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Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness

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lilydancing
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Why did she want to work in the 3rd circle of Hell in the first place? Damn.
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Red-headed bookworm
06/24/09

@lilydancing: Maybe she wanted an employee discount on their clothes? It doesn't really matter why she wanted to work there, they shouldn't be able to treat people that way.
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hydrogen_jukebox
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Would it be too much if I snuck into the A&F store here in my local mall and sewed the arm and leg holes closed of as many garments as I could?

Surreptitious Revolution!
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♥AntiSocialSocialite♥
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
" so the managers will know what good-looking minorities look like"

head ASPLODE:

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oxidizedalexis
06/24/09

@♥Anti-Social Socialite♥: It's like they're giving instructions on how to pick out a viable pet or something. Also, I know this is not nearly the most heinous aspect of this statement, but why are they acting as if minorities are freaks of nature whose beauty is so incomprehensible that it needs to be outlined in excruciating detail?
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♥AntiSocialSocialite♥
06/24/09

@oxidizedalexis: precisely - like breed standards at a kennel club show. i'm soooo grossed out.
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pax
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
I hate A&F so much that I won't even buy their clothes used on eBay. I used to work at a store in a mall that was right next to A&F and those "models" or "brand representatives" or whatever were the most insufferable humans in the building at any given time. And their store was messy and loud to boot.

As someone above said, I would never give a dime to a store that wouldn't hire me (assuming that I'm tidy, responsible, and otherwise reasonably well-qualified). AnystoreotherthanA&F FTW.
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Aesop's Foibles. YES.
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Jesus Christ. I think maybe someone in charge at A&F started to emulate their loyal shoppers in thinking they were better than everyone else. Snobbery isn't even the word here. Know what is?? DISCRIMINATION. I hope that lovely young lady and her awesome-sounding mom tear the ass out of A&F. And maybe even put them and their bastard child, Hollister, out of business for good. Man. I hate this shit. But I'm almost tempted to go and apply there wearing an obvious hearing aid or walking with a cane or something, and present the hiring manager with my resume, detailing my experience as a commission-based sales associate at Neiman Marcus. How much you wanna bet I wouldn't get the job? How much you wanna bet that position would go to some perfect-looking fifteen year old who's never had a job before? Yeah, a lot.
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bluebears
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Classy. It sounds like when they found out about her arm they actively attempted to make her work environment so horrible she'd quit (and they wouldn't be on the hook for firing her). hostile workplace much?
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Abra
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
I would be SO interested in seeing that model employee visual guide. Maybe Jez could put out a call along the lines of the infamous Faith Hill Photoshop cover?
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eriatric
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
But Akash Nawbatt, representing Abercrombie & Fitch, argued that Miss Dean had deliberately played up the effect of her experiences.

He referred to a medical assessment Miss Dean underwent to secure disability funding for university.

The report described her as "becoming socially isolated" and unable to use public transport because of anxiety.

Mr Nawbatt told Miss Dean: "Just as you are exaggerating in the report, you are exaggerating what happened at Abercrombie and the effect it had on you."

what a ray of sunshine Mr. Nawbatt seems to be.
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

@eriatric: What do you expect from a lawyer? He hired a seamus to dig up everything they could about her, and seeks to smear her name in the press. Feelins' don't enter into it...
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AndNowForSomethingDifferent
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
My younger sister was "recruited" by Hollister a month ago, and being the jobless gal she is, she went to the interview. They liked her, and asked her back for a second one.

At the second interview they gave her a detailed description of their "look policy", and that shit about the fingernails and hair is absolutely, 100% true. They also cannot have paint on their nails, unless it's nude or a french manicure. Toes must also be nude or french manicure. Hair cannot be dyed, ie. you cannot have visible roots, and you'll be told what style fits the season, whether up or down. She was also told she couldn't wear any "ethnic" makeup (we live in Toronto, who the hell do you think is shopping there?).

Guys don't have as stringent rules, but they must always be clean shaven on their shift.

