Jezebel

Speaking of which, thanks for the baptism, Mom and Dad!

Oh for chrissakes. I've taken communion at weddings and funerals and shit and I'm not even Catholic!

It's because he's the Emperor. I'm serious. Check the eyes.

Being a pro-choice Catholic is my own personal little way of telling them to shove it. What are they going to do, excommunicate me? Bah. They're going to have to face it: people aren't scared of them anymore.

This pisses me off so bad. Its no one's business besides the person and god whether or not they take communion, so butt the hell out everyone else.

There was a time when the American Catholic Church was a progressive organization working for social justice. It's something I read about as history.

papa ratzi's got nothin' better to do?

@Lymed: Seriously. What about all the politicians who aren't doing anything to help the poor or end this unjust war?

@PinkSoxHat: Haha: the idea that anything is "no one's business besides the person and god" is pretty much as antithetical to Catholicism as you can get. Anyone talking about a "personal relationship" with God is kind of a Protestant sympathizer whether he/she admits it or not!

@J.D.Regent: yo i have no idea how i just posted that picture. bene-dick, get out of my computer!

@Notes from the underwhelmed:

I refuse to take communion. I go as far as getting up and sitting down when the priest tells me to at a wedding, but that is where I draw the line. I don't repeat "in the name of the father, the son, and the holy ghost" or "amen" or raise my hand all Hitler-like either (seriously, what is it with the hand that only some priests do that?)

I was baptized but that was it. Never set foot in a Catholic church, or any church, again unless they got some baroque alfrescos I wanna check out.

@Lymed:

Seriously, we need some more outspoken upstarts like Dorothy Day (I have mad admiration for her and I'm agnostic).

@Notes from the underwhelmed: I took communion the one time I went to church (15 years ago) and didn't know until a few days ago that that's a big no-no if you're not Catholic. Somebody should have spoken up, how would I have known that?

@BabyfaceStanwyck: i feel so conflicted about her, she's one of my heros for sure and i used to live in a catholic worker community, but she was also always harping on obedience. oh yeah and she was one of those women who had an abortion and later became pro life. Mildly irritating.

@TrixieBelden: we're really more about silent judging.

@J.D.Regent: Pics seem to attach if there's one in the attached article, you can choose to unattach it. No need to exorcise your computer.

I was discussing this in the context of Rudy Guiliani this morning. It's kind of insidious b/c the communion thing outed me as an ex catholic to my aunt at my cousin's wedding.

@J.D.Regent: She's using computerpicturepasting magic! Burn the witch!

@Jan74: See...its shinangigans like this that keep people away from religion. I dont agree with some policies... but that does not mean I am gonna stop believing in God.

I am accusing you of doing that btw...just making a statement.

@arodriguez.romero: wow, you're so principled. i could give up the church, but the cannibalism? nah.

@Jan74: Eh, I get hungry.

@J.D.Regent:

Yeah, I feel conflicted about her as well for many reasons, but I respect her for the fact that she was unabashedly human with her (many) faults. She didn't try to portray herself as a saint (haha, cause now people want to make her one).

That said, the boozy socialist feminist abortion-getting Dorothy would have made an awesome Jezebel.

@Her_royal_Highness: sorry I meant I am NOT accusing you...

@Jan74: Oh, and especially after all the aerobics. Up! Down! Up! Down! You work up an appetite.

@J.D.Regent: hahaha. Mb another thread will come up and you can tell us about the catholic worker community. I would love to hear about it.

@Notes from the underwhelmed: I dont see how the wafer would be filling...

when i was 9 i went to Catholic school as a non-Catholic, because my 'rents thought public schools in Hawaii were bad.. i went to mass once a week and remember being told by a teacher that i couldnt take communion. when i was 9! i feel like they shouldve just let me do it and think my 9 year old sins were absolved..

@Her_royal_Highness: It's food, it's free, I'll take it.

@Her_royal_Highness: Ya gotta have it with the wine.

@Lymed: Well, out here (AZ) the local diocese is speaking out in support of immigrants. Church leaders are practically the only non-Latinos consistently speaking out in opposition to the xenophobic anti-illegal nuts.

@TrixieBelden: They used to have on the back of missals that non-Catholics couldn't take communion. It personally makes me a little uncomfortable when non-Catholics (especially those who know the rules and choose to ignore them) take communion because it is a HUGE deal to Catholics since it is considered the real body and blood of Christ and Protestants don't roll that way. On the other hand most of the Catholics I know aren't even aware of that.

@Jamie Sommers: Yeah, but the Catholic church has a pretty huge vested interest (no pun intended) in Latinos in America! I wouldn't exactly talk about them as disinterested "non-Latinos" operating purely on a moral level; that has everything to do with the future of the church here.

Thank dog I'm an atheist. I can have my abortions, kill some rapists, and sleep in on Sunday mornings, all totally guilt free.

@Lymed: The Church is still progressive in some ways. I mean, besides the Catholic Worker movement, Catholic Releif Services is one of the largest charities in the world, usually one of the first to respond to natural catastrophes and the last to lead. The church supports the rights of death row in mates, they operate numerous charitable causes, and they run many schools at a much lower cost than their private anglican counterparts. They still emphasize service as one of the highest forms of worship.

That being said, I always thought that htis "denying communion" business was f*ed up. For one thing, as the article points out, it's not consistently applied to death penalty supporters. And for another, the church just shouldn't reach its arm in like that, it's not their place anymore. I'm pro-life, Catholic, and I take communion every sunday and if that means I'm violating Roman policy or going to hell, well, so be it.

Whoops, and by pro-life I meant pro-choice!

@Erie: Yeah... I think the same. I think having communion as a non-Catholic when you KNOW its wrong is a mockery.

