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ChildBride
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
I hate to rain on this 'she-worked-her-way-up' idea, but it's not as if Kotur got her career through sheer pluck. She grew up on the Upper East Side and attended Chapin, which is a very expensive girls private school, and then after college, her mother, who was a fashion illustrator at Conde Nast, got her a job at GQ in London. Here's the gimme from the article: "Close family friends included Andrea Robinson, a beauty editor at Vogue under Grace Mirabella, and former House & Garden editor Mary Jane Pool." This is not some triumph-over-the-odds story here, gang. There is still no room for YOU, plebe.
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Trulymadlyme
04/29/09

@ChildBride: This is so freaking true. I did a short stint as a journalist before the poverty got the best of me. This field really is for the wealthiest types of people. You're going to have a difficult time getting hired and moving up absent some serious society connections (speaking from my CondeHell experience).
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MissAmy
04/29/09

@ChildBride: Exactly. And her comment about the assistants smacks of someone who has the luxury to take unpaid internships while living off of a trust fund.

I dunno, she just doesn't impress me that much. Also, unpaid internships that are supposed to be treated like a real job are one of my pet peeves.
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ChildBride
04/29/09

@MissAmy: There's a difference between interns and assistants, though. Assistants are paid, albeit minimally.
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Trulymadlyme
04/29/09

@ChildBride: Yep. I pulled in a cool $24,000 when I worked as an editorial assistant. Sigh.
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BlondeGoddess
04/29/09

@Trulymadlyme: My experience is completely the opposite: I had no connections, no contacts, no family relations, and still got a chance. Granted, this was not in NYC. And the one experience I've had with Conde Naste was pretty CondeNasty. Ugh. I still get angry thinking about it.
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Trulymadlyme
04/29/09

@BlondeGoddess: My gig kind of came out of left field, too. But after a week there, I pretty much realized my future at condenasty was sort of dead end. Plus, I was tired of working nights to support my journalism habit.
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andthentheresme
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
Can we talk about this?

"I think a closet full of things would actually stress me out. I just think this whole thing about not wearing anything twice, I just don't understand it. I think things should be worn. You should bond with your clothing. It should be yours. If you're in this industry and you're looking at clothes all day, I sort of just want to stay neutral. I respect trends because that's our industry and I enjoy it, but for myself, I'm just not really interested."

Good grief, yes! Can we get back to less "disposable" clothing (the term & thought makes me ill) and more style? Please? I'm looking at you, H&M.

Cute yes, bonding and personality? No.

That said, I will still peruse options there, but truth be told, rarely buy. I loathe the disposable mentality.
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save jinger
04/29/09

@andthentheresme: I didn't realize that cheap clothes were supposed to disposable until I read that on here, I think. I guess I have committed a faux pas by still wearing clothes from H&M and Target that I bought like three years ago...
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BlondeGoddess
04/29/09

@andthentheresme: McFashion, as I like to call it. I think this is the perfect time (of economical and environmental isssues) to think about who you are instead of 'who' you wear. What's really your style? What can't you live without? What are you willing to spend money on? Buying less, and making better choices that will last a lot longer in your wardrobe: the new consumerism, I hope.
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andthentheresme
04/29/09

@save_jinger: I realize that not ALL H&M and Forever 21 clothes are like this - I have a pair of black pants I bought at H&M probably 4 years ago that I wear endlessly and they haven't fallen apart. But so much of it is. This crazy madness rush to the factory with copying the latest styles in the cheapest materials possible is just ridiculous.

I appreciate fashion and style. I just think too many people equate trendy with style, thus resulting in a slew of disposable-type clothing choices.
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save jinger
04/29/09

@andthentheresme: Yeah, I totally get where you're coming from. I just don't really pay attention to trends, so I buy what I like and keep it as long as it's in decent shape. And some of the cheap stuff lasts a lot longer than you'd think it would.
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BlondeGoddess
04/29/09

@save_jinger: Ypu must have a good eye! Most of the stuff I get at the cheap chains don't last that long (read: fall apart after three washings).
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tscheese
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
But it's an obvious irony that the people who make the best role models, like Ms. Kotur, are often not the ones seeking the public eye

This is a very good point.