My sister told them, thanks, but no thanks.
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ZemarSea Urchin
06/24/09

@AndNowForSomethingDifferent: Umm..sadly, its kinda common practice to have a dress code in retail stores so all that hair and nails crap could apply in any store. And it is made clear that if you come in not looking like the style that is projected by the store then you will be sent home. Though most places don't say no ethnic make-up that is definetly over the line.
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

@ZemarSea Urchin: Well, a dress code is one thing -- I refuse to shop in a store where the staff looks slovenly. But this goes beyond the bounds of logic, especially given the penchant of the "employees" for not helping the customers.
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ArtfulSlinger
06/24/09

@AndNowForSomethingDifferent: As a retail associate there, you are not an actual customer service person, but merely a model. The starting hourly wage there was less than it was at Wet Seal (yikes showing my retail experience) and group interviews are held to weed out those who dont fit the descriptions. The male models who stand in front of certain stores are actual models and are compensated at about $25 an hour.

This place is truly hell and smells like a baby prostitute.
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
And as a side note, I'm looking at the picture posted with this article, and I ask you, how apparent is it that she has a prosthetic? At first glance, not too obvious (especially if they never noticed it when they hired her for the job), save for a tonal difference in the color, but it may just be the angle of the light in that picture. Other than that, it's hard to tell, and she's quite attractive. Why they felt the need to hide her is beyond me.
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Katxyz
06/24/09

@NefariousNewt:

It sounds like it took a while for her management to even notice, since they hire based on looks and she must have come into apply, to interview and possibly to train before being put on the floor.

I know there was a woman who worked at a shop in a mall near me where I went frequently, and I didn't notice she had a prosthetic until maybe the 5 or 6th time I saw her in there, and she worked the register/bagged my purchases every time.
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

@Katxyz: Modern prosthetics are becoming more life-like and advanced all the time, especially those for arms/hands. I'll bet the manager was a mite embarrassed at missing such an obvious thing, which probably contributed to her being "hidden," lest the powers-that-be find out.
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Rare Affinity
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
My friend told me bout this last week. I cannot believe a large company could be so stupid as to have allowed this to happen. As a Director of Resouces, HR comes under my remit and I am forever drumming it into managers that the best defence, indeed only defence, at an Employment Tribunal is to have followed Employment Law to the letter. This seem to be a flagrant breach of the Disability Discrimination Act. I suspect the young woman will be in line for a substantial out of court settlement. If anyone outside of the company were able to get hold of a copy of the guidebook in the UK, Abercrombie could find themselves at the centre of a punitive lawsuit as there is no upper limit on damages for racism.
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colormeroutine
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Abercrombie also, from what I hear, almost never hires people who ask for an application but hand them out to shoppers who they think are "attractive enough"
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Flackette Goes Retro
06/24/09

@colormeroutine: This is true, according to what employees have told me.
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Penny_Esq
06/24/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: I got mine from a girlfriend who already worked there.
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kithkin
06/24/09

@colormeroutine: Yes, I've actually seen them chase young women nearly out of the store. These are invariably very thin, clear-skinned women who are probably already wearing clothes from the store.
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Aesop's Foibles. YES.
06/24/09

@colormeroutine: That is true. I was in there (years ago!!) minding my own goddamn business and one of the girls working there asks me out of nowhere if I was interested in working there because I had their look. I actually laughed in her face and told her, no thanks, I'm twenty-three and have a career.
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Sputnik_Sweetheart
06/24/09

@..now it's just Aesop's Foibles.: Awesome. What was her reaction?
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Penny_Esq
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
A&F settled a humongous race/gender discrimination case about four years ago. I got almost $3,000 because my hours were minimal and mostly late-night t-shirt folding rather than daytime interaction with customers. (Although we weren't supposed to talk to customers, actually. We were called "Brand Representatives," and we were supposed to be some kind of aspirational symbol rather than a helpful employee.) I never thought my hours had anything to do with my gender or looks, but I was 18 at the time - I just thought my job sucked. But I was in law school when I got the class action papers, and once I read about how widespread and pervasive these practices were, it became clear it was company policy to schedule the way they did.

