Why don't they institute an abstinence-only program of AIDS prevention in Africa? It's worked wonders completely eliminating teen pregnancy in the United States. #circumcision
They've started 'circumcision clinics' here in South Africa in order to combat the rampant spread of HIV, too. With 1,000 dying per day in this country, it's about time they started doing something about it.
However, my partner isn't circumcised, and I find myself getting defensive over the idea the circumcision is the only way to go, or a cure-all for STDs, as it's often seen here. Scientists have a point, of course - as scientists tend to do - but basic HIV education would do a lot of good, too, and that's still largely lacking. We've got a president (Zuma) who said (during his rape trial, natch) that he thought he could shower to avoid contracting HIV. Circumcision won't help much if there's not a general understanding of STDs. #circumcision
@SleepsWithButterflies: I've written about this online a few times, and I've always been surprised at what an emotional issue it is. Personally, HIV and AIDS are so incredibly destructive in sub-Saharan Africa that I'm thrilled that we've discovered that a simple and safe procedure can significantly lower the risk. But circumcision isn't a panacea, and even if every male in that part of the world were circumcised, there would still be a need for contraception, education and a huge effort to combat the disease.
When I weigh in on it, though, I tend to get dragged into the circumcision wars. I find the medical case for circumcision in the developed world to be almost entirely baseless, and I've argued so; but the anti-circumcision crowd gets on me because I support the use of circumcision in sub-Saharan Africa, or in religious or cultural practice, which is frankly none of my business. I guess it's just one of those issues that is hard to argue about dispassionately. #circumcision
@Freddie DeBoer: I totally get what you mean about the tendency to be passionate about circumcision. I didn't mean to say I'm passionate about it - I don't have a penis and I'm not connected to any religious or cultural group in which circumcision is meaningful - I meant to more insinuate my reaction to people who are passionately pro-circumcision, as if there's nothing else.
I'm new to this discussion, relatively, and I'm still surprised by how passionate people are about it. #circumcision
Education and funding for the use of circumcision to help slow the spread of HIV in sub-Saharan Africa is something I support entirely. It's worth saying, however, that HIV and AIDS epidemiology in sub-Saharan Africa is entirely different from that of the rest of the world, because of certain realities in sub-Saharan Africa. (Namely, cultural sexual practices that greatly increase the risk of blood-to-blood contact through sexual intercourse, and the prevalence and social acceptance of ulcerative genital sores caused by other STIs.)
Circumcision doesn't help outside of sub-Saharan Africa, though, because those unique factors aren't found in other parts of the world. More importantly, circumcision has no effect on the spread of HIV in what are (still) the vast majority of transmissions: male-to-male sexual intercourse and the use of intravenous drugs. Circumcision further does not lessen the risk of male-to-female infection, only female-to-male. The procedure doesn't protect the people who are at risk in the developed world, and very likely protects the people in sub-Saharan Africa because of cultural and medical realities there that are not found anywhere else in the world. #circumcision
@Freddie DeBoer: "More importantly, circumcision has no effect on the spread of HIV in what are (still) the vast majority of transmissions: male-to-male sexual intercourse and the use of intravenous drugs. Circumcision further does not lessen the risk of male-to-female infection, only female-to-male."
Just wanted to highlight these points, because they are particularly important (esp. for Western readers) to understand! Thanks for your post.
@Kivrin: THANK YOU. Male circumcision for all is not the single bullet way to end AIDS in America, and there's a lot of 1st world guys who are pissed off that their parents took from them a healthy, living piece of their anatomy. #circumcision
I really wish that the medical community would make up it's mind about circumcision. My son was not circumsized at birth because it's not common practice in his birth country and I got three medical opinions here on whether to cut or not and got three different answers. My pediatrician told me that she only has a couple kids who are not because many that hadn't initially done it ended up doing it later because of infections and UTI's. One other doctor said do it and the third said it's a personal choice but she had no official stance either way. We ended up not doing it, which now makes me nervous after reading stories like this, not because of that they said but because our insurance company said they wouldn't pay for it because they considered it elective since he didn't have it done in the hospital at birth. That's total bullshit and since there is no official stance on it (medically), they have no plans to cover it in the future unless it's done right after birth. #circumcision
@artyfarty: I'm sure this won't make you feel any better but a friend's sister who recently had a baby told me they wouldn't cover it even IN the hospital, immediately after her son's birth. #circumcision
@artyfarty: If an uncircumcised man practices regular hygiene, there are no medically supportable health benefits to circumcision. As I said above, it seems from persuasive evidence that the advantages in HIV transmission are encountered solely in the case of HIV in sub-Saharan Africa. This is not unusual, as epidemiologically speaking, sub-Saharan Africa is almost entirely unique when it comes to HIV and AIDs.
As far as cultural or religious practice, that's above my paygrade. What I've said to people in the past who are wondering about it from a medical point of view is to say that perhaps the thing to do is to wait until the child is 12 or 14 or so and ask him if he wants to have the procedure then, when he is old enough to understand the situation and, with the help of parents, make an informed decision.
