Jezebel
True story that I wrote in three minutes because that's exactly how much time I felt like dwelling on it: this one time about nine years ago I got locked out of my house and went home with some vaguely smarmy hair-product using type from my ex-boyfriend's frat. I had slept with maybe two or three guys prior to that — it was the summer between sophomore and junior year of college — so when he, after about a half hour of fooling around, put on a condom I was like, "Whooooah, what are you doing?" But I'd had two forties and I kept drifting in and out of consciousness — my tolerance, obviously, wasn't what it is today — and I woke up to find him sticking it in. I'd said 'no' a bunch of times and when I came to I just froze, stopped, turned over and slept. In the morning I chewed him out (by informing him I wasn't putting him on "my list" — oh no she didn't!) and after that he kissed my ass so liberally I thought he might have learned from it.
But then in Israel I saw this other girl who used to hook up with him and she assured me he remains a douchebag, only now one that practices medicine in New York. Anyway, I sure hope he saves some lives, and I remember that sexual experience a little more vividly than most of the consensual sexual experiences I've undergone in a similar state of intoxication, but neither sentiment makes it RAPE, does it? It's something, "date rape" I guess, but it's not rape unless I say it was, right?
All of which is a poignant, personal way of alerting you to the fact that Cosmo has come up with a new name for this kind of nonviolent collegiate date-rape sort of happening: gray rape.
And some feminists are angry, and they've launched a letter-writing campaign about it, though if you're reading Cosmo for purposes other than to revel in its unique special brand of inanity you have bigger issues with your sexual identity than what to call that time you fucked that guy you didn't really want to fuck. I'm not sure what to think about any of this, because while Laura Session Stepp (the writer of the Cosmo story) is a tool, reading the individual stories of "gray rape" victims that so closely mirrored my own — they got too drunk! they said no, but then they passed out! when they realized they were having sex, they stopped! — I felt absolutely nothing. It was one drunken regrettable night. One of so, so many more to come. And I have found that when a guy demeans you in a drunken state, it is more likely to stick with you and haunt you if you give anything resembling a shit about his opinion.
And come to think about it, how gross do you have to be to fuck someone when it's, like, three Goldschlager body shots away from being necrophilia?
Battling The Myth Of "Gray Rape" [Talking Points Memo]
No Such Thing As Gray Rape [NYC Against Rape]
Comments
Well, that is rape in some states.
same thing happened to me freshman year in college after a frat party i went to where i was set up w the brother of my friend's date. i was unconscious/passed out and came to and he was having sex with my body.
If we would only teach young men that sex with really drunk women is boring and awkward, maybe we wouldn't have these problems.
(And yes, Laura Sessions Stepp is a giant tool.)
@socalsnarkstress: How is that not rape? Or are you saying it was?
How is there any doubt that drunken, passed-out, non-consensual sex is anything BUT flat out RAPE?
@socalsnarkstress: how pathetic is it to fuck someone who is passed out?
Laura Sessions Stepp wrote this?!?! She's been splayed all over Wonkette for, what is it, years now? The woman is notoriously out-of-it -- she wrote a daring exposé on the art of the wingman.
[www.wonkette.com]
Seriously, this could be a great joint Jezebel-Wonkette venture. What with all the comments on the Face-Booking and the My-Spacing Wonkette's already chronicled.
NOOOO not Laura Sessions Stepp. Ugh. Don't get me started.
what is described above is still very much rape, not just a regrettable drunken night. I have had many regrettable sexual encounters, but I have also been assaulted, and there is a big difference. Both men and women need to understand this. Men cannot take advantage of intoxicated women, and in the story above, the woman is clearly indicating she does not want to have sex. When the guy continues, that is most definitely rape. If the woman does not give actual consent that is rape. There's no two ways about it.
it is my understanding that if a woman is drunk, she is unable to truly consent to sex in some states. obv if you are passed out, that is not consent. but like you Moe, i looked at it as one regrettable night and just avoided that fraternity for the next 3 years.
@Jezebelmoe: Pathetic is really not a horrible enough word to describe what that is.
This is why comprehensive, frank, honest sex ed is an absolute necessity. Not only to kids and young adults need to learn the facts about their bodies, they need to know the meaning of CONSENT. They need to know how to deal with potential sexual partners. Apparently, they need to be told what is and what is not rape.
