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India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
Until Divorce Do Us Part

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yvanehtnioj
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
If that face doesn't say "Quit taking my f*cking picture!" I don't know what does. #childmarriageindia
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The Real Janelle
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
"I know the government says we should marry at 18, but even at 12 or 15, it's difficult to keep a girl's honor. And by 18, if unmarried, they get crazy thoughts."
I think this is it. If only we could make everybody understand that your virginity is by NO means tied to any sort of honor...
Also, I've always been bothered at the fact that losing your virginity is not so much being dishonored yourself, but it's that you're dishonoring the poor men in charge of you. How darling. #childmarriageindia
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killershrew
11/13/09

@The Real Janelle: No kidding. My WTF moment reading the passage you quoted was along the lines of "And why exactly is it so difficult for 12- and 15-year-olds to keep their honor? Is it because people are messing with them who have no right to do so? And why is that the girls' fault?" Sheesh. #childmarriageindia
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MargaretMoony
11/13/09

@The Real Janelle: We've been having a discussion similar to this in my Hebrew Bible class about "The
Story of Dinah." Dinah can't go out and lose her virginity because it's not hers. It belongs to her father since she's his proprietey. The matter of importance in the story isn't if Dinah was raped or not, it's that Jacob's (her father) propriety was violated.
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Edited by MargaretMoony at 11/13/09 8:23 PM MargaretMoony was starred MargaretMoony was unstarred

Scribblenerd
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
And here at home, the ERA is on the congressional agenda, as it has been every year since 1923. American women are not full citizens with complete rights, either. #childmarriageindia
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sybann
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
Women as property - chattel. More like cattle. #childmarriageindia
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Kivrin
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
The world makes me very sad sometimes*.

*Every day
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Edited by Kivrin at 11/13/09 1:46 PM Kivrin was starred Kivrin was unstarred

Hooplehead
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
"In 1992, Bhanwari Devi, a village woman working for a nonprofit group, was gang-raped after she tried to prevent a child marriage. The accused men were acquitted on the grounds that "upper caste men, including a Brahmin, would not rape a woman of a lower caste," according to the court ruling."

Seriously, WTF India? The fact that the caste system is being used as a rape defense shouldn't surprise me, but somehow still does. #childmarriageindia
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LexiD523
11/13/09

@Hooplehead: I was under the impression that the caste system had been abolished, and therefore would not be a legally valid defense. #childmarriageindia
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KaneBaker
11/13/09

@LexiD523: I know someone here in north america that was disowned by her family of doctors after she married an indian guy in IT (not up to par with the doctors caste). Than her family proceeded to send her bills for the education they paid for, since she was not their daughter any more.

I like diverse culture, but hey India, the caste system is fucking stupid. It's alive and well in North America never mind India. #childmarriageindia
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Hooplehead
11/13/09

@LexiD523: According to the ruling quoted above in the LAT, it was valid enough to get the scumbags off. #childmarriageindia
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Erda
11/13/09

@KaneBaker: It's like racial segregation here in America. Sure, it's not legally mandated anymore, but the de facto barriers are still there.

I thought the caste system was gone with the wind too, until I realized all my Indian-American friends (who all come from affluent, well-educated backgrounds) are Brahmins or Kshatriyas.* The lower castes aren't the ones with the resources to make it into the top universities and then get jobs as doctors or engineers in America.

*"Priest" and "warrior" castes, for those not as familiar with Indian culture. The two highest castes. #childmarriageindia
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rikki-tikki-tavi
11/13/09

@Erda: My family's from the lowest caste possible in India, and yet they have tons of money in their family. Enough that my great grandfather started a non-profit K-12 and college for underprivileged girls and women, and my father recently paying the start up cost and building for non-profit university for underprivileged Indian children.
There is also laws in lots of places in India which are affirmative action but for low caste students. Mandating that a certain percentage of seats are only given to low caste students.

Your friends being of similar caste has to do more with their family's social circle. I know tons of poor Brahmins and Kshatriyas (just like I've seen very dark Brahmins, and my grandmother is as light as most 'white' women in the US).