People tend to respond to that by saying "But then they'll never choose to get the procedure." To which I say, perhaps the fact that only infants who have no say in the matter get the procedure done should tell you something. #circumcision
@Freddie DeBoer: Thanks again. It's really a touchy subject and I had very strong opinions coming at me from both sides. We're happy with our decision now but I just wish it had been easier to get a clear medical opinion without personal feelings getting sprinkled in or wishy washy doctors who didn't want to be responsible for our choice. We kept reading about all these terrible things that could happen and having had no experience with it, we were torn. #circumcision
@artyfarty: it's not common practice where I live either, and believe me all the little boys aren't running around with dreadful penile infections. Sometimes, infections are caused by parents not knowing what to do with an uncircumcised child's penis, i.e.: leave it alone!
@Freddie DeBoer: has it right.
@artyfarty: Infections and UTIs aren't really THAT common in boys with foreskins. I say this as a mom to two boys, both intact. :) The problems come mainly from bad information -- don't retract the foreskin, your son will do it on his own. Don't do anything "special" to wash his penis, wash it just like you would a finger. Now that my older son can wash himself, I let HIM wash his penis. He plays with the thing all the time -- I'm pretty sure it's retracting just fine.
And most insurance around me doesn't cover it at all. It's definitely considered elective to most insurance companies. #circumcision
@spamanda: Yeah, that's what I seem to hear. When I called them, she told me that since he was almost 1 (at the time) that they wouldn't cover a penny. I asked her if they would at birth and she indicated that they would, but I think she was wrong. You are also right about bad info being out there. One book I have said to pull back the foreskin and clean under it, but it looked so painful that I did more research and found that to be false. Honestly, I've had no issues with his wiener and have been following a "leave it alone" policy (aside from external cleaning.) He already plays with it constantly so I'm sure he'll have no issue with keeping it clean as he grows up. #circumcision
@spamanda: My husband wasn't circumsized either. Honestly no problems. Its just basic hygeine that everyone should practice. No plans to do it to our sons either if we have them. The whole practice weirds me out... #circumcision
DinaRonson : Elizabeth Cady Stanton promoted this comment
Edited by HappyFeminist at 10/27/09 12:26 PM
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@DinaRonson : Elizabeth Cady Stanton: Sorry if I was catty, just re-read my comment. It just happens a lot that Latin American countries are just lumped together. Example: "Oh, you're Argentine? I went to Peru once!" Drives me nuts. But that wasn't you. #condoms
@Ananelle: It's a commentary on the masks we have seen during the H1N1 scare. It means that protection is not just that, but wearing a condom.
This add was posted around all over the city for Spring Day (21st September), also known as, Student's Day. A day in which teenage kids go out and have fun (alcohol + sex) So a condom company usually puts posters up to remind teens to wear condoms. #condoms
I just want to give props to Crown Skinless Skin condoms. We've been using them exclusively for almost a year now, and I can't feel them at all (and I always felt all of the other ones I've tried). It feels great to have my libido back, as well. #birthcontrolmethods
I've been with my boyfriend for almost 2 years and we use both. Every. Single. Time.
We're poor. We've talked about going without the condom but then we found his his brother was conceived while his mother was on the Pill. It's condoms & the Pill for us until we're rich enough to afford children (which will be never.) #birthcontrolmethods
@hydrogen_jukebox: People rarely mention this, but it's worth repeating – for some (many?) women, the fear of pregnancy is detrimental to their enjoyment of sex. So going without a condom may make you 'feel' it better (though, oddly, most people can't seem to tell when the condom's slipped off or broken), but going with can give you peace of mind. #birthcontrolmethods
Before I entered a long-term monogamous relationship with someone just as paranoid as I am about pregnancy, I used the Pill and condoms. The condoms for STIs, the Pill as extra insurance against pregnancy. Boyfriend-of-Flackette and I also used condoms for a while, but then we got tested and showed each other the results, and went pill-only. The few times we've had to revert to condoms because I was on antibiotics or something, neither of us enjoyed them so we just pursued...alternate routes of pleasure during that time. Honestly, people go on and on about men not wanting to use condoms, but I find them really uncomfortable, scratchy, grabby and weird-feeling (even with lube). Nonetheless, if I found myself back on the market and having sex with non-monogamous partners again, I'd use them. I consider eschewing condoms to be one of the luxuries of a committed relationship (and the ability to tolerate hormonal birth control). #birthcontrolmethods
My birth control "controls" the liklihood that I will give "birth" by making me never want to have sex. It's pill enforced abstinence only birth control. If condoms didn't make the bedroom smell like a balloon artist's workshop and feel like doing it with a bratwurst in a ziplock bag, I'd use them. #birthcontrolmethods
@morninggloria: Ugh. Yes, it's a sucky sucky choice. Also? Large-sized unlubricated (I'm like, allergic to most lubes) condoms are nearly impossible to find. I'm giving the condoms the good old college try though, as the pill-enforced abstinence was really putting a damper on my relationship. Everything is better when I want and get sex on the regular. Everything. #birthcontrolmethods
@morninggloria: I know it's so cliched, but have you tried lambskin? They are expensive and hell, and well, you're doin it with a lamb on your dude's diddler, but they don't get that crinkly feeling. I use those and the polyurethane condoms. I hate latex, it gives me BV.