@Jezebelmoe: I am saying it was rape. Definitely.
@SarahMC: er OK I replied to moe with comment meant for you Sarah, so here is Moe's -- It is the most tool like pathetic sad loser thing a guy can do, IMO. Way to be a stud man, fuck a passed out girl.
Same thing happened to one of my close friends on NYE, she kept saying no while drifting in and out of drunken sleep, and then the guy got up and left! Then refused contact with her when she went to confront him about what he did to her. She was never promiscuous (not that has anything to do with the horror of rape) but now, she won't admit it was rape though, I can only imagine how hard it is to admit something like that, she felt like it was her fault for drinking too much. Personally, no matter how many jager shots involved, (to be cliché) no is no, and it's sad that in today's day in age we are still dissecting what rape is in forms of technicalities.
The Mike and Juliet show did a segment about this story. Check out: [www.mandjshow.com]
Beatrice Kiddo's revenge on all their houses.
I was a virgin who woke up after a night I couldn't remember, bleeding in the bed of a boy I barely knew. I defy anyone to say that having sex with a passed-out drunk girl isn't rape, and I'm incensed that Moe would suggest otherwise.
It's actually a bit alarming that we would have to teach anyone that having or attempting to have sex with someone who is unconscious is a CRIME! Guys who do this are much more than tools, and I think some people are letting them off lightly, perhaps because of the thinking that the girl is "asking" for it by becoming drunk in the first place?
This is insanity. Theres being drunk and fucking anyways. Then theres saying no and passing out.
@CumaeanSibyl: You couldn't... because a man would stop thinking at the word "sex". They don't care if it's boring, awkward, dry... they just want it in any way, shape or form. Why do you think they buy us drinks? To get us drunk so we won't resist their sexual advances. Try turning down drink offers all night, or sticking to soda or water, and see what guy wants your number...
If you say no to sex and the person just goes ahead and has sex with you anyway, I think that counts as rape. How else can you define it?
@funnyface: I didn't interpret it as Moe saying it was otherwise, just that she chose to assimilate her experience as otherwise which is self defense. I did the same thing at 18, didn't fully admit it all until years later.
It is rape, but one that wouldn't hold up in court. So what do we do? Try to forget about it, I guess.
@sunny12: to me a guy doing that is just "asking" to be castrated.
And really, I found this article disgusting. Yes, most of us have been to parties where we've had too much to drink. Most of us have hooked up with people we wouldn't have or shouldn't have if we weren't drunk, but rape is rape. If you're incapable of consenting (under age or yes, too drunk) it's rape.
Not only is it rape, but by advocating the idea of "gray" rape, they're making it even easier for those bastards to rationalize that it's not a crime because she was drunk or she said yes to some kinds of sexual contact before she said no. It's hard enough to prosecute rapists as it is, let alone when you start blurring out parts of the definition and saying, "oh, well, that's okay." No. Rape is rape. If you're drunk, sober, married, promiscuous, sleepwalking, whatever. And rapists should be strung up by their balls until dead.
@socalsnarkstress: Well, yes, technically it was, but I can empathize with the desire to find a word to differentiate it from the type of rape that, you know, actually SCARS you. I always used "date rape" before.
A woman who drinks too much is no more asking to be raped than a woman who wears a short skirt or walks down a dark alley. You say "no", and he does it anyway? That is rape, plain and simple.
It's the last sentence in particular that I'm a bit horrified by--I'm glad that Moe has dealt with that incident, but implying that if you feel really traumatized by date rape, it's because you put too much stock in your rapist's opinion of you is...yeah, horrifying is the word I'd use.
Fuck Cosmo for muddying the waters even more with another bullshit term for something as easily classifiable as r-a-p-e.
Rape: 1. the unlawful compelling of a woman through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse.
2. any act of sexual intercourse that is forced upon a person
Not to sound preachy or anything, but this is precisely why I don't ever have more than 2 drinks when I go out. I'm so ridiculously, irrationally afraid of something like this happening to me that it makes me an uptight teetotaler. And I really hate that about myself. I hate that I can't cut loose anywhere but inside my own apartment.
I also really hate and resent the fact that I HAVE to be afraid of things like this. I hate that, unlike a guy, I can't do as I please without having to fear for my bodily integrity. Among other things.