Sadly, America isn't as good as it use to be in trying to break the economic ties of professionals. In recent years more students are limited into entering medical and law school from how much money their family makes. #childmarriageindia
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Marken.Baker
11/13/09

@Hooplehead: I'm not surprised. No matter what the Indian gov. says the caste system is alive and well. My husband is a Brahman and his family takes the caste system very seriously and did all sorts of awful things to try to break us up including on the day we got married. They thought they'd get to pick him a Brahman bride from their subcaste and him getting married to a WASP was definitely not what they had planned.
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Hana Maru, used up old slutbag on the pole
11/13/09

@LexiD523: Caste has been abolished by the constitution, and discrimination is illega. There is also some affirmative action for the dalits, but it's still well entrenched in the culture and Hindu religion. #childmarriageindia
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Erda
11/13/09

@rikki-tikki-tavi: Sorry for the misunderstanding. I had also been told by my friends that most affluent Indian-Americans are Brahmins or Kshatriyas, so I wasn't just jumping to conclusions, but apparently they were.

It's nice to see that the caste system is not as rigid as I thought it was, though apparently there is still a lot of work that needs to be done. #childmarriageindia
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kavitabk
11/14/09

@Hooplehead: Not only that but upper-caste men are ESPECIALLY likely to rape Dalit and other lower-caste women. As we know rape is a tool of exerting power, control and authority over a vulnerable person, that is exactly what this situation was all about. Not to mention the literally countless incidents of gang rape and murder of Dalits by upper-caste people. #childmarriageindia
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Kivrin
11/13/09

In reply to India's Child Brides Say "I Don't"
I'm curious about the justification for legal marrying age being 21 for males and 18 for females. #childmarriageindia
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PhDelish
11/13/09

@Kivrin: I doubt it's the whole "boys take longer to mature" thing - I think that's probably a culture specific aphorism. I don't know, either! #childmarriageindia
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CrankyOldBroad
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
What is it about fundamentalist religions like this and the mormon one that makes them believe it's okay to marry old geezers to female children? I'm sorry, I genuinely don't understand how the logic could equal such an epic fail and still be sanctioned by their faith.
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CordeliaShirley
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
The sigh of relief I just gave was HUGE. I'm so glad it turned out this way. (Of course, it would have been better if she'd never been in the situation in the FIRST place, but still.)
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Triana Orpheus
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
"I'm Karen. I like riding my bikes, playing with my Barbies and building things out of legos."

"I'm Jessica. I like eating ice cream, climbing trees, I just got divorced and I really like to watch Spongebob."
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fireflyinjuly
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
Great, old man, now agree that marrying an 8 year old is creepy. Ok, thnx!
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meritxell: an erotic life
04/30/09

@fireflyinjuly: Whoa, slow down there shortstack! Next thing you'll be asking for him to agree that the wimmens can drive.
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Aesop's Foibles. YES.
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
While I'm so relieved and happy for that little baby girl, I'm also sickened at the fact that the outcome of her case is a rarity and so many other little baby girls will not be so lucky. I have to wonder, too....does she really understand what was going on? I mean what the implications were of her being someone's wife? I kind of hope not, but as she grows up, she'll understand it perfectly and it'll probably cause her a great deal of disbelief and sadness that this actually happened to her.
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Benevolent_Dictatrix (patently absurd)
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
Thank God. I wish someone would set up a college fund or something for this little girl. I would send whatever I could spare.
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MissyMcCLung
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
I am so glad they got a new judge on the case. It was ridiculous that the same judge rules in both the original case and the appeal.

And I am so happy about this. good news!
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NefariousNewt
04/30/09

In reply to Until Divorce Do Us Part
Now, will the mother petition the court from a divorce from the father, for such a despicable act as marrying off his 8-year-old daughter to a 50-year-old man?
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Triana Orpheus
04/30/09

@NefariousNewt: Her mother has her. I hope that she never has to see her father or uncle again.
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