While I completely agree, Katherine Hamnett might want to try coming off as less racist when complaining about racism.

I love that it's a zero-sum game here--that SOMEBODY has to be ugly, whether black girls or white girls. My mom always maintained that the fashion industry was run by people who hate women. Now I think she was right!

@chelotoyou: You stole my comment! Actually, I was afraid to say it first because I didn't want to be accused of "racism."

". I have no idea why when it's obvious that black girls are just so genuinely much more beautiful than Caucasians, who have clearly got the short straw.""

Um... what? I don't think that statement is valid in either direction.

Truth be told, I wish the conversation was not so focused on black models. What about Asian models? Latin? Middle Eastern?

@chelotoyou: So agreed. Reversing the critique isn't going to push forward a resolution.

@golddigger: Yes.

And, honestly, when taking either group of people and talking about whether one group is more beautiful than the other makes racist assumptions about both groups. Dig?

Er...it's one thing to compliment the beauty of black women and quite another to insult white women in the process. Can't we all be beautiful?

@chelotoyou: You speak the truth.

Maybe it's just me, but 95% of the time I don't understand anything about the fasion industry and its models anyway.

Honestly, I'm not surprised. Modeling is a world of idiotic, idealized beauty -- ie, white skinny people. Anyone outside those guidelines (Black, Indian, Chicano, or overweight) is a rarity.

What Katherine Hamnett said is very extreme. There is beauty in all races! As a black woman, I am appreciative of the love. But you don't have to undervalue one group to appreciate another!

@glamzonhobbitfeet: Word. Nicely put.

I wouldn't go as far as calling most of the catwalk waifs "dogs", but I've seen some models on those runways that have no damn business modeling. If I were one of these gorgeous, out-of-work Black models, I'd be pretty incensed about it, too. So I'm'a let Hamnett's comments slide, on account of how she's probably been choking back her opinions and her outrage for some time.

I think it's sort of awesomely in-your-face, though. Credit for boldness.

PMM needs to refuse to work with people who ask for "no ethnics," and so do all the other agencies. But no, the agencies blame the design houses, the designers blame the consumers, the consumers blame the media. Just once, for the love of crap, can I read about someone accepting responsibility in a troubled industry?

@linkura: Haha - actually, I was trying to see if I could fit the "r" word in another two or three times. Darn my short straw!

@Archetype: Ditto on your point!

@BiscuitDoughJones: I'm wondering if maybe the quote was slightly out of context?

@SFO: You are so right. It doesn't make them any better than the companies requesting no ethnic models.

Um, how about a dash of hypocrisy with your cup of racism, madam?

maybe the only six foot tall anorexics around right now are white?

OK, she was totes out of line and silly, but I do know a photographer who loves how black women photograph. He thinks they photograph so much better than white women most of the time. I tease him about his crush on Alex Wek (or Alek?) whose name I am surely misspelling.

@lalaland13: I don't think it's the photographers. It's it's the line, or the designer, or the head of marketing. Whoever is calling the shots.

@Archetype: Was I going to say that. Asians and Latinos typically get left out of the discussion as if they don't count as "people of color."

@ihateyourescalade: Yep, that's the ongoing theory.

@Dashrashi: Would you give her "credit for boldness" if she was saying this about black women? Come on, now.

Yes, there is clearly racism in the fashion industry... but the fashion industry is a rather specific and cruel industry that promotes all kinds of violence against women in the first place. I could think of a few other places where we could worry about the presence of black women that would be less exploitative to black women and women in general, like where do we see black women represented politically for instance? But then I realize this blog is geared towards the fashion industry and that's cool too.

It's bizarre to me that someone commenting on the unfairness of choosing one race over the other might come off as preferential to one race over the other. As an Asian woman, I wouldn't mind seeing more ethnicity on runways and in ads. But I know in a lot of places, "white" is status quo, regardless of where the women are from...after all, "white" as a description can mean Heidi Klum or Gisele Bundchen, and they're from different continents. But anyone who is not descriptively white is immediately placed in the "other" category, and I'm waiting for an Asian woman other than Kimora Lee Simmons to show up on a runway.

Black models are an endangered species. Found only in the darkest corners of the world of media and at Sean John shows. Occasionally, they can be found in multi-cultural packs, with Latina and Asian models at Baby Phat shows. Rarely seen, they quietly stalk the empty runways pleading for equal representation. Their only enemies are vapid talent recruiters who puff cigs while screaming "NO ETHNICS". Thankfully, Rocawear and Apple Bottoms have taken on the gargantuan task of employing and thereby insuring the survival of these increasingly rare creatures as their proponents appeal to the fashion world to pay heed to their plight.

@golddigger: No, I wouldn't. But the schadenfreude enthusiast in me likes a little reverse discrimination now and then. See how the other side lives and all that.

I'm just not too worried about white women thinking they're not beautiful as a class. Individually, sure. But as a group, I think society does okay propping up the self-esteem of Caucasian, y'know, fashion models.

@UPSETPANDA

Well there's Hye Park and Ai Tominaga. Kimora is actually half Black and Asian like token model of color of the moment, Chanel Iman.

That Hamnett quote is so ridiculous. The point should be, that beauty is not based on color,yet by excluding women of color, as of late, the industry only perpetuates the stereotype. Oddly enough, I always thought that the fashion industry was pretty diverse in its inclusion of African beauty (Oluchi, Chanel Iman, Alek Wek, Naomi, Veronica Webb, etc.), when they do cast women of African descent in their shows. The Black models that do get cast aren't always light skinned, which is more than you can say for media outlets created or controlled by actual blacks, i.e. music media, where the girls in the rap and r&b videos are more often than not, fair skinned or mixed race looking. To think that "racist" whites are more progressive than a lot of blacks in the media (see that one post about Michelle Obama being a lighter shade of trophy wife)is not without irony.

I had a feeling that Jourdan Dunn was probably British. She looks West Indian.

not excusing the woman's comments, but this brings up some interesting ideas about what is considered beauty. i am much more appalled that a company explicitly asks for "no ethnics", thereby lumping all non-"white" women into a category of other. that is more racially charged to me.

when i pored over my mother's fashion magazines, and my teen rags (sassy, ym, seventeen) i almost never saw photo spreads featuring so-called "ethnics". while there is some marked improvements since then, this makes me sad and angry at the same time. let's all buy the alex wek cover in may!

I think the "white dogs" Hamnet is talking about are the models that are placed on the catwalk simply because they are BLONDE and BLUE-EYED. While black models who have PRETTY FACES aren't used simply because they're BLACK.

Check out style.com and to see what I mean.

You can also look through some of the model profiles on nymag.com.

Hmmm, I wonder what model Tanya Dziahileva is "KNOWN FOR" :

[nymag.com]

I do not think she genuinely believes that black women are prettier than white women. I think she is upset about this blonde and blue-eyed phenomenon.

Why can't I see comments?!

Ahh, I can see comments now...after I commented on why I can't see them.

@littlemisschatterbox: "I have no idea why when it's obvious that black girls are just so genuinely much more beautiful than Caucasians, who have clearly got the short straw."

I think she was pretty clear!

But, perhaps letting her anger get the best of her.

All this talk of Katherine Hamnett's racism is a bit.....off, maybe? Racism to me implies something more institutionalized and oppressive than a white woman saying some stupid shit about white women in comparison to black women. White women were/are not an oppressed class. But "reverse racism?" I don't think so. We'll call it reverse racism when "ethnic" people conquer/colonize "white" people and treat them like second-class citizens.

We're so quick to point and yell "racist" that we've become numb to actual racism as opposed to simple bigotry and prejudice.

Not that I don't agree with y'all that the fashion industry is fucked up. Not using "ethnic" women and perpetuating "western" beauty ideal: racism. Saying black women are more "beautiful" than "white" women: not racism.

Katherine Hamnett does not care about white people. Omigod, I've always wanted to say that.

Okay, so I know her statement was racist against white women and that's totally not right; I get it. However, she's dismissing white women in thought and word only. While the industry she's shit-talking is discriminating and marginalizing people of color in reality. It sucks that white chicks are made to feel shitty by this ONE comment, but trust, it sucks more when the society that you live in consistently rejects you. It sucks to pick up magazines that do not have a single person of color; it sucks to watch commercials that normalize white culture; it sucks to know that your "brand" of beauty is not "in" this season; it sucks to be told that you are not beautiful. This happens to women of color every day. It happens so much that it is not news. It happens so much that many accept it as "just the way it is" Little black girls are told all the time that they are not beautiful. Everytime they look out to a world that does not reflect them, they are taught this. So, whatevs...she made one shitty comment.

@ulookinatmyjunk: I agree. Though not with the racist towards white women part. But yes, in terms of the bigger picture and what people of color have to go through every single day...What this Katherine chick said is not in any way going to endanger the status of white models in the industry or white women in society.

I do see some part of hamnett says because when i watch half of those fashion shows i sit there going my god she should not be up there! But as many people on this wall have said we have to think about other ethnicities that have little to no representation as models. At least there are black models there, there are very few asian models and really i havent seen a full arab or middle eastern model!
I think the main point here is that there are beautiful women from every race and saying that one race is more beautiful than another isn't helping anyone!

@Rrose_Selavy: AMEN. i was a bit disturbed by some of the comments. sure her comment may have been discriminatory, but so is the industry she is commenting on. racism applies to oppressed groups. that's like claiming sexism towards men. it doesn't happen.

@ulookinatmyjunk: :)

@Rrose_Selavy: Thank you for saying that.

"racism applies to oppressed groups. that's like claiming sexism towards men. it doesn't happen."

Say what?

@Rrose_Selavy: FWIW, I've found that racism is basically the notion that people are the way they are (good or bad) because of their "race" and therefore they ought to be judged and treated accordingly.

@Rrose_Selavy: Yes.

@Wandie: No.

@uhoh-ohno: There's only flaw with your statement- the time factor. About 10-20 years ago there were plenty of black women on catwalks. Pretty much all of thise women you named are from the supermodel era- they're not on catwalks anymore.

@Rrose_Selavy: Thank you for posting that!

@Cam/ron: I'm curious to hear some examples. And I'm not being snarky.

to be clear, i meant sexism DIRECTED at men, as in women being "sexist" against men. the phrasing was a little amiguous.

@tie_me_up

I don't understand your criticism. I said that WHEN models of African descent are cast in fashion shows, those models tend to be very ethnic looking, not always the fair skinned/mixed race looking ideal that's often perpetuated in hip-hop and r&b videos. Yasmine Warsame, Januel McKenzie, Hollis Wakeema, Jourdan Dunn, Liya Kibede, Chanel Iman etc., run the gamut in terms of different interpretations of black beauty. Georgie Badiel, a dark skinned model from Burkina Faso, just walked for Marc Jacobs Fall 2008 show, but you'd be hard pressed to find someone who looks like her as the "featured girl" in a Chris Brown video.

@uhoh-ohno: "To think that "racist" whites are more progressive than a lot of blacks i