Nowadays it seems that "role models" only rise to attention (and thus, regrettably, become the example after which the credulous seek to model their lives) because of some grasp at fame, whether it's ill-advised or not. Certainly there are a lot of famous people, I'm sure, who have a lot of good, positive attributes and who would like to set a good example for others.

But for every decent, well-meaning human who happens to be in the public eye, it seems like there's a million shallow, tactless, ill-informed "celebrities" with too many busted extensions and too much makeup. And to whom does an adoring public turn their rapturous eyes to? Whom do they seek to emulate?

I dunno. I wish there were more smart, decent role models. Today it seems like fast fame and flash-in-the-pan glamour is the hottest shit ever. People love flashy zero-to-hero stories, troubled starlets, cheap and fast ascents to fame, etc.

I guess I could go back to my ol' rallying cry: "Can't people be recognized for their merits, accomplishments, skills, and talents, rather than by how many makeup artists they employ"? but I fear it's passe.
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tscheese
04/29/09

@tscheese: Also, I am officially an Old now, insulting the Whippersnappers of Today, wondering what is wrong with the Kids These Days, and wishing that nice, talented, genuine folks would get ahead. Obviously it's time for my afternoon Metamucil as soon as I shuffle out of this enormous floral housedress and you get off my lawn.
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Plum-Pie
04/29/09

@tscheese: That post from last week about feeling a sense of community? It reminded me of the people I know locally who have no interest in any sort of glamour and just get on with stuff and are a good example to me (and anyone else who cares to notice.)
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pandorasmittens
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
Well, it was Plato (or Socrates, if you believe Plato was a transcriber of these dealings) that said, "the best man fit to rule is the one who does not wish to rule" or something like that.
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Trulymadlyme
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
I was thinking about that the other day when I read a Joan Didion interview. I guess her first foray into writing was due to winning some sort of contest Vogue had at the time, which essentially plucked smart women from colleges and gave jobs at magazines that are nearly impossible to land absent today (absent some sort of crazy wealth, society, celebrity connection). I guess fashion journalism was more democratic at that time, in a way. When Vogue was as much a fashion magazine as it was a literary and journalistic enterprise.

I kind of wonder if this is the reason why magazines are in decline. I can't tell you how many times I read an article and just shrug. It's not interesting or particularly well written. Fashion magazine content, unlike this woman, is simply uninspiring.
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BlondeGoddess
04/29/09

@Trulymadlyme: Also, Vogue was the first to publish Lee Miller's photos of concentration camps.
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Trulymadlyme
04/29/09

@BlondeGoddess: Right? I got a W randomly this month (due to every magazine I subscribe to going under) and was shocked at how meh it was. I liked the profile well enough, but there wasn't anything written that I found more engaging and better written than anything online.
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BlondeGoddess
04/29/09

@Trulymadlyme: Their circulation dwindles, they sell less and less ads - wouldn't you think fashion mags would go and try to get more readers? By publishing more interesting, and better written stories? It seems so simple! Yet they go on underestimating their audience.
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Penny
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
"It's O.K. to be an assistant. Sometimes people come out of school right now and they immediately want a job doing something. And there's nothing wrong with just listening and learning and watching."

Oh, God bless her. I can't stand whiny recent grads unwilling to do any work they consider "beneath" their education.
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Jello Mix
04/29/09

@Penny Plastic: I graduated college with people who were refusing jobs because they paid less than $100,000/year. It's unbelievable what some think they're entitled to simply because they bought a piece of paper.
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rednrowdy
04/29/09

@Penny Plastic: "And there's nothing wrong with just listening and learning and watching."

how about not so recent grads who just want to keep their job?

i think the problem is that listening, learning and watching doesn't equal DOING in the minds of recent grads.
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argle-bargle? or fou-ferraw?
04/29/09

@Jello Mix inspired Little Chocolate Donuts, No. 5: whoa. i've never been around anyone like that... though, now that i think about it, this is probably because i went to art school and none of us really expected high-paying jobs right out of undergrad (or ever.)
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MissAmy
04/29/09

