientific paper; I also have one of his band's albums.

As a social scientist with a Foucauldian bent who hangs out almost entirely with engineering and science PhDs, I get the frustration with the lack of respect paid to other disciplines. But I don't share the assumption that this particular prize is patronising--in part because I don't equate having fun with lack of effort, or with being patronising toward the arts. I'm sure the winners put a hell of a lot of effort into their work, which can only be a good thing in terms of increasing awareness of the effort involved in creating performance art (even crap performance art). I just think that the dichotomy you've set up is too rigid and at times fallacious.
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PhDork
12/01/08

@rah29: I DON'T know their attitudes. I never claimed to know. I'm judging only from their performance, which, to me, appears neither terribly skilled (which is totally fine) nor entirely earnest (which is what bothers me).

The dichotomy between science (serious, "hard," and masculine) and the arts (frivolous, "soft," and feminine) is hardly my invention, and I don't know quite what you read to make you thik that I'm trying to reinforce that divide. I'm not trying to keep scientists out of my rodeo; There are artistic scientists, and very "scientific" artists, too. I do not consider myself either.

That does not mean that I don't occasionally try to create art of one sort or another, and I'm not calling for a moratorium on amateur creativity; far from it. I simply stated that I think this this "Dance your Ph.D." thing is...well...crappy.

@StaceyofLiberty: To be clear, I wrote "not everyone's art is *equally* worthwhile," which implies that there is worth, to someone, in every artistic endeavor (whether experiential, financial, emotional, whatever). Clearly, I am not the "someone" they are concerned with.
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Erica
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
Only "hard" science dissertations could get away with this. I'm still bringing this to my adviser.
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Penny
11/30/08

@Erica: What do you mean by hard science? Physical sciences?

I would imagine that you could do interpretive dance for ANYTHING.
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leslieannelevine
11/30/08

@Archetype: "Get away with" as in if anyone else did it, the general reaction would be "yeah, their discipline is all bullshitting anyway. Of COURSE they're presenting in interpretive dance. Idiots."

As an English major, this is a sore spot.
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haguenite
11/30/08

@jammiriffic: Ah, we had a discussion about "hard" vs. "soft" sciences in my American philosophy class (made up of History and English majors) and us English majors immediately placed ourselves about History, because "at least we have linguistics - THAT's a hard science"!

Heh. Sore spots all around.
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Penny
11/30/08

@jammiriffic: @haguenite: I could imagine, but I tend to brush off that kind of thing in general. I've had MANY a discussion with my father about this, so I understand the sensitivity, though.
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t-yo3
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
I remember back when I was in Engineering school, we used to joke about making our project presentations via interpretive dance; seeing it done in reality is totally awesome!
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LooseBaggyMonster
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
Hey, who do science PhDs get all the fun? I'm sure a Foucauldian could put together a doozy of a performance.
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andBegorrah
11/30/08

@LooseBaggyMonster: But they would already know that it's ALL performative. Ahahahaaa....
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Cerridwen
11/30/08

@LooseBaggyMonster: I was just thinking about how I would dance Lacan...it's not pretty.
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sequined
11/30/08

@LooseBaggyMonster: I actually have a dance about monads pre-choreographed, just in case.
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Penny
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
Homeboy in the yellow shirt MAKES this performance.
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t-yo3
11/30/08

@Archetype: Lord, yes, when he leapt back on stage towards the end, I literally clapped my hands in girlish delight!
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TRexstasy
11/30/08

@Archetype: For some reason I soooo hope that's her annoying baby brother.
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andBegorrah
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
I believe this encapsulates the dissertation-writing experience (my advisor's the one on the right):

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samethingwedoeverynightpinky
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: aww.
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whatsername
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: Very accurate, heeheeheee, even if I wanted to be Ginger to my supervisor's magic paws after the umpteenth rewrite of a rewrite of a rewrite.
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PhDork
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: Ruh-roh. I'm doing a lot of paw-waving these days...I better watch out.
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PilgrimSoul
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: At least you got a bear hug from your advisor afterwards.
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PilgrimSoul
11/30/08

@PilgrimSoul: also, a philosophical friend of mine says this might be a better analogy:

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BlowJoy
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: Dude this is MY favorite video ever!! I watch it every single day. Fact.

Marry me.
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LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
11/30/08

@andBegorrah: Where's a video of a big cat forgetting to give the little cat her questions for her comprehensive exam?
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Penny
11/30/08

In reply to She Blinded Me With Science...And Awesome Dance Moves
My dad has a PhD in organic chemistry and I would have paid GOOD money to have seen explain his dissertation through interpretive dance.

Growing up I took ballet and one of my favorite things to do was position my dad across the living room and ask him to copy my moves (basically, 1st - 5th position) and it made me laaaaaaugh because he's 6'5" and not graceful.
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FourInchHeels
11/30/08

@Archetype: Awwww, what a sweet daddy that he would anyway!
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kikichanelconspiracy
11/30/08

@Archetype: Wow. Your dad sounds exactly my Organic Chemistry professor. He doesn't have red hair does he?
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Penny
11/30/08

@kikichanelconspiracy: No red hair....

@FourInchHeels: Yeah, he's great.
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