Its called respect...it should be applied in any/all circumstances

@gerbilsoutofexile (loves a good muumuu): I love sleeping in on Sunday mornings when my family is going to church.

I really REALLY don't love the church's stance on condom usage. I guess one of the priests issued a recent statement saying it was okay to use condoms in a marriage where one partner has AIDS because couples shouldn't necessarily have to abstain from marital relations. But, in general, it's still discouraged, AIDS or no. I guess getting AIDS is God's punishment for sex outside marriage?

@J.D.Regent: I appreciate your clarification, but according to the article:

At first, on April 30, archdiocese spokeswoman Susan Gibbs denied that Mr. Kennedy had partaken, saying such a scenario "wouldn't be possible."

It's not totally clear why she says this, though. It could be because of Kennedy's pro-choice stance, or because the "scenario" of running a wafer out to him isn't usual, or some other factor (I'm not Catholic, and kind of clueless).

@govgurl2009: always just seemed wrong to me that something called communion should be exclusionary.

@Glaven: i took her statement to mean the scenario of running him the wafer. it looks like a statement taken way out of context which is par for the course for the Times.

Sweet Mother of Jesus, WHAT am I doing defending the Archdiocese of Washington? I need a fourth glass of wine.

And crap like this is why I now sleep in on Sundays. Well, that and the fact that it's a moral sin for me to take said communion since I married a divorced man.

Blargh...

mortal, not moral...

I was raised Catholic and no longer go to Church for a number of reasons but one (among many...some of which just have to do with the fact that its one less chore on Sunday, but that's my problem) is that the issues I am most passionate about are those that put in opposition with the Church...ha, including the ones that have nothing to do with doctrine. (Abuse of power to get away with diddling kids or covering up the diddling? I never understood why the hell it blew up in 2002 when its been going on for so long....not that it's just the Catholics).

I love how they leave war and indifference to other matters in the "culture of life" to the "discretion" of worldly leaders, but this--nope.

George Bush the morally incompetent piece of shit is blessed for his idiotic views on all family planning (even in countries where AIDS and patriarchal abuse of women are rampant--good idea!), and given a free pass for playing fast and loose with finite blood and treasure.

Makes me sick in a way words can't express because I have to correlate THAT--and impotent rage at moral hypocrites in the here-and-now--with the fear that THEY'LL be rewarded in the afterlife too (or at least, that I'll be punished for not voting the way my mother does--for the anti-abortion guy!). Even with my sneaking inescapable belief that I'm going to be damned somehow--how can I pledge my loyalty or waste my tears and frustration for this organization?

dude catholicism is one big pile of poop - one half of my family are hardcore old school catholics (read: least christian people alive)

it really pissed me off when el popo came to town and the catholic church in NYC was on the local news explaining how they had to flog crappy popemobillia to the flock in order to pay for padre's security costs - i thought ... hold on dont these guys own half of downtown? cheap gits

Christ. I lived in Lancaster for 5 years. Most of the people from there are this kind of pathetic insular Christian. Bleh.

@nothanks: saying Catholicism is shit because of a corrupt few is harsh. The Catholic institution is DIFFERENT from the Catholic religion.

One of the major issues with this is that Guiliani (who also took communion) had a prior agreement with the Cardinal in NY that he wouldn't accept communion. Not only is he pro-choice, he's also on his third marriage and his second was never annulled. He gave his word to the local Catholic authorities that he wouldn't put them in this position. And then he did.

As for Kennedy, his Catholicism has always seemed like a shtick anyway. Whether you agree or not, if you were invited to a major event like this you should respect the rules of your hosts.

And technically you're not supposed to take communion if you missed even one Sunday mass without going to Confession.

Didn't we already go through this with Giuliani and Cardinal Egan? At any rate, the Pope in question gave Giuliani communion--and if it was really so very very important, why didn't the good Lord strike one of them dead?

I've been a Catholic all of my life and been in a Catholic school for most of it but this is one of the major reasons I hate the church (aside from the patriarchy shit). I go to church on a regular basis and I tell people I'm pro-choice. There is something deeply hypocritical about the Catholic Church because while it preaches that no one has the right to judge, you'll get your ass judged off just because of your views on one subject. It's utter bullshit! I've even been judged by a bishop and had my faith called into question just because of my views and because I'm a bohemian...but this is another story for another day.

*It may sound a bit ironic that I'm still a Catholic even though I hate the church sometimes but I still go to church because I believe in the basics of the faith. I disagree on a lot of the church's views on social and current issues though.

@Her_royal_Highness:

Oh if I did believe I'd be in the Church, trying to change it. But I'm a godless heathen, always been one. At age 3 I looked at my aunt and just went "You know, I don't believe in god. I don't believe in something I can't see". So I didn't choose to be a Catholic because I'm an all-or-nothing type of person; I'd never do confirmation and first communion and all that stuff like my husband did, and then never set foot in a church again. He says he is Catholic, but he doesn't practice it.

That said, I support the work that some of the Church does. I'm down with the Theology of Freedom, Theology of Hope, and Social Gospel cause I'm a commie pinko at heart.

@Her_royal_Highness: I wish I could see it that way. There's always that pesky issue of papal infallibility and submission to absolute authority, and as the institution basically controls the religion that way, my bisexual sinning self is not getting much enjoyment out of it.

True story - At my beloved Grandfather's Catholic funeral mass, when it came time for communion, one of my Grandpa's best friends (who was Jewish) got in line to receive the host, as did everyone in attendance. The priest, who knew this wonderful man said the "this is the body of Christ, who I remind you all was a Jew". The Best Friend's face was priceless.

I will always love the priest for that reminder!!!!!

the history teacher in me says that technically it's more like 1400 years, not 2000. the drunk in me says "MEH. i'm not even catholic." ok.