@Penny Plastic: I get that, but at the same time, I think the proliferation of unpaid internships is really sucky. Some of us can't live off of Mommy and Daddy while we work 60 hours a week for no money. I really wish I could, but I can not.
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Penny
04/29/09

@MissAmy: I had an unpaid internship, I also worked and took out loans.
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MissAmy
04/29/09

@Penny Plastic: Not everyone wants to go even further into debt after graduating from school.
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Penny
04/29/09

@MissAmy: I'm sorry, I am not really understanding your point. You want internships to fully fund your education? That's not going to happen.
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tscheese
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
What does it say that being quietly professional and uninterested in celebrity makes someone a fascinating curiosity?

In that case, can I please be T. "Fascinating Curiosity" Tscheese? Plz?
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AtomiClash: humanitarian misanthrope
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
there is nothing wrong with obscurity. Moreover, there is nothing wrong with complete anonymity in whatever you do. Our cultural desire for recognition is unnerving. And as this story tacitly shows, if everyone is a celebrity, no one is actually celebrated for anything meaningful.
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krismry
04/30/09

@AtomiClash is a ball-cutting cybersuccubus: Yep. Anonymity actually aimed for is like the highest form of nonchalance.
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Jello Mix
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
I'd much rather be dignified and obscure than ridiculous and widely known.
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JessicaLovejoy: Laughing, riding, cornholing!
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
Kelly: Oh my God. I have so much to tell you!

Jim: Really?

Kelly: Yes! Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes, they had a baby and they named it Suri and then Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie, they had a baby too and they named it Shilo and both babies are amazing!

Jim : Great. What's new with you?

Kelly: .....I just told you.
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Dodgergirl
04/29/09

@JessicaLovejoy: Laughing, riding, cornholing!: heee. such an awesome scene. also, a great moment on the blooper reel.
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MarissaExplainsItAll
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
She sounds cool. I would imagine that at most she tolerates Plum Sykes.
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greengrey
04/29/09

@MarissaExplainsItAll: That's more than I would be able to do.

Sykes makes me gag.
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MarissaExplainsItAll
04/29/09

@greengrey: I always skip her articles. I like feeling smart every now and again, but COME ON.
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Flackette Goes Retro
04/29/09

In reply to Vogue's Resident Lady Makes Us Like Vogue (A Little)
If you live in a small town your birth is definitely in the paper.
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morninggloria
04/29/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: Oh shit yeah. I was in the paper at least once a week from age 11 until I graduated from high school and even after. There's a column called "Town Talk And County Chatter" and it like talks about people going over to visit other people. I'm not even kidding.
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Penny
04/29/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: Mine was.
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Penny
04/29/09

@Penny Plastic: Population 7,000.
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so5minutesago
04/29/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: With a little write-up, if your town is really small!
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morninggloria
04/29/09

@so5minutesago: My mom wrote for the newspaper at the time. The editor took a half page "WELCOME TO XXXXXX, BABY (my real name)"

There was a picture of a baby girl wearing a diaper and flowers and stuff. My mom cut it out and put it in a scrapbook.

My brother was the first baby born during the month of June, which is dairy month. Being that we lived in America's Dairyland, the nearest county dairy sent my parents a gigantic basket of cheese. The paper ran a picture of my baby brother laying in the middle of the basket of cheese and ran it on the front page.
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LindsayC: doctoral hilarity ensues
04/29/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: Every Sunday in Las Vegas they list all of the births from each hospital. So even in fairly large cities, it's in there. Marriages and deaths you have to ask for, but births are automatic.
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hfree
04/29/09

@Flackette Goes Retro: Even sometimes in large cities. I love going through my grandfather's baby book, which has a clipping from the Baltimore Sun announcing his birth. Later, when the family had moved to Athens, GA, the Athens Banner Herald ran a piece about his 4th b-day in the society column and listed all the other 4-year-olds who came! It's just so weird and fun and old fashioned.

My parents always worked for the local newspaper and there was a strict "no hfree in the paper" rule.
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