The interesting thing about the Cosmo article (<--statistically improbable phrase alert) was the guy's perspective--the quotes from guys saying things like they're afraid to have sex with a girl if she said no at first and changed her mind, in case she doesn't remember changing it. Exactly what guys should be thinking about, and clearly not the same as Moe's experience, but interesting nonetheless.
I also think we'd have less of that problem if more women felt comfortable saying to themselves both "Well, yes, I might fuck a stranger tonight and I'm comfortable with that" and "I can assume that this guy will still like me and want to be with me if we don't screw tonight."
hence, less needing to get drunk for flings, less worrisome mind-changing.
@sunny12: Yeah, it seems like guys are only interested in "what's rape" so they can get away with as much as possible without technically breaking the law.
Yup. When it happened to my good friend, I made her stand up for herself and get support and all that good stuff. When it happened to me, I blocked it out and told myself that it wasn't a big deal. Reading this entry fifteen years later...oh, definitely a big deal. I feel sick to my stomach.
I had a very similiar experience freshman year of college, except I was so drunk, that when I awoke to unexpected movement on top of me, I threw up all over him and his bed. He basically had to lift me to his roomate's bed and clean house (I think).
After that, when he approached me like we were friends, or dating, I got angry and explained the meaning of date rape and expulsion to him. He was so scared that I wouldn't be surprised if the lil weasel never had a date in that school again.
All in all, I'd have to say it's definitely more of a funny story than a traumatic one for me personally. But there's no doubt his actions were totally objectionable.
Laura Session Stepp clearly wants to promote this notion of "gray rape" because, as an anti-feminist conservative, she thinks women who leave their houses for a good time sorta deserve it.
But... what kind of an asshole would want to have sex with an unconscious person?
Literally, what is the point? Like... a rapist may get off on it because they are dominating the persons and forcing them and all that, but... a passed out girl? Snore.
This happened to a good friend of mine.
"Grey rape"= justification for the unjustifiable.
That's rape. What a schmuck. Unfortunately, yes, it'd be hard to prove.
Nothing entitles someone (f*ck "someone", let's just say guy) to sex with a woman if she says no or is otherwise incapacitated and incapable of consent; she may be falling-down drunk; it's still violating someone.
That said, this is one more reason I'm disturbed my friends EVER drink so much they all but black out, effectively choosing to incapacitate themselves chemically. Again, nothing entitles someone to take advantage of them, but it's still stupid...shouldn't there be a median between "got a buzz" and "puking on my shoes, can't see straight" drunk?
There are a lot of sick f*cks out there...that's a disincentive to drink to the point of blacking out.
@Meanmllemustard: Sigh. It's a personal story, and that's how I dealt. A sequel to come I suppose.
@sheistolerable: Interestingly, that's sort of the strategy I have since adopted.
I think the whole gray rape thing is bullshit, but I also think that the term rape and date rape is a very powerful word. And attributed with enough meaning on a personal and social level can produce some tough consequences. To me, inventing a new term such as grey rape seems like an attempt to protect the woman from feeling like a victim. Because openly identifying yourself as a date rape victim is traumatizing in itself. And a lot of people (Alice Sebold, I am looking at you) are more than ready to jump into the victim pool and characterize their whole life by it. So I am inclined to agree with Moe (albeit after months of therapy) that getting over the situation and regaining power by not placing the power on the rapist. But unfortunately not all of us can be this psychologically healthy (again, Alice Sebold, do you have to spend 30 years of your life reliving one night) and move on.
@AmericanPsychocat:
To me, that's the really sad thing about it. If you press charges, odds are it'll be a time consuming and expensive, your name and reputation will be slandered to high heavens, and he stands a good chance of getting off in the end.
It's so perverse, that men have this idea that so many rape charges are bullshit, and the system is on the woman's side, but the rate of reporting is so low and false convictions (Duke aside) are almost unheard of.
Its not rape! You GO MOE!!
I think you took control of your emotions and you were a strong woman - you realized this guy was a douch and you were stable enough (even when drunk) to take control (roll over and go to sleep). On top of that you called his ass on it in the A.M.
I personally feel that 'No' does not mean 'No' during the commission of drunken dry humping or while grabbing the hairs on some guys bare ass.
Disclaimer: The above opinion is void in cases of violence or unathorized restraint