@GirlFailer: There is a new non-latex condom on the market (it's polyisoprene). It's by Lifestyles, and it's called Skyn. I saw an advert for it yesterday. I wouldn't normally re-advertise for a company, but it might be a good alternative also? #birthcontrolmethods
@elliebean: yup, I've used that one! That's what I meant when I said polyurethane, I should have looked up the actual material! They are very thin, and they aren't nearly as crinkly as latex. They are also cheaper than lambskin. #birthcontrolmethods
@Pantra: Yeah, I do. I mean, they aren't as nice as the real thing, but they are superior to latex IMO. They are really expensive though! Try them out! I wish condoms were in candy cases (like jelly beans and hard candies) so you could pick and choose a few to try out. That way you don't have 20 unused condoms that you hate. #birthcontrolmethods
@morninggloria: You've probably already researched this, but I'm in the same sitch, and I'm going to get an IUD. Maybe something to look into? #birthcontrolmethods
@questionable: I've considered it. Thing is, you're only supposed to get an IUD if you're pretty sure that you're not going to have kids for the next 5 years, and I'll probably want to start sooner. #birthcontrolmethods
10/29/09
10/29/09
However, my partner isn't circumcised, and I find myself getting defensive over the idea the circumcision is the only way to go, or a cure-all for STDs, as it's often seen here. Scientists have a point, of course - as scientists tend to do - but basic HIV education would do a lot of good, too, and that's still largely lacking. We've got a president (Zuma) who said (during his rape trial, natch) that he thought he could shower to avoid contracting HIV. Circumcision won't help much if there's not a general understanding of STDs. #circumcision
10/29/09
When I weigh in on it, though, I tend to get dragged into the circumcision wars. I find the medical case for circumcision in the developed world to be almost entirely baseless, and I've argued so; but the anti-circumcision crowd gets on me because I support the use of circumcision in sub-Saharan Africa, or in religious or cultural practice, which is frankly none of my business. I guess it's just one of those issues that is hard to argue about dispassionately. #circumcision
10/29/09
I'm new to this discussion, relatively, and I'm still surprised by how passionate people are about it. #circumcision
10/29/09
Circumcision doesn't help outside of sub-Saharan Africa, though, because those unique factors aren't found in other parts of the world. More importantly, circumcision has no effect on the spread of HIV in what are (still) the vast majority of transmissions: male-to-male sexual intercourse and the use of intravenous drugs. Circumcision further does not lessen the risk of male-to-female infection, only female-to-male. The procedure doesn't protect the people who are at risk in the developed world, and very likely protects the people in sub-Saharan Africa because of cultural and medical realities there that are not found anywhere else in the world. #circumcision
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10/29/09
Just wanted to highlight these points, because they are particularly important (esp. for Western readers) to understand! Thanks for your post.
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As far as cultural or religious practice, that's above my paygrade. What I've said to people in the past who are wondering about it from a medical point of view is to say that perhaps the thing to do is to wait until the child is 12 or 14 or so and ask him if he wants to have the procedure then, when he is old enough to understand the situation and, with the help of parents, make an informed decision.
People tend to respond to that by saying "But then they'll never choose to get the procedure." To which I say, perhaps the fact that only infants who have no say in the matter get the procedure done should tell you something. #circumcision
10/29/09
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@Freddie DeBoer: has it right.
10/29/09
And most insurance around me doesn't cover it at all. It's definitely considered elective to most insurance companies. #circumcision
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Time to close the doors. #condoms
10/27/09
Brazil, Buenos Aires, what's the difference?
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This add was posted around all over the city for Spring Day (21st September), also known as, Student's Day. A day in which teenage kids go out and have fun (alcohol + sex) So a condom company usually puts posters up to remind teens to wear condoms. #condoms
10/27/09
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10/20/09
We're poor. We've talked about going without the condom but then we found his his brother was conceived while his mother was on the Pill. It's condoms & the Pill for us until we're rich enough to afford children (which will be never.) #birthcontrolmethods
10/20/09
Belts and Suspenders, FTW. #birthcontrolmethods
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My birth control "controls" the liklihood that I will give "birth" by making me never want to have sex. It's pill enforced abstinence only birth control. If condoms didn't make the bedroom smell like a balloon artist's workshop and feel like doing it with a bratwurst in a ziplock bag, I'd use them. #birthcontrolmethods
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