All of which is to say, I'm surprised they're still trying to pull this shit. I'm not sure what the discrimination laws are in the UK, but as far as I'm concerned this girl deserves WAY more than 20,000 pounds. They should fucking know better by now.
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willwriteforfood
06/24/09

@Penny_Esq has a new job!: Man, I hope you enjoyed that $3,000. You deserve combat pay for working there, in my book!
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squinko
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
I remember when this story was posted on Consumerist and all of the big business apologists came out of the woodwork with their nitpicking. Saying stupid crap like: "Oh well, she wasn't put in the back room because of her disability, but because she was breaking the rules by wearing a cardigan.", "Even though her employers told her that she could wear the cardigan, she should've known it was against the rules.", and my personal favorite, "She wasn't fired, she quit. It's her own fault." If I had more free time, I'd pull out exact quotes.

Some people will defend anything. I hope that A&F gets sued like crazy and goes out of business.
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willwriteforfood
06/24/09

@squinko - doesn't need firefighters: I read those comments! They drove me bats! What is wrong with people, that they cannot just see this as morally wrong by any standard, even if they could parse out the rationalization to the point that it suddenly becomes the employee's fault she wore an approved cardigan? WTF?
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

In reply to Banished Employee, Others Speak Out Against Abercrombie's Awfulness
Heard the details this morning on The BBC News Hour and was aghast that they had a 45-page manual on how employees should look. The panelist being interviewed (name escapes me) said it was not unusual in the fashion industry, and that A&F filled it stores with models or near-models, trying to encourage customers to want to "look as good as the staff."

Personally, I don't care what the staff looks like, as long as they can find me what I am looking for. I've never shopped in A&F, and I'm not about to start, or to encourage anyone else to, since they seem hell-bent on enforcing the idea that everyone should look "beautiful."
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Penny_Esq
06/24/09

@NefariousNewt: The staff at Abercrombie will not be able to find what you are looking for, because they are expressly instructed not to do so. If someone asked me directly for a size they couldn't find, I'd do my best to find it for them, but I definitely got asked more than once by a manager why I was wasting time looking for size 10 jeans rather than maintaining the straightness of the shirt tables.
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

@Penny_Esq has a new job!: It sounds like some new, hip and trendy, farcical version of Are You Being Served?. What exactly is the point of having employees at all, if they won't help you? Call them models, have robots pull up inventory, and be done with it.
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Jezebellicose/Queenjulie
06/24/09

@NefariousNewt: Actually, most clothing stores have a fairly extensive manual on employee appearance. I worked at Casual Corner and Petite Sophisticate (clothing stores for professional women and older women, generally) for several years, and we had to wear only clothes purchased at the store, and had very specific regulations on okay hair styles, make up (you were required to wear some, and the colors and heaviness allowed were clearly indicated), style and height of shoes, and fingernail polish color. Granted, those stores didn't do any of the racial/ability/age discrimination that A&F is doing, but they still had a large manual regarding employee appearance.

(It coudl have been worse, though--at Ann Taylor, employees are required to purchase all their work clothes from the store, using a store credit card. At 25% interest.)
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NefariousNewt
06/24/09

@queenjulie: Madness. Total madness.
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ArtfulSlinger
06/24/09

@NefariousNewt: I remember when I was younger and working in retail, before I had tattoos, they tried to snag me from another store. And while they paid nearly a dollar less an hour than the other place, they basically told me I would DO NO WORK. Which is why a year later, my friend was able to walk into that store and leave with beach bags full of merchandise. I never supported their thing, but I dont understand how this is a big deal, but their normal discrimination isnt?

Also, my male friend, who wears about an XL, had to pay 5 dollars extra on a sale shirt years ago and when I asked the guy who worked there why he looked at my friend and said "Because maybe you need more material". I lost it and yelled for the manager and blew a gasket.
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Vivelafat says Sweep the leg, Johnny.
06/24/09

@NefariousNewt: I really wish there was a way to force them to hire me. I would wear clothes 2 sizes too small and never brush my teeth or hair. I would act like I was teh hotness and insult any customer who came in. It would be brilliant.
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Red-headed bookworm
06/24/09

@queenjulie: Well, I can see only wearing that stores clothes while you were working there and to have a dress code, but a dress code and discriminating on looks are two different things. Most any place you work has some sort of dress code.
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Mav
06/24/09

@queenjulie: That's actually incorrect. I worked at Ann Taylor and was not REQUIRED to wear their clothes, I was not even strongly suggested to. Just, I had to wear clothing that was along the same